Is Oxygen with FP supposed to be possible?

[evilman987]

I am inexperienced at this game and still learning. I am asking if this is intended.
I am trying to play a bit better than i normally do with scraping by, so I figured I'd try messing with liquids to stop polluted oxygen production.

I made this pit to put all the polluted water I have, don't have much else as I'm barely in advanced research this run. I decided to put a little water on top to see if that would stop polluted oxygen production and allow me to maintain what little water I spawned with. However, the second I put regular water on top of the PW, it took on this form and food poisoning started spreading out from the pit.

There is only oxygen above the pit, with none of it polluted. It didn't spread out of the pit at all until I did this.This is what it looked like before.

[asurendra]

Food poisoning germs can live in oxygen for a while. They will die sooner or later. Thats totally harmless as dupes need to eat them to start disease. Breathing that oxygen is safe

 

Moreover that can even be used as defence from slimelung. Different germs attack each other so if they meet FP can kill all slimelung if exceeded in number

[evilman987]

So did the Water being put on top like shoot the germs into the air or something?

[asurendra]

Nope, clean water dont share germs with gas, only with other liquids. More likely pWater has some time to offgasing. And pOxygen shared its germs with normal oxygen before deodorizer consumed it.  Also you have germs on that bottle near terrarium, and in storages too. Thats also may be the source

[evilman987]

I don't think that explains whats happening here.

I never had the bottle shoot off germs before, and it's also over-pressured at the time of this photo, so the Pw couldn't offshoot.

The first photo was taken a second after I poured water back on after reloading a save, with it rapidly increasing in count, almost like it was equalizing with the Pw as if itself was Po, Why I find it strange.

Edit: Also noticed that O2 cannot hold the germs at all, requiring Po mixed in to do so, but I forgot to show the section to the left that definitely doesn't have Po but was also filled with FP.
Should also mention that I didn't let it run cause I was worried it was gonna keep spreading throughout my base like it was, and that save was a while ago.

[DolphinWing]

There are polluted water bottles with germs just next to the Algae Terrarium and they are not overpressure?

[evilman987]

1 minute ago, DolphinWing said:

There are polluted water bottles with germs just next to the Algae Terrarium and they are not overpressure?

100% over-pressure, Also when they do diffuse, it releases barely any.

[DolphinWing]

I have a very long time not using Algae Terrariums. But it looked like there are also germs in your algaes.

[evilman987]

Alright just did a another test, and it 100% was the water.
What I think is happening, cause I cannot tell what gases are truly where, is that the water basically shotgunned the polluted water with germs in it over a spread out surface it rapidly diffused despite over-pressure, likely cause of what liquid physics I've heard about, then proceeds to propel all across the lower bounds of my base, basically giving each tile a single gram or so of the germ infested Po until it dies off.

I noticed it never actually rose any levels and mostly equalized on that level or fell down, to me meaning that the Po and Pw, being heavier, was just launched cause the water was placed on top.

1 minute ago, DolphinWing said:

I have a very long time not using Algae Terrariums. But it looked like there are also germs in your algaes.

I've used them for a while, they never really release germs in the air.

[KittenIsAGeek]

There's multiple things going on.  First off, polluted water off-gasses polluted oxygen.  So, polluted water with food poisoning will off-gas polluted oxygen with food poisoning.  The polluted water will not off-gas if the air pressure is too high (over pressure).  When you put water on top, it blocks the off-gassing from happening.  The polluted water bottles that are in air will still off-gas, even when over pressure, because when dupes breath out CO2, that bit is well-under pressure.  If it floats over a bottle of PW, then the PW will off-gas.

The next thing is that polluted oxygen will carry food poisoning germs.  As long as there is polluted oxygen with food poisoning germs in it, the germs will remain present.  The deoderizer will clean the polluted oxygen into regular oxygen, but it does not do anything about the germs.  Food poisoning will slowly die off in regular oxygen, so eventually the food poisoning will die off if you keep the air clean.

Food poisoning does not die out of water, even if the water is otherwise clean.  Sanishells, boiling, or freezing water will remove the food poisoning from it.  If you don't use one of these methods to remove food poisoning from regular water, you can get into some interesting situations.  For example, if you run FP PW through a water sieve, then send it to an electrolyzer, the oxygen and hydrogen that is produced will have food poisoning in it.  Also, if you use water with FP germs to feed your algae, then the oxygen produced will also have FP in it.  As stated earlier, the FP in air is never a problem, but it can lead to confusion when germs show up on the overlay of an otherwise clean base.  

[evilman987]

3 hours ago, KittenIsAGeek said:

There's multiple things going on.  First off, polluted water off-gasses polluted oxygen.  So, polluted water with food poisoning will off-gas polluted oxygen with food poisoning.  The polluted water will not off-gas if the air pressure is too high (over pressure).  When you put water on top, it blocks the off-gassing from happening.  The polluted water bottles that are in air will still off-gas, even when over pressure, because when dupes breath out CO2, that bit is well-under pressure.  If it floats over a bottle of PW, then the PW will off-gas.

The next thing is that polluted oxygen will carry food poisoning germs.  As long as there is polluted oxygen with food poisoning germs in it, the germs will remain present.  The deoderizer will clean the polluted oxygen into regular oxygen, but it does not do anything about the germs.  Food poisoning will slowly die off in regular oxygen, so eventually the food poisoning will die off if you keep the air clean.

Food poisoning does not die out of water, even if the water is otherwise clean.  Sanishells, boiling, or freezing water will remove the food poisoning from it.  If you don't use one of these methods to remove food poisoning from regular water, you can get into some interesting situations.  For example, if you run FP PW through a water sieve, then send it to an electrolyzer, the oxygen and hydrogen that is produced will have food poisoning in it.  Also, if you use water with FP germs to feed your algae, then the oxygen produced will also have FP in it.  As stated earlier, the FP in air is never a problem, but it can lead to confusion when germs show up on the overlay of an otherwise clean base.  

How this should function makes complete sense to me. However what happened doesn't make sense, as the polluted water bottles are in over-pressure and surrounded by C02. Base is early enough that O2 production over-pressures the entire area. The food poisoning is rapidly spreading through O2 only areas, almost like a small amount of Po got blasted throughout.
I would like to repeat, there was never any FP or Po anywhere else in the base prior to pouring the water on top, and it only started spreading once the water was poured, spreading at a much faster rate then any Po was being produced.

I theorize, with my limited knowledge of Liquid physics, that the act of pouring water on top may have created a small short term vaccum for the Po to offgas and may have sent it everywhere with an unintended velocity. Again, there was no FP outside the pit and it maintained over-pressure throughout the whole process and for the next few cycles.

 

I agree that what all of you said Is how the system works, but something is not working right here.

[Tuberi]

Polluted water bottles off-gas when the tile it is on is below 1800g of pressure. In the first image you can clearly see a drop of liquid on the tile which makes the tile under 1800g of pressure which causes the polluted water bottle to off-gas

[KittenIsAGeek]

On 7/27/2024 at 9:35 PM, evilman987 said:

The food poisoning is rapidly spreading through O2 only areas, almost like a small amount of Po got blasted throughout.

On 7/27/2024 at 9:35 PM, evilman987 said:

I would like to repeat, there was never any FP or Po anywhere else in the base prior to pouring the water on top, and it only started spreading once the water was poured, spreading at a much faster rate then any Po was being produced.

Likely what happened was when you put clean water on top of the polluted water, some of it spilled onto the algae terrarium.  Because food poisoning can live in water, the polluted water beneath it contaminated the clean water.  The algae terrarium then used the water that was touching it to create O2.  This O2 will be contaminated by the food poisoning because the water the algae terrarium is using was contaminated.  

The food poisoning germs in air will not stay contained to their cell.  It will diffuse through adjacent blocks of O2.  The death rate in O2 is something slow like 3% per cycle, so it can spread quite a bit before it diffuses out enough to die off.  

 

Either way.. food poisoning in air is nothing to worry about.  It won't spread onto the dupes or onto food, and your dupes won't get sick from it.

[Prince Mandor]

You put normal water above polluted water. Normal water get some germs from polluted water. Algae terrarium consumes water from surrounding area, so as soon as you added normal water, terrarium get this infected clean water inside. Terrarium produces oxygen, so it created infected oxygen spread in area. After that terrarium produced polluted water, also infected. Duplicant converted this water into bottle, also infected. bottle of polluted water off-gas (they off-gas in real base, becuse dupes sometimes breath out CO2 and this CO2 may pass over bottle, and this CO2 will have less than mass necessary to overpress off-gasing), so infected polluted water creates some infected polluted oxygen too.

But most important factor is algae terrarium consuming infected water from environment and producing infected oxygen from it. BTW, algae terrariums don't overpress, so it just adds some infected clean oxygen into already existing clean oxygen