Shadow Maul Research

[Cruvimaster]

[arubaro]

is too good, fully cleaning the ruins without wasting a single healing item while doing top damage. Doesnt removes batbat out of the equation while being unique and useful

is dst, items giving inmunity without real downsides dont belong here. People defending 10 healing per hit are problematic for rift content if klei really want to develope a hard mode

[Vasz_]

I think it's in a good spot, it's a great weapon. By the time you get to craft it you probably don't have any issues staying alive so the Maul makes things very easy.

It's hard for me to understand what people would want more from a weapon that deals good damage, heals you a lot and is easy to repair. Wigfrid heals for less than that and is already nigh immortal. It's not like you can't use other forms of healing as well while you use the Maul.

[NoodlemanNed]

something ive felt is that the item doesnt hold a good purpose for almost anyone, it isnt good for people playing fast since it takes so long to level up. It also isnt good for people playing super late into a world because its way more annoying to maintain when compared to other weapons. Ive tried thinking of decent ways of either nerfing or buffing this thing but nothing feels like it would really help it.

I didnt vote on this poll because i think its issue is lacking a real purpose in the game, and not something balance related.

[Ohan]

i think its fine. It might not heal as much per hit as a batbat but it deals almost double as much damage and it is repairable.

Not having to stop to heal and simultaneously dealing high damage is major. 

For Wormwood though i think it has become unusable ironically , at least for my playstyle. 

Before this patch i used it for burst healing without a cowl while using Brightshade sword and CC crown for the damage. Now you have to commit to the maul to get the healing out of it and it drains more sanity which means missing out on BS vines and having to restore sanity more frequently for the crown. 

[arubaro]

11 minutes ago, NoodlemanNed said:

It also isnt good for people playing super late into a world because its way more annoying to maintain when compared to other weapons.

obv the more you play once you get it the better it is, but if you will drop the world after killing everything is pointless like a lot of content

the hunger drain isnt noticeable

[Echsrick]

i love a weapon i cant even use most of the time because it said its hungry

[arubaro]

8 minutes ago, Echsrick said:

i love a weapon i cant even use most of the time because it said its hungry

if by "most of the time" you mean, "every many time and with easy ways of counter it", yes, you cant use it

[Reiko24]

[Ridley]

I need to go obtain it again and see what it's like. Seems like a lot of hassle to go through to deal 4 more damage than the Shadow Reaper and while not eating healing foods as often.

[Arcwell]

Not seeing a poll option that fits my opinion here.

I thought it was fine before, I think it's fine now, I would not have used it in either iteration simply because I prefer the alternatives.

I think lifesteal is overhyped to be much stronger than it is, similar to wortox's healing ability or the resurrect abilities of certain characters (i.e. wanda clock, wigfrid song, winona rose). It is no doubt useful, but it's not as if you can't achieve the same effects through different means.

[dst_lover]

To me this item is kinda interesting because this weapon to me is very good with an armour that gives you a lot of durability more then an armour that give the player a lot of protection imagine you eat a Jellybeans and you are Wolfgang and u are having this weapon with the Dreadstone armour , and because this weapon make your sanity low the armour will repair its self and with the lifesteal u can fight for a lot of time and u can even wear something like the bee queen crown only and tank some bosses while the bee queen crown increases your sanity so you will not have to fight nightmares and because the bee queen crown have a lot of durability it’s only the matter of how much you can heal so you will not losses the battle 

[Bumber64]

I don't really get why people would use the maul at this point. They already seldom use the bat bat pre-rifts. Just looking at it on paper:

At max level, you get half the healing of a bat bat. I've heard hitting Chester/Hutch for health is a strat. You won't be doing that with maul.

Damage (again max) is 8 lower Edit: That's for base level. Max is 4 higher than reaper, which you've already got before you consider if you want to waste your time acquiring the possessed atrium. The hunger needs to be maintained or else it starts losing durability (which you're already losing by using it to fight).

You maintain the hunger by... using it as a weapon? Curious. I don't see any mention on the wiki about recovering the durability you just wasted? Reaper doesn't make you do that. No bosses to fight, no hunting weak mobs to maintain it. Just repair it when it breaks. Accidentally letting the maul break makes tossing it in a chest and switching back to reaper a serious thought every time.

Recovery per hit maxes out at 3.4. Basic health foods recover 40 health. That's about 12 swings per pierogi or dragonpie. Guess what? Those recover 5 sanity, which you're passively losing for equipping either shadow weapon. Maul reduces 20 sanity on top of that. I wonder what's going in the healing slot you just replaced?

It's somewhere between luxury axe and Lucy as a tool? Nice try! People don't use axes to chop trees! (Okay, I actually use luxury axe, because I don't need huge amounts of wood.)

So that's my take, never having crafted it, and unable to conceive ever doing so. Just give it the same healing as bat bat, seriously. It's an end-game weapon.

[ZeRoboButler]

I was just hoping for something new with the maul, does feel a little bit like a reskinned batbat with planar rather then something unique of its own. 

[grm9]

23 minutes ago, Bumber64 said:

Damage (again max) is 8 lower than reaper

no, scythe's 88 and axe's 92

[Bumber64]

1 minute ago, grm9 said:

no, scythe's 88 and axe's 92

https://dontstarve.wiki.gg/wiki/Shadow_Maul
"The maximum damage reached is 80.8, or 88.9 against Lunar Aligned creatures."

https://dontstarve.wiki.gg/wiki/Shadow_Reaper
"The maximum damage reached is 88.8, or 97.7 against Lunar Aligned creatures."

That wrong?

[grm9]

2 minutes ago, Bumber64 said:

https://dontstarve.wiki.gg/wiki/Shadow_Maul
"The maximum damage reached is 80.8, or 88.9 against Lunar Aligned creatures."

https://dontstarve.wiki.gg/wiki/Shadow_Reaper
"The maximum damage reached is 88.8, or 97.7 against Lunar Aligned creatures."

That wrong?

the numbers for axe're about level 0

[Bumber64]

5 minutes ago, grm9 said:

the numbers for axe're about level 0

Okay. +4 still isn't great, though, given requirements.

[cybers2001]

Neat weapon, but seems overrated to me. Way too much hassle for only 4 more planar than the shadow reaper.

Lifesteal is an overrated stat (don't you already carry a stack of jellybeans?)

I would consider using it if something changed to its hunger mechanic. Maybe it can't drop below a certain durability due to hunger?

[Cruvimaster]

I advise you to think very carefully about the current status of this weapon, as it will remain like this forever in the game.

I think it should have the same damage as the bat bat (~6), which would already be a big nerf in the initial proposal (~17) and intermediate (~10).

I'm sure there are much better LATE GAME solutions than having (a) a weapon with similar damage to others (BS Word, S Reaper), (b) with a need to be in combat regularly (hunger), (c) with a low life steal factor (~3) and (d) increased sanity loss (if people liked weapons that lose sanity, dark sword would have been the most used weapon over the years, but it wasn't).

[arubaro]

1 hour ago, Cruvimaster said:

I advise you to think very carefully about the current status of this weapon, as it will remain like this forever in the game.

I think it should have the same damage as the bat bat (~6), which would already be a big nerf in the initial proposal (~17) and intermediate (~10).

I'm sure there are much better LATE GAME solutions than having (a) a weapon with similar damage to others (BS Word, S Reaper), (b) with a need to be in combat regularly (hunger), (c) with a low life steal factor (~3) and (d) increased sanity loss (if people liked weapons that lose sanity, dark sword would have been the most used weapon over the years, but it wasn't).

As others said, batbat has bigger healing because isnt a main weapon. If someone has ever tryed batbat can understand how adding such life still to a main weapon, with double of their damage plus 200 durability that can be repaired cheaply, is unbalanced and unnecessary 

I dont think people who is complaining about the current ammount of healing has tried it. Is hard to be at less than 100% hp because you are healing constantly...unless you wanna mindless tank multiple enemies...

3hp per hit is enough to allow you to clean the entire ruins or to kill bosses without losing health because, if you know kite sometimes, you will recover the hp lost

Wigfrid is absurd and doesnt have such life steal

[Bumber64]

2 hours ago, arubaro said:

As others said, batbat has bigger healing because isnt a main weapon. If someone has ever tryed batbat can understand how adding such life still to a main weapon, with double of their damage plus 200 durability that can be repaired cheaply, is unbalanced and unnecessary

People didn't use bat bat when the alternative was hambat. This is because you can eat while kiting or face tanking and still have better DPS. Healing items cheaper than bat bat.

Maul suffers from a different problem in its requirements versus reaper. If it was just a reaper with 3.4 heal per hit and inferior damage, it might be compelling for the same repair cost as that item. It's not, though. Maybe you could get away with the hunger, but the boss-killing gimmick kills it.

What about keeping current stats and lose only one level on break? IDK.

6.8 heal and less damage with current mechanics is acceptable.

More damage and no heal is boring, not worth boss-killing requirement. (AoE was suggested. That's just shadow tentacles.)

[arubaro]

1 minute ago, Bumber64 said:

People didn't use bat bat when the alternative was hambat. This is because you can eat while kiting or face tanking and still have better DPS. Unjustified cost.

Batbat suffers from being a little underpowered compared to how easy to access is food. Easier with new dishes but is an useful item, a lot of healing that never spoils

2 minutes ago, Bumber64 said:

Maul suffers from a different problem in its requirements vs reaper. If it was just a reaper with 3.4 heal per hit and inferior damage, it might be compelling for the same repair cost. It's not, though. Maybe you could get away with the hunger, but the boss-killing gimmick kills it.

For me the boss killing gimmick is fun, i wont argue that 12 might be too much but for me that is just 1 season of bosses i will kill anyway. I like the mechanic, feels unique and rewarding. Also makes you take care of the axe like how we took care of the shield of terror (reason why i always were against making it unbreakable)

The hunger isnt much of a problem, the maul tells me he is hungry and i simply kill some bees from my bee zone, in winter im killing stuff anyway. Even walls works for the moment

I think isnt op right now neither underpowered. As i said i did many stuff without worrying about healing and i was using 80% armor... if i were using better armor i wont reach 95% of hp...

[Jakepeng99]

5 minutes ago, arubaro said:

Batbat suffers from being a little underpowered compared to how easy to access is food. Easier with new dishes but is an useful item, a lot of healing that never spoils

It lets you have higher dps too as you heal without needing to stop attacking.

[arubaro]

5 minutes ago, Jakepeng99 said:

It lets you have higher dps too as you heal without needing to stop attacking.

I love it. One of my favorite items