Okay but what if we put down the nerf gun

[Cats_On_Fire]

Okay so I know a lot of you think characters are getting too powerful. But what if we simply put the nerf gun down. And actually start thinking. I know you all believe most characters are overpowered. So here's a simple proposed change, we simply reduce the base to cinders every season ensuring thriving is impossible. But that's a horrible idea. So instead of full reworks, because that's really stressful on the devs, I think we should work on making the existing skilltrees better and or slightly nerfing Willow. For example removing the planar damage from lunar flames bringing it down to a much more reasonable 350 damage equivalent to a 7 hits with a hambat and locking her in place. Wilson should receive more transmutations and have his torch tree instead apply to all light sources including magilumineces, start callers staffs and others. Wolf gang needs more depth give him a couple bonus for farming or some other activity to push him to do said activity. I know character balance divides you all but I think we have to foucs on working with what we have before trying to run full overhauls for every character. Also we need more environment,caves, and ocean update before we can really focus on characters. From your resident wickerbottom 

[paodocevoante1]

25 minutes ago, Cats_On_Fire said:

Okay so I know a lot of you think characters are getting too powerful. But what if we simply put the nerf gun down. And actually start thinking. I know you all believe most characters are overpowered. So here's a simple proposed change, we simply reduce the base to cinders every season ensuring thriving is impossible. But that's a horrible idea. So instead of full reworks, because that's really stressful on the devs, I think we should work on making the existing skilltrees better and or slightly nerfing Willow. For example removing the planar damage from lunar flames bringing it down to a much more reasonable 350 damage equivalent to a 7 hits with a hambat and locking her in place. Wilson should receive more transmutations and have his torch tree instead apply to all light sources including magilumineces, start callers staffs and others. Wolf gang needs more depth give him a couple bonus for farming or some other activity to push him to do said activity. I know character balance divides you all but I think we have to foucs on working with what we have before trying to run full overhauls for every character. Also we need more environment,caves, and ocean update before we can really focus on characters. From your resident wickerbottom 

Someone correct me if I'm talking nonsense, but I've noticed that Klei rarely nerfs any character after he receives an update that benefits the character, so these nerf requests always feel like they're talking to a wall

[dst_lover]

Some times I just went my character to get nerf and that is okey 

i love wurt and Wolfgang and Maxwell but I actually went them to have more downside and I went wurt to be balanced again with his shadow affinity and other skill tree making him too much powerful 

[Cats_On_Fire]

38 minutes ago, dst_lover said:

Some times I just went my character to get nerf and that is okey 

i love wurt and Wolfgang and Maxwell but I actually went them to have more downside and I went wurt to be balanced again with his shadow affinity and other skill tree making him too much powerful 

That's fair. But like is the game getting easier or have you just gotten better and more resourceful 

[GetNerfedOn]

get nerfed on

[dst_lover]

10 minutes ago, Cats_On_Fire said:

That's fair. But like is the game getting easier or have you just gotten better and more resourceful 

Both

[Cats_On_Fire]

17 minutes ago, dst_lover said:

Both

So true

[DegenerateFurry]

Don't nerf characters, just effectively allow players to control the difficulty by adding mob health/boss HP options in the world settings. You could either nerf down the health of raid bosses or increase it if you feel like you want the fight to be longer as powerful characters like Wolfgang/with a group of friends. I'm imagining a mob health slider that goes from 25% to 500% (options being 25%, 50%, 100%, 200%, 300%, 400%, 500%), defaulting to 100% (their current values), and a similar raid boss health slider.

[Cats_On_Fire]

Chill the hell out

Games fine your just godly good

36 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

Ah yes, it's your fault that you aren't FORCING the game from a series that's famously known to be very hard to be that hard.

why should klei balance or even add in anything at all at this point, just let the modders do it.

And then once again my point will remain uncontested.

 

[Well-met]

klei doesn't nerf characters idk where you're seeing this "nerf gun"

[Mike23Ua]

I’m a Wendy Main, and Wendy needs a Nerf.. but she also needs a much less boring Skill tree too beyond just “buff what Abigail already did.”

Why does Wendy need a nerf you ask? Because she can spawn into the game, tap the summon prompt and spawn Abigail that quickly to start reaping rewards..

Theres no resource cost, despite the character having her own exclusive “Sisturn” that requires placing flower petals into.. to power up, you can literally play the entire game without ever building or putting flowers into a Sisturn.

And comparing her to Willow when Bernie has a durability meter, takes damage and gets destroyed Needing to either be repaired with a sewing kit or crafting a new Bernie (both of which requires you to go out and gather more resources)

Wendy on the other hand despite having her entire playstyle revolve around doing fetch quests for Pipspook to obtain her own exclusive currency “Mourning Glories” are only used to craft “Ectoherbology Potions”.

Potions that can on be applied onto Abigail and only one potion at any given time so no you can’t have higher damage or health regeneration and also have her shield potion applied.

Out of all those potions.. and the useless mourning glory we can collect to craft them that we end up having a over abundance supply of (and I’m saying this not even taking into account her Beta Skill Tree which will increase the amount of them you can obtain) you’d think Klei would have gotten at least a little bit creative with our useage of the Mourning Glories…

Like I don’t know… if Willows Bernie can be destroyed needing repair with a sewing kit, (Aka falls to the ground and dies in whatever spot it was killed in) maybe when we get Abigail killed we would’ve needed to like Bernie run over to the dropped flower & pour a special Ectoherbology potion onto her flower to wake Abigail back up?

This would at least had given a consistent use to the mourning glory resource…

And after reading this post I just typed out, no WONDER I stopped playing Wendy as much and gravitated instead to becoming more of a Willow main…

All of the core “Wendy-like” features I enjoyed about Pre-Rework Wendy (when Abigail’s flower use to drop to the ground in the spot she died in) WILLOW now does that…

Willow also has her own cool perks of Fire Immunity, a lighter that can suck up fires, and oh yes what am I missing?

A CONSISTENT Use for her exclusive “Ember” Resource.

I think I prove my point that Willow became Wendy 2.0, and Wendy’s Beta skill tree doesn’t make me want to go back to Wendy.

[Evelo]

I like nerfs. It shakes things up. I prefer to feel like I am overcoming a great challenge than feel like a god. Sure the power trip can be fun but it is fun for a lot shorter period of time than starting from nothing.

[DegenerateFurry]

1 hour ago, SSneaky said:

Ah yes, it's your fault that you aren't FORCING the game from a series that's famously known to be very hard to be that hard.

why should klei balance or even add in anything at all at this point, just let the modders do it.

And then once again my point will remain uncontested.

I didn't say anything about mods, dude. I suggested them adding difficulty-related settings to world creation to allow for the adjustment of health values. Did you read someone else's post and quote mine by mistake?

[benfroyobro9381]

That should honestly be one of their last priorities and I doubt a majority of the playerbase would want this. Veterans and ppl who want more challenge could very well be a vocal minority on the forums but don't reflect the general playerbase. But as a long time player, I can't say this would be a good use of Klei's time and resources over fun content updates and skill trees. Maybe a slider in the settings to increase difficulty like how they allowed players to reduce certain damage types but I can't see it being in Klei's best interest to do something like that for a major content update. 

[Cats_On_Fire]

22 minutes ago, benfroyobro9381 said:

That should honestly be one of their last priorities and I doubt a majority of the playerbase would want this. Veterans and ppl who want more challenge could very well be a vocal minority on the forums but don't reflect the general playerbase. But as a long time player, I can't say this would be a good use of Klei's time and resources over fun content updates and skill trees. Maybe a slider in the settings to increase difficulty like how they allowed players to reduce certain damage types but I can't see it being in Klei's best interest to do something like that for a major content update.

Like to appease the playerbase at this point I swear I need to put forth a change like setting everyone's hp to 75 and then 15 for Max. And giving everyone a -50% damage nerf. Instead of actually brainstorming decent ideas

[DegenerateFurry]

51 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

Still remains the fact that people can just, ignore changongnwork settings.

Or know know what's in world settings.

So again my points uncontested.

Yeah, people being able to choose whether or not they want to change the world settings is the point of putting it in world settings. The people who want it to be easier can have it be easier, the people who want it to stay as it is don't experience a change, and the people who want it to be harder can have it be harder. Literally the objective best option for most bosses.

I don't know what point you're even trying to make.

[Cats_On_Fire]

53 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

Still remains the fact that people can just, ignore changongnwork settings.

Or know know what's in world settings.

So again my points uncontested.

What do you want me to do, give the moon a gun and have your areas constantly be hit with metors while your playing the game

[erick was right]

4 hours ago, SSneaky said:

Ah yes, it's your fault that you aren't FORCING the game from a series that's famously known to be very hard to be that hard.

why should klei balance or even add in anything at all at this point, just let the modders do it.

And then once again my point will remain uncontested.

dont starve was never dark souls game nor hard

 

u literally cant starve in dont starve, that speaks for itself xD

[Theukon-dos]

5 hours ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Don't nerf characters, just effectively allow players to control the difficulty by adding mob health/boss HP options in the world settings. You could either nerf down the health of raid bosses or increase it if you feel like you want the fight to be longer as powerful characters like Wolfgang/with a group of friends. I'm imagining a mob health slider that goes from 25% to 500% (options being 25%, 50%, 100%, 200%, 300%, 400%, 500%), defaulting to 100% (their current values), and a similar raid boss health slider.

Doesn't that axe swing both ways?

 

Don't buff characters, just effectively allow players to control the difficulty and mod health/boss HP options and, y'know. Everything else you just said.

I mean realistically, just adding boss health scaling or a single-player mode would achieve 95% of what rifts and skill trees are trying to acomplish. both of those changes are largely driven by a desire to make most characters on-par with the high-tier combat characters like Wolfgang, Wanda, and Maxwell. And ignoring how this is a horrible idea in general, the that high damage is valued so highly is because DST balances all of it's monsters around the assumption that there are multiple players, and thus multiple people doing damage at once. So characters that deal more damage are exponentially more effective because the game expects multiple characters worth of damage. Therefore, adding the option to balance the game around not expecting more damage would mean that characters who don't have more damage wouldn't fall behind.

 

And if absolutely nothing else, adding player-based HP scaling is something that Klei could probably do over a single week instead of the litteral years of development time that Rifts and Character Refreshes 2: Electric Boogaloo are going to eat up.

[DegenerateFurry]

28 minutes ago, Theukon-dos said:

Doesn't that axe swing both ways?

 

Don't buff characters, just effectively allow players to control the difficulty and mod health/boss HP options and, y'know. Everything else you just said.

Not exactly, since nerfing characters inherently feels worse than buffing them, and it's not a value you can simply have a slider for. Also, nerfing or buffing characters changes the core gameplay experience for those characters, whereas giving us slider options for boss health is a simple tweak, would be pretty easy to code in (plenty of modders have done it), and only really changes how long a fight takes. 

31 minutes ago, Theukon-dos said:

And if absolutely nothing else, adding player-based HP scaling is something that Klei could probably do over a single week instead of the literal years of development time that Rifts and Character Refreshes 2: Electric Boogaloo are going to eat up.

I have been an advocate of player-based HP scaling (particularly for bosses) for a long time now and I agree that it'd be quicker for them to do, but they're not just trying to balance characters with rifts and skill trees. They're adding new endgame content and new options for playstyles. Balancing is only part of what skill trees are for.
Combat Wormwood used to be practically nonexistent and he basically just used to be for farming crops, but now he can be genuinely helpful in fights in unique ways (the spore clouds from his moon shrooms come to mind - they let you disable Klaus's deer for your teammates without enraging him if you're consistent with it, and that's just one example), farm crops, or farm mushrooms, and he gets even better post-rifts. 
Then there's Willow, who's basically an entirely different (and vastly more worthwhile) character after her skill tree. 

Back on the subject of scaling: I'd like to point out that simply reducing a boss's HP isn't always the best move to make it more suitable for being fought alone. Bee Queen, for instance - her problem's not that she has too much health, it's that she summons so many minions that if you're not Wendy, you'll want an army to fight her with, or you have to build some X-shaped fence structure that the bees go around when you have her chase you across it to buy yourself some time to actually fight her. A more reasonable scaling option for Bee Queen would be turning down (or up) the number of grumble bees summoned depending on how many players there are.
Meanwhile, Toadstool is a boss where reducing/increasing HP is a good scaling option. Each should be given scaling on a case-by-case basis. 
I also feel that you should be able to turn off boss scaling in the world options so that you can have the current experience, or even disable or enable it for specific bosses. 

6 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

point called the game from a series that's known to be an unforgiving and hard survival game should BE an Unforgiving and hard survival game.

i'm Not going to use That word though because the mod that has it in it's name's devs can have their DNA stolen.

Oh, so your argument is just "uncompromising wilderness survival game". That argument died when Wolfgang was added back in original Don't Starve to be an easy mode character, and for some reason, people keep parading around said argument's corpse as if it hasn't been rotting for two years past a decade.
I'm still pretty sure that you've not read my posts, because I suggested that the difficulty sliders would also let players make things harder for themselves. Or are you simply against people having a choice in the matter? 

[Wormboi]

8 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

Someone correct me if I'm talking nonsense, but I've noticed that Klei rarely nerfs any character after he receives an update that benefits the character, so these nerf requests always feel like they're talking to a wall

That, and I dont know how people outside the forums would feel about their favorite character getting gutted just because some formites said so.

[Wormboi]

1 minute ago, SSneaky said:

oh boo hoo you actualy need to think more 

bit rude there

[DegenerateFurry]

1 hour ago, SSneaky said:

and your proposing, Oh hey essentially, Oh hey i want to beable to have my sneezes kill deerclops because i said so.

No, I'm proposing that there should be scaling for boss health. Maybe if you tried not being disingenuous for once, you'd get that. 

But, again, I literally suggested that the sliders could let you set boss HP to anywhere from 25% of normal to 500% of normal. Since you seem to be failing to understand that (intentionally or not), let me put it in simple numbers, using Bee Queen as an example since I already mentioned her: Bee Queen normally has 22500 HP. The lower end of the sliders would have it become 5625, which is about seasonal boss range. The higher end would have it become 112,500, which is more than Misery Toadstool and is suitable as a decent challenge for a team of six players. 

[hyoton123]

I will say that I think it is very appropriate that wurt players apparently cannot control themselves and create an appropriate number of merm structures, but instead are insisting on training mass overkill numbers of merms to be vicious killers, installing a figurehead leader, throwing their lives away, and grossly mutating them or ridding them of their mortal shells and turning them into horrible shadow monsters, and insisting that someone else has to stop them. The uncontrollable hunger for power is very Don’t Starveian.

[dst_lover]

 

boss health settings? Really? 

like this doesn’t fix the problem yes it’s something that I actually went in the game and i don’t mind them adding it but this doesn’t fix the problem that i have or other people have 

1 what if somebody enter the world and he pick Wilson or his Wes or any character that have low damage and I am picking a high damage character this will feel weird actually because if he went to kill a boss in his own he will not have the best day 

2 the problem isn’t with bosses hp or boss some times some characters are bad in combat and some are bad outside combat this doesn’t fix some characters problems 

3 I doesn’t like changing the settings of my world and even if I do if I enter my friend world should I force him to do it ? so I can enjoy my character 

4 this will be the most important Point

In this forums I see a lot of people that say things like buff that this thing is op nerf this boss and when I ask for any nerf for a character or a item or to make a boss harder I always see a response that always comes just ( don’t use that , just ignore this just use a worse item , use a worse skill tree ) and I think this make 0 sense because if  I wake up and find out that the AFW HP went from 16k to 8 k and I disagree with this decision am I wrong with this i know I can use worse weapons and instead of going with dark sword I can fight him with spear but this simply will not be as fun as before because I know now this boss isn’t hard I am the one who making him hard and this is boring I am not holding my self from using op methods and items what the game should is either they nerf it or remove it not to ignore it this doesn’t make sense how people are fine with some of those things this is just weird and their defensive barrier is to hold back ? what is this i went to play a hard game not to make the game harder by my self this is boring   , i can literally make every food source none and make my self take more damage and night only but this is just not fun i doesn’t find any enjoyment out of holding my self