Catapult should be used by other characters, and Powder Monkey should be restored to its original state, for the following reasons:

[GreenBowers]

1 hour ago, Shining Galaxy said:

If things really are as you say, then Klei should remove Winona and Houndius Shootius from the game, as they provide the foundation for automated factories.Oh my God, Klei should be ashamed of themselves for making a game called "Oxygen Not Included" where everything is automated.

Oxygen Not Included isn't Don't Starve Together. That comparison is moot and means nothing.

 

[adminaaassh]

I hope there can be a definitive answer to these issues

[mima_]

On 6/10/2024 at 7:23 PM, EatenCheetos said:

Automated factories are something that Klei actively doesn’t want, and never wanted, in their game.

never knew there is new spokeperson for klei.

[Mike23Ua]

On 6/10/2024 at 3:47 AM, yyyyyyyyyyyyyyy said:

Regardless of the farm things, powder monkeys' random divation of fire angle is still not a good idea. I can not predict where the cannon balls will hit, which is destructive to the structures on my boat. As Klei encourages us to chase the new pirate ship to get the sunken chest, that is a risk I can't afford.

This I can completely understand, but if I’m going to chase after a boat with canons on it, I’m likely not going to take my best vessel with all my structures and supplies on it to attempt to do it.

Even games like Sea of Thieves and Skull & Bones teach players the basic 101’s of a pirates life at sea.

[kroban]

Nah Winona's exclusive use of catapults is awesome. Sure it may be hard for some of us to accostume to not being able to spam catapults usage anymore, specially considering the huge benefits it brought with farms and traps, but it will make Winona WAY more useful as a character, playing as her or having a Winona player in your base will be a huge deal now.

Wicker had the opposite happen to her and it had the opposite effect. She always benefited a lot from having exclusive ways of farming things with books and no one ever batted an eye at that because it was WICKER main thing. And most people disliked the idea of Maxwell's rework almost completely stealing her mechanic because it took away something that was HER speciality. Most are treating her as a switch character these days due to this, because Maxwell in all sense became a Wicker 3.0

Warly is another example of a switch character that urgently needs something exclusive. Hes probably one of the most played characters in DST, but as a secondary switch character. You cook and spice everything, bundle it, and have all of his benefits without having to stick as him, which is lame.

I always used Winona as "just a switch character", but if Klei decides to stick with catapults being exclusive to her, I can see myself using her as a main in the future

[grm9]

7 minutes ago, kroban said:

Nah Winona's exclusive use of catapults is awesome

no, you can see people playing as wicker during early game because it's fun, but you never see people play as winona because it's boring, i'll still never play as her because she's just wilson with catapults and teleportation

9 minutes ago, kroban said:

I always used Winona as "just a switch character", but if Klei decides to stick with catapults being exclusive to her, I can see myself using her as a main in the future

why didn't you just play as winona previously if that's fun for you then, or why won't you play as her if other characters'll be able to use her stuff? you wouldn't get affected by others being able to use your stuff, since playing as her'll be as fun as it is without others using her stuff

[reddocc]

The cannons should remain the same as before the beta this new behavior is horrible. And I personally think Winona Catapults should be limited to Winona herself(Winona's strongest perk), they are still tedious to set up and I'm glad Winona can move them in case someone wants to do a regular fight or use other methods,  other players can still use generators for winbots and spotlights. But seeing as it is Klei will probably allow the use of catapults in the base form because all the winning, I personally hate catapults because they outshine the uses of houndious shotious

[Mike23Ua]

57 minutes ago, grm9 said:

no, you can see people playing as wicker during early game because it's fun, but you never see people play as winona because it's boring, i'll still never play as her because she's just wilson with catapults and teleportation

why didn't you just play as winona previously if that's fun for you then, or why won't you play as her if other characters'll be able to use her stuff? you wouldn't get affected by others being able to use your stuff, since playing as her'll be as fun as it is without others using her stuff

Can you please listen to logic? I wouldn’t play Wendy AT ALL if I could just craft Abigail’s flowers and swap to someone else who I would rather play as.

Imagine if other characters could use Wortox’s gimmick of killing things to gather souls and using souls for team healing and teleportation- Why on earth would I even play as Wortox anymore?

Winona’s main perk was her catapults, and If anyone could utilize them, that made Winona less useful to actually stick to playing as.

[grm9]

2 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Can you please listen to logic? I wouldn’t play Wendy AT ALL if I could just craft Abigail’s flowers and swap to someone else who I would rather play as

ig everyone spawn in with a moon portal and infinite idols and idk why do you even care that much about needing to play as characters, other characters'd also most likely get catapults the way they were before winona's skill tree, so much slower shooting speed, so you'd still have a reason to play as wilson with teleportation and catapults

[adminaaassh]

28 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Can you please listen to logic? I wouldn’t play Wendy AT ALL if I could just craft Abigail’s flowers and swap to someone else who I would rather play as.

Imagine if other characters could use Wortox’s gimmick of killing things to gather souls and using souls for team healing and teleportation- Why on earth would I even play as Wortox anymore?

Winona’s main perk was her catapults, and If anyone could utilize them, that made Winona less useful to actually stick to playing as.

I believe such extreme ideas are unnecessary. Some exclusive technologies can be used by others, while some cannot, and this is completely normal. I have carefully considered the issues that the modification of Winona's Catapult will bring. Firstly, it changes the original gameplay habits of players, reducing the original possibilities of the game, which is undeniable. Secondly, this update essentially forces players to make choices, but I believe this new choice is not excellent, at least not good enough for me to give up the original one.

Furthermore, the Catapult consumes a lot of resources, relies on teammates, and has been significantly nerfed in today's update. It also takes up a considerable amount of space. Although we can recycle and reuse it, the process of repositioning and planning, as well as the backpack space it occupies, is quite troublesome. I believe that in the future, few people will voluntarily dismantle and reposition them unless they lack materials or are requested by teammates. Without the Geometric Placement mod, placement becomes extremely cumbersome. Moreover, the processes of placement, planning, and recycling are quite time-consuming.

I will repost what I said in other threads using screenshots here because I am not very good at English. Rewriting in English is very laborious for me. I need to first use machine translation and consider the translation of some specific terms. I believe that what I have said may have some reference value.

[GreenBowers]

One of the few times i think mike is objectively correct.

[_zwb]

Making catapults Winona exclusive doesn't solve the problem, she'd end up lile Wickerbottom: you swap to her, read books(use catapults), then swap back. Purple gems are cheap anyways.

[yyyyyyyyyyyyyyy]

4 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

This I can completely understand, but if I’m going to chase after a boat with canons on it, I’m likely not going to take my best vessel with all my structures and supplies on it to attempt to do it.

Just take an example. If I were going to chase them, I would certainly take a pan flute or fire staff or something. But anyway random cannon balls are still an unpredictable threat.

I am just, slightly dislike these battle RNGs, like this and Scrap Werepig's attack frequency. This kind of uncertainty is annoying sometimes.

[Cruvimaster]

Catapult should be used by other characters...

Maybe then it would be better for Klei to remove Winona from the game and create a new science machine instead.

This machine should be called W.i.n.o.n.a. in honor of the character that everyone just wanted to be in the game to create catapults that they could use with other characters.

[grm9]

3 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

Maybe then it would be better for Klei to remove Winona from the game and create a new science machine instead

apparently everyone spawn in with a moon portal and infinite idols and everyone're asking for others to be able to use all of her perks too

[Shining Galaxy]

5 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

everyone just wanted to be in the game to create catapults that they could use with other characters.

So should we consider making the Nautopilot Kit available only for Wilson to manufacture, assemble, and use? Perhaps no one has noticed, but every time a character checks their lines, it's pointing out that this is Wilson's invention, but everyone can manufacture and assemble the Nautopilot Kit at Think Tank, even though many characters complain that they can't actually understand Wilson's design for assembly instructions. There are good plot reasons to make the Nautopilot Kit a exclusive creation of Wilson's. However, Wilson selflessly shares his designs with all survivors. By the way, Think Tank is also Wilson's invention.
 

[EatenCheetos]

4 hours ago, grm9 said:

she's just wilson with catapults and teleportation

What on earth? I guess Willow is just Wilson with fire magic and a giant bear, and Wendy is just Wilson with a flower that can summon a ghost, etc. 

Calling her “Wilson with catapults and teleportation” is pretty much calling both of those aspects insignificant and makes it clear that you don’t know anything about both Wilson and Winona as characters.

Here’s a little thought experiment for you since you’re so dead set on other characters stealing Winona’s perks: why shouldn’t everybody use

* Willow’s lighter

* Bernie

* Abigails flower

* Wolfgang’s gym

* Wickerbottom’s books

* Warly’s food station

* Woby

* Wanda’s watches

Clearly all of these sink resources and make the characters selfish + basically Wilson without them /s

[grm9]

1 minute ago, EatenCheetos said:

Calling her “Wilson with catapults and teleportation” is pretty much calling both of those aspects insignificant and makes it clear that you don’t know anything about both Wilson and Winona as characters

yeah, using catapults is really boring and teleportation only removes some boring parts of the game

1 minute ago, EatenCheetos said:

why shouldn’t everybody use

* Willow’s lighter

* Bernie

* Abigails flower

* Wolfgang’s gym

* Wickerbottom’s books

* Warly’s food station

* Woby

* Wanda’s watches

idk, i wouldn't mind that, i could always not use them if they'd end up being too good when playing as other characters, everyone can already use willow's lighter btw

4 minutes ago, EatenCheetos said:

Clearly all of these sink resources and make the characters selfish

i didn't even say that about winona

5 minutes ago, EatenCheetos said:

basically Wilson without them

i wasn't even talking about how they are without them but sure

[Mysterious box]

1 hour ago, grm9 said:

yeah, using catapults is really boring and teleportation only removes some boring parts of the game

In its original state sure but that's because the only interaction was making them and then leaving them behind until you need them. Allowing us to take them with us on the go and even have direct control over them changes that completely.

[mima_]

1 hour ago, EatenCheetos said:

Willow’s lighter

* Bernie

willow lighter is can be used for everyone else, bernie also took agro on all shadow even no willow around but isnt able to attack but still helps. but what make interesting willow given perks that make the lighter and bernie special.

uhh also didnt u know that warly can cook using willow lighter 

it can be same case with nona
she can make catapult and everyone should have sum use for it, but what make her special that she can infused certain power and better targeting on those machinery .. 
it isnt hard.

[chaosmonkey]

On 6/8/2024 at 7:33 PM, adminaaassh said:

A good update should not involve modifying and weakening some old mechanics, forcing everyone to choose a new character. This applies to both the Cannon and the Catapult.

Yes!!! Incentivize playing the character with the skill tree, not punish everyone else.

[grm9]

19 minutes ago, prettynuggets said:

uhh also didnt u know that warly can cook using willow lighter

walter too

50 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

In its original state sure but that's because the only interaction was making them and then leaving them behind until you need them. Allowing us to take them with us on the go and even have direct control over them changes that completely

not really, you just press a button once every 20 seconds to make them shoot more often and moving them doesn't change how boring using them is now

[Mysterious box]

36 minutes ago, grm9 said:

not really, you just press a button once every 20 seconds to make them shoot more often and moving them doesn't change how boring using them is now

You can also spam click them to make them shoot much faster which also has a much stronger planar shot mode. I'd imagine a mobile defense engineer playstyle probably doesn't suit you which is fine no playstyle appeals to everyone afterall but it adds a really interesting dynamic to Winona.

59 minutes ago, prettynuggets said:

willow lighter is can be used for everyone else, bernie also took agro on all shadow even no willow around but isnt able to attack but still helps. but what make interesting willow given perks that make the lighter and bernie special.

uhh also didnt u know that warly can cook using willow lighter 

it can be same case with nona
she can make catapult and everyone should have sum use for it, but what make her special that she can infused certain power and better targeting on those machinery .. 
it isnt hard.

I mean it's not like she no remaining team crafts that benefit the team after she leaves the heated spotlight and tape are her contribution and arguably the spotlight is more relevant to more people of all skill levels than the catapult.

[Cyrefy]

I think I know a good solution to this problem, and I think it's very fair.  I'd love to know what you think about this.

The agreement would be this: 
Everyone could use Winona's catapults, as was the case before, and in exchange for that, with the new calibrated perceiver item that she has to discover recipes, it would also be possible for her to discover character recipes, only for usable items, such as the lighter and bear from willow, battle helm and spear from wigfrid, pinetree pioneer hat and tent roll from walter and others.

I think that would be very fair, and it wouldn't take away the meaning of playing winona, what do you think?

[EatenCheetos]

1 hour ago, chaosmonkey said:

Incentivize playing the character

Exactly why catapults are Winona exclusive now