Complaints - My take

[Reiko24]

Alright, the latest post was pretty long and had meaningful points.

Although, the argument that the game is "too easy" now, is not valid.

The game was hard for you before. It is hard for normal people now, only veterans and players who played it a lot do not have a problem with the game at all. That's how it works! It's experience! It's skill! 

The new bosses are not boring to normal people. I played with some people recently and all of those things were so new and fun to them. Even when fighting them multiple times. They all died so many times.

The content is not for veterans, for we are too skilled already. If they add something so difficult that veterans have a huge problem with it, what will normal people do? They won't be able to overcome the obstacle and just quit.

 

Also, complaining about updates being all over the place right now is also not pretty on-point. We ALL wanted ocean to be more meaningful, more fun. Why complain that they updated the ocean now when we all wanted it? To be honest, it made my gameplay much more fun. Ocean needed that.

If they won't do this stuff again, then it's alright. The rifts and hardmode stuff needs to be worked on, I get the frustration. It WILL fit DST. Right now, everyone can see it is incomplete and seems to not fit. It barely has any content. Do not berate incomplete content that was barely updated. It's important now for Klei to not lose focus on their rift stuff. Sure, ocean isn't perfect, but it's "alright" now. The rifts are not. Their potential and what can become of them is amazing.

 

Unfortunately, I can agree with some negative things that were said. Why does Klei add powercreep perks for characters, instead of making normal, FORGOTTEN, USELESS, UNUSED items - useful? It's so much more fun to have interesting items that you can use, instead of some crazy op perk on a skill tree.

 

 

Klei is a small company. We shouldn't attack them and behave like they DON'T want to fix stuff. They obviously want to. They have stuff all over the place and a limited, small amount of people to work with. 

I have an idea, we can get a rework of an useless item each update. It's a small thing, not requiring a lot of work compared to other stuff. New mechanics that punish, and reward the player can be created for those items. (which takes more work, but that can be a part of the Rift Update).

It's not healthy for a game to have so many items that are completely forgotten and just noob-traps. Crafts and structures should have a use.

Sorry for the formatting, it's probably hard to read. I don't know how to do it better.

[grm9]

21 minutes ago, Reiko24 said:

If they add something so difficult that veterans have a huge problem with it, what will normal people do? They won't be able to overcome the obstacle and just quit

they can try to get better or just not do it because it could be entirely optional e.g. a boss and knowing how to deal with a boss usually doesn't help with dealing with other bosses e.g. knowing how to kite dfly doesn't help with killing FW

25 minutes ago, Reiko24 said:

We ALL wanted ocean to be more meaningful, more fun

i didn't care about it and i still don't do anything in it after update except CC quest line if i end up having nothing to do before shadow pieces day

26 minutes ago, Reiko24 said:

The game was hard for you before. It is hard for normal people now, only veterans and players who played it a lot do not have a problem with the game at all. That's how it works! It's experience! It's skill!

no that doesn't work that way, a new boss could be equally hard for someone that can kill bosses that exist easily and someone that can't if they both've knowledge about what exists in the game and can at least kite

[DegenerateFurry]

Finally, someone here's pointing out the obvious truth that so many people are choosing to ignore: that games get easier as you get better at them. One look outside of the tiny bubble of people like many of us with thousands of hours on the game will show you that Don't Starve Together is still quite difficult, but a lot of users on this forum are incredibly dismissive of anyone who points that fact out. The "git gud" attitude you see from certain people who post negativity ceaselessly in every thread is exactly that: them dismissing people who contradict their preconceptions about the game's difficulty. It would be comical if it didn't make interacting with them so frustrating; you don't have to "git gud" at something that's easy, and yet it's what they tell anyone who says a particular boss fight feels overly punishing. 

You're also right about the noob traps. Mandrakes being edible is one that comes to mind, I've seen plenty of newbies get kicked for it on Klei servers. Then there's all the really mediocre crock pot dishes, although Klei did just buff several of them (such as the fig-based ones and a bunch of seafood ones), so it looks like they're already working on that. 

[Mike23Ua]

I might be sounding a bit mean when I say this, but Klei being a small company doesn’t give them any leadway or excuses.

I mean the people who created “Trinity Fusion” is a dev team consisting of only FOUR PEOPLE.

So no.. I actually will criticize Klei, and let me tell you something else- We’ve equally seen Blockbuster AAA studios with well over 300 developers working on a project companies like Rocksteady (the people who created the Batman Arkham games) and Ubisoft (Known for pretty much everything you can name) Release major massive flops like Suicide Squad Kill the Justice League & Assassins Creed: Unity.

But what I can fairly judge Klei on at this point is that they started this return of them (adding an ocean to DST) chain way back in 2018, and it is now 2024- We are actually ONE (or if lucky Two..) update(s) away from completely finishing this years Entire Roadmap worth of Content.

Which means- Were pretty damn close to cutting into 2025 now. If your not doing your math that has been SEVEN YEARS.

7 Years to flesh out the Ocean so it doesn’t look and feel like an early beta project, 7 Years to make Rift Content or Return of Them etc have any overall meaning or connection.

I believe that people have a very valid right to complain and be frustrated after seven years of hoping for bigger more meaningful updates, don’t you?

[Reiko24]

6 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

I might be sounding a bit mean when I say this, but Klei being a small company doesn’t give them any leadway or excuses.

I mean the people who created “Trinity Fusion” is a dev team consisting of only FOUR PEOPLE.

So no.. I actually will criticize Klei, and let me tell you something else- We’ve equally seen Blockbuster AAA studios with well over 300 developers working on a project companies like Rocksteady (the people who created the Batman Arkham games) and Ubisoft (Known for pretty much everything you can name) Release major massive flops like Suicide Squad Kill the Justice League & Assassins Creed: Unity.

But what I can fairly judge Klei on at this point is that they started this return of them (adding an ocean to DST) chain way back in 2018, and it is now 2024- We are actually ONE (or if lucky Two..) update(s) away from completely finishing this years Entire Roadmap worth of Content.

Which means- Were pretty damn close to cutting into 2025 now. If your not doing your math that has been SEVEN YEARS.

7 Years to flesh out the Ocean so it doesn’t look and feel like an early beta project, 7 Years to make Rift Content or Return of Them etc have any overall meaning or connection.

I believe that people have a very valid right to complain and be frustrated after seven years of hoping for bigger more meaningful updates, don’t you?

When you show it like that, yeah. I agree.

[grm9]

10 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Finally, someone here's pointing out the obvious truth that so many people are choosing to ignore: that games get easier as you get better at them. One look outside of the tiny bubble of people like many of us with thousands of hours on the game will show you that Don't Starve Together is still quite difficult, but a lot of users on this forum are incredibly dismissive of anyone who points that fact out. The "git gud" attitude you see from certain people who post negativity ceaselessly in every thread is exactly that: them dismissing people who contradict their preconceptions about the game's difficulty. It would be comical if it didn't make interacting with them so frustrating; you don't have to "git gud" at something that's easy, and yet it's what they tell anyone who says a particular boss fight feels overly punishing

you're literally talking about people that don't exist, no one does that

[DegenerateFurry]

37 minutes ago, grm9 said:

you're literally talking about people that don't exist, no one does that

 I'm literally talking about you in particular. You did it in the post directly above mine in this thread in your first sentence and I didn't even see your post until after I sent mine - I started writing my post before you'd posted yours, so I only saw it after, but it didn't make a difference because there's several people who very predictably dismiss all points about difficulty with "get good", and you're the worst example. 

[Mysterious box]

40 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Finally, someone here's pointing out the obvious truth that so many people are choosing to ignore: that games get easier as you get better at them. One look outside of the tiny bubble of people like many of us with thousands of hours on the game will show you that Don't Starve Together is still quite difficult

I mean the game is getting easier and the game gets easier with more time into it are both true statements I would argue however that the game is getting easier in the wrong direction as the game is giving you more and more powerful tools earlier and earlier into the game but it's not helping players with grasping the necessary information they need to organically improve.

48 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Mandrakes being edible is one that comes to mind, I've seen plenty of newbies get kicked for it on Klei servers.

Controversial opinion incoming I don't think there's anything wrong with eating mandrakes and I feel like the hate people get for doing so mainly comes from habit more than anything else. Like when people used to get kicked for picking flowers or picking Willow.

51 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Then there's all the really mediocre crock pot dishes, although Klei did just buff several of them (such as the fig-based ones and a bunch of seafood ones), so it looks like they're already working on that. 

This is just fact however.

41 minutes ago, grm9 said:

you're literally talking about people that don't exist, no one does that

Gonna be real you do seem to be a bit detached on how people experience the game at this point at least from what I've been seeing lately.

[DegenerateFurry]

3 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

I mean the game is getting easier and the game gets easier with more time into it are both true statements I would argue however that the game is getting easier in the wrong direction as the game is giving you more and more powerful tools earlier and earlier into the game but it's not helping players with grasping the necessary information they need to organically improve.

I will agree that some of the skill tree stuff hasn't been going in the perfect direction, like how Wolfgang (already a very strong character) just kind of got a buff to his damage via affinity. I don't mind them adding quality-of-life buffs to characters that need them, like how they made Weremoose actually viable for combat in more fights, though. 

[grm9]

8 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

 I'm literally talking about you in particular. You did it in the post directly above mine in this thread in your first sentence and I didn't even see your post until after I sent mine - I started writing my post before you'd posted yours, so I only saw it after, but it didn't make a difference because there's several people who very predictably dismiss all points about difficulty with "get good", and you're the worst example

at least read 1st 11 words instead of 6, how else's the game supposed to work? new bosses work that way too, it's just that they aren't hard so people don't complain about that working that way

what points? when did i do that? are you able to read? do you read my messages at all or do you just think that i've wrote something that you think i've wrote? getting better's not the only option, you can use cheese and easy strats and i practically always mention that when people complain about things being too hard, you can't say that spamming brightshade staff as much as you can with lazy explorer and nightmare amulet or using gunpowder's hard or at least much harder in comparison to new bosses

you literally talk about people that don't exist and say that people say things that they don't say, i practically always mention that getting better isn't the only option and things're optional in the 1st place so no one forces you to do them

8 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

Gonna be real you do seem to be a bit detached on how people experience the game at this point at least from what I've been seeing lately

if you're talking about people that aren't newbies not dying because of nightmares, that was probably because we were talking about different definitions of a newbie

[arubaro]

1 hour ago, Reiko24 said:

The game was hard for you before. It is hard for normal people now, only veterans and players who played it a lot do not have a problem with the game at all. That's how it works! It's experience! It's skill! 

Sure but veterans were used to a level of difficulty achieve by their experiencie but now is way lower due to unbalance items (cheap range weapons cof, cof) plus powerful perks in skill trees 

Makes no sense to make the game less enjoyable for people that is already hooked in an attempt of hooking more people

[Evelo]

Friend of mine and I started playing together after we figured out how to make the lag more tolerable.

He dies so frequently it is angers me. But I need to remember he has about 30 hours in the game, and I have 100 times that many hours.

[abrocator]

I have over a thousand hours but I have never learned to ruins rush, boss rush, or made a plan to kill all bosses in X days. It’s all a long process for me. And yet there are people who comfortably kill both FW and CC within the same year.

Doing those two things on any time frame is not easy. I mean to some people who do that in two evenings after work it might be whatever. But try to pretend you’re at the outside looking in: how does one explain how simple those two things are without transforming into a guy with a 5m x 5m chalkboard?

[Swiyss]

20 minutes ago, abrocator said:

I have over a thousand hours but I have never learned to ruins rush, boss rush, or made a plan to kill all bosses in X days. It’s all a long process for me. And yet there are people who comfortably kill both FW and CC within the same year.

Doing those two things on any time frame is not easy. I mean to some people who do that in two evenings after work it might be whatever. But try to pretend you’re at the outside looking in: how does one explain how simple those two things are without transforming into a guy with a 5m x 5m chalkboard?

The key to this lock is practice. The more you try it, the better you do it.

Literally just say to yourself "I will kill cc before spring today". Watch someone doing it, then create a new world and try. If you die try again. If you fail to do it before your goal just try again and again and again.

It took me 3 tries to consistently do it atleast IN spring. It's just a matter of remembering what you need for pearl and a simple and quick ruins rush to get the staves. The ruins part is the same thing, just practice and eventually you'll start memorizing the way the generation of the world works. You'll be suprised at how good the human brain is at doing those things.

I have a complete full guide if you want just dm me.

[Evelo]

31 minutes ago, abrocator said:

I have over a thousand hours but I have never learned to ruins rush, boss rush, or made a plan to kill all bosses in X days. It’s all a long process for me. And yet there are people who comfortably kill both FW and CC within the same year.

Doing those two things on any time frame is not easy. I mean to some people who do that in two evenings after work it might be whatever. But try to pretend you’re at the outside looking in: how does one explain how simple those two things are without transforming into a guy with a 5m x 5m chalkboard?

I actually made a chart for my friend because often he gets to the "now what?" after a certain point. And you are very right with the chalkboard. I was drawing diagrams of how to acquire celestial champion and that was at least a year ago well before the Post Rift stuff started.

[abrocator]

29 minutes ago, Swiyss said:

The key to this lock is practice. The more you try it, the better you do it.

 

But I never said that I want to be able to do those things.

[Mike23Ua]

Spoiler

What is even the point of bosses in DST anyway? DST is a Survival game, generally speaking players want to be consistently challenged in their ability to “Survive” in Survival game, but when it comes to DST, The bosses are mostly tucked away in an obscure corner requiring a specific way to summon them when you are good and dang ready to face them. Bosses that if you manage to kill, (mostly) grant you a craftable item or structure that makes staying alive in a survival game you want to be challenged by.. that much easier.

There are only a handful of exceptions-CK&AG (Pre-requirements) CC, And AFW defeating those open up new world based survival challenges. For every other boss-  it’s just optional powerful loot or structures.

 

[chirsg]

My complaint is that gorge's art has gone to complete waste and was buried. Kill the game mode because it's fiscally irresponsible? Fine. Kill it with fire. But every single thing designed in it captures the Burton-esque spirit of the game. It's uncanny. 

Gorge's art and assets are basically a gerbil who doesn't know how to swim that is stuck in the center of a pond. Not adding the gorge's artwork and assets into the base game with some facets of balancing of course, is letting that poor gerbil to the fate you made for it. The decision is save the gerbil or let it meet gerbil Jesus, and quite frankly, the gerbil is seeing the pearly gates.

 

So many things that klei has the rights to and doesn't add into their game where the art and animations has already been done. Like, why? WHY?

 

Gorge's assets, turfs in hamlet, the SHIPWRECKED SOUNDTRACK

 

Honestly, these IA modders are doing god's work, but the devil is winning. 

As for bosses, add it Pugalisk, klei. You won't do it. You don't have the GUTS

[Swiyss]

1 hour ago, chirsg said:

My complaint is that gorge's art has gone to complete waste and was buried. Kill the game mode because it's fiscally irresponsible? Fine. Kill it with fire. But every single thing designed in it captures the Burton-esque spirit of the game. It's uncanny. 

Gorge's art and assets are basically a gerbil who doesn't know how to swim that is stuck in the center of a pond. Not adding the gorge's artwork and assets into the base game with some facets of balancing of course, is letting that poor gerbil to the fate you made for it. The decision is save the gerbil or let it meet gerbil Jesus, and quite frankly, the gerbil is seeing the pearly gates.

 

So many things that klei has the rights to and doesn't add into their game where the art and animations has already been done. Like, why? WHY?

 

Gorge's assets, turfs in hamlet, the SHIPWRECKED SOUNDTRACK

 

Honestly, these IA modders are doing god's work, but the devil is winning. 

As for bosses, add it Pugalisk, klei. You won't do it. You don't have the GUTS

JoeW said that the forge and gorge are not forgotten. They themselves also want that in the game but it's just not the right time and it's not in their plan. Simple. One day you'll get it so stop complaining

[gaymime]

22 hours ago, chirsg said:

My complaint is that gorge's art has gone to complete waste and was buried. Kill the game mode because it's fiscally irresponsible? Fine. Kill it with fire. But every single thing designed in it captures the Burton-esque spirit of the game. It's uncanny. 

Gorge's art and assets are basically a gerbil who doesn't know how to swim that is stuck in the center of a pond. Not adding the gorge's artwork and assets into the base game with some facets of balancing of course, is letting that poor gerbil to the fate you made for it. The decision is save the gerbil or let it meet gerbil Jesus, and quite frankly, the gerbil is seeing the pearly gates.

 

So many things that klei has the rights to and doesn't add into their game where the art and animations has already been done. Like, why? WHY?

 

Gorge's assets, turfs in hamlet, the SHIPWRECKED SOUNDTRACK

 

Honestly, these IA modders are doing god's work, but the devil is winning. 

As for bosses, add it Pugalisk, klei. You won't do it. You don't have the GUTS

 

 

*looks over at all of his gorge skins*