[Discussion] On Farming

[GetNerfedOn]

So while I continue beating my head against the wall of monoculturing (guide coming soon!) I've decided to write down some of the musings I've had about farming; ever since release via Reap What You So farming been the greatest joy I've had playing the game. I've always liked being able to provide food en masse by growing crops, stemming from my early Wicker Main days of spamming original Applied Horticulture to mass farm berries and crops. That being said, there's still some pain points about farming that I think could potentially be addressed despite the farming system itself being in a very good place.

• First, the biggest pain point with farming is hoeing; the time and resource investment simply to hoe your plots is what offsets or balances farming's crazy yields. Furthermore, hoeing in vanilla, while perfectly serviceable if you want small yields, is tricky to do without Snapping tills if you're looking to optimize either 3x3 or hex plots. While for the foreseeable future I would suppose there won't be much changes to the hoeing mechanic (given the design of the Brightshade Shoevel being just a repairable hoe anyhow) options to at least speed up tilling or make it more consistent would be appreciated. Beefalo-drawn cultivators perhaps?
• Second, all the nutrient schedules per plant have representatives EXCEPT the mixed crop consumer that returns 4 Compost in exchange for 2 Manure, 2 Growth Formula. This leaves Corn/Asparagus and Garlic/Durian without a mixed consumer to do 1:1 and 1:2 ratio combos with, respectively, along with other potential combos that could be formulated. 
  • The first solution that comes to mind is to introduce a crop that fits the "juicy fruit" theme that seems to be common with the other mixed consumers (i.e. Tomato, Watermelon), with my initial suggestion being pineapples from the Moon Quay which only grow during Spring and Summer.
  • The second solution is to move Pomegranate to the Compost mixed consumer slot (given it's a juicy fruit) and replace the Strong Compost Consumer slot with something that's more viable for its nutrient cost. My initial suggestion would be to port Aloe Vera from Hamlet, and give it utility as an ingredient for a craftable healing item.
• Third, while most of the crops do have great utility in being directly consumed, it would be a boon for there to be more crop-specific crock pot recipes. While this point leans toward my frustration as a Warly main unable to eat cooked eggplant and pumpkin, it would be nice for any character to have options that bring out the best of each crop.
  • Corollary to this point are the fruits (i.e. Dragonfruit, Watermelon, Pomegranate, Durian). Barring dragonfruit, the value farmed fruits have is only to be used for Fruit Medley, Fresh Fruit Crepes or Watermelonsicle, they cannot substitute Berries in recipes where they could (i.e. Waffles, Trail Mix) and they spoil ludicrously quickly. Heck, one of them's considered a monster food, avoided by all. They could use a little more viability like the sort that Tomato enjoys.
• Fourth, Manure is an absolute pain to farm with if manually fertilizing and not using self-feeding combos given its strongest sources only provide 16 manure (Bucket o Poop and Guano), the former of which does not stack and is bone shard intensive and the latter only stacks to twenty. (I wouldn't count Compost Wraps given they're more useful as heals if you're Wormwood, anyway.) And while one could argue you can mass produce Manure and Guano by force feeding veg to a Werepig or seeds to a bird, you'd still need ludicrous amounts of either to monoculture. For instance, to farm 1 plot of 10 Pepper, you would have to provide 10 manure or 5 guano per growth stage, totaling 40 Manure, or 20 Guano. At any rate, a stronger source of manure or at least a buffed Bucket o Poop manure value would be much appreciated. 
• Fifth, I've ideas for a Warly skill tree which involved lunar- and shadow-aligned crops, but I'm still mulling them over.
• Sixth, @ADM managed to mod a boat planter box mod:
• Spoiler

  

  • While I myself must admit it feels cumbersome to farm on a boat, having the option to at least snag a 4 crop giant combo or get some filler while sailing sounds nice to have in vanilla. 

Thoughts?

[goblinball]

32 minutes ago, GetNerfedOn said:

Beefalo-drawn cultivators perhaps?

This is such a cute and fun idea I never realized how much I wanted this I will riot if this never gets added

[Wormboi]

3 minutes ago, goblinball said:

This is such a cute and fun idea I never realized how much I wanted this I will riot if this never gets added

New Beef just dropped, farmer beefalo

[Mojmaowo]

1 hour ago, GetNerfedOn said:

• Fourth, Manure is an absolute pain to farm with if manually fertilizing and not using self-feeding combos given its strongest sources only provide 16 manure (Bucket o Poop and Guano), the former of which does not stack and is bone shard intensive and the latter only stacks to twenty. (I wouldn't count Compost Wraps given they're more useful as heals if you're Wormwood, anyway.) And while one could argue you can mass produce Manure and Guano by force feeding veg to a Werepig or seeds to a bird, you'd still need ludicrous amounts of either to monoculture. For instance, to farm 1 plot of 10 Pepper, you would have to provide 10 manure or 5 guano per growth stage, totaling 40 Manure, or 20 Guano. At any rate, a stronger source of manure or at least a buffed Bucket o Poop manure value would be much appreciated. 

I think bucket of poop should change it's recipe from boneshards to stingers like all other "nails" in recipes

[Faintly Macabre]

27 minutes ago, Mojmaowo said:

I think bucket of poop should change it's recipe from boneshards to stingers like all other "nails" in recipes

Bones are used in fertilizer for their nutrients and minerals, not as nails.

[GimplyGoose]

I think bunnymen could be used as hirable farm workers. Their house are made of carrots so it makes sense that they know how to farm. The bunnyman village set piece has a pitchfork and a bunch of carrots you can pick that were presumably grown by the bunnymen. I'm not quite sure how the mechanics of them helping out would work, but I think it would fit into the game well.

[Popian]

4 hours ago, GetNerfedOn said:

you'd still need ludicrous amounts of either to monoculture

Cave entrance bats and a bonded beefalo are nice passive sources that should eventually outpace your use as well as monkeys later on.

[GetNerfedOn]

9 hours ago, goblinball said:

This is such a cute and fun idea I never realized how much I wanted this I will riot if this never gets added

9 hours ago, Wormboi said:

New Beef just dropped, farmer beefalo

Pudgy Beefalo could definitely fit this role, and their sanity aura makes me think they could have an aura that tends to plants a la One Man Band, too

6 hours ago, Popian said:

Cave entrance bats and a bonded beefalo are nice passive sources that should eventually outpace your use as well as monkeys later on.

While those sources are considerably productive and I appreciate you mentioning them, the demand is still really high especially if you commit to sustained monoculturing. The example i mentioned only accounts for one tile, for a "full" 2x2 setup the cost quadruples to 160 manure and 80 guano respectively. I'd still posit that the way to go is seed-sourced guano for manure crops.

(i also failed to mention bucket of poop, for one tile you'd need 2 buckets of poop, with five uses per stage, and for 2x2 farms you'd need 8. I leave it to you to decide whether that's worth the 16 logs and 8 bone shards you're also investing into a single harvest.)

[Jakepeng99]

Cooking corn should give 2 popcorn.

Egg plant needs reworked.

[Wormboi]

6 hours ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Cooking corn should give 2 popcorn.

Egg plant needs reworked.

cooking four corn in crook pot should give you a bag of popcorn

[Popian]

20 hours ago, GetNerfedOn said:

the demand is still really high

I forgot to mention that the last nutrient point can be failed as well for 75% cost. Personally I'd do 6-8 with feeder crops in the other slots.

On the topic of a stronger/denser source, guano tea is a thing. The recipe could reuse a bottle like growth formula and a waterballoon (preferable if extra uses come directly with the craft). I don't think that would be strong enough to stop one from using other sources as reducing surplus (if there is one) is an incentive.

[benfroyobro9381]

I think the crop balance and crockpot dishes are the biggest issues for me. Crops like corn, eggplant, etc, don't have great crockpot dishes or aren't decent cooked. Too many farm crockpot dishes give less hunger or health than almost all efficient crockpot ingredient combinations. Farm plots also take significantly more upkeep than other intentionally farmable food sources like lure plants, berry bushes, banana bushes, kelp, etc, so it makes the worst crops even less desirable. 

Klei please make carrot cake a thing your staple veggie doesn't have a unique crockpot dish to my knowledge

[GetNerfedOn]

On 5/21/2024 at 9:57 AM, Popian said:

I forgot to mention that the last nutrient point can be failed as well for 75% cost. Personally I'd do 6-8 with feeder crops in the other slots.

On the topic of a stronger/denser source, guano tea is a thing. The recipe could reuse a bottle like growth formula and a waterballoon (preferable if extra uses come directly with the craft). I don't think that would be strong enough to stop one from using other sources as reducing surplus (if there is one) is an incentive.

that's something i didn't consider given i overprovide to ensure giants (and then leave the farms for a day on some errand and return to find a single nongiant crop has risen up in protest of their unhealthy living conditions XD) i'll have try it out just so i can be sure myself, but one cycle less of fertilizer is a significant cut in costs. many thanks!

On 5/20/2024 at 4:47 PM, Jakepeng99 said:

Cooking corn should give 2 popcorn.

Egg plant needs reworked.

On 5/20/2024 at 11:36 PM, Wormboi said:

cooking four corn in crook pot should give you a bag of popcorn

this makes sense given a piece of popcorn provides less health than raw corn. perhaps popcorn bags could be sanity food that increases in effectivity when eaten when anything is attacked in front of the player.

Eggplants to me are fine; they were the 20hp heal everybody slept on and continues to sleep on given they stack to 20.

Speaking stacking to 20, pumpkin getting nothing but five more health when cooked and stacking to 20 raw is scuffed; its recipe being a sanity food with less hunger value less so, but i find myself wanting a little more value given how much value pumpkins provide outside of recipes.

On 5/21/2024 at 11:17 AM, benfroyobro9381 said:

I think the crop balance and crockpot dishes are the biggest issues for me. Crops like corn, eggplant, etc, don't have great crockpot dishes or aren't decent cooked. Too many farm crockpot dishes give less hunger or health than almost all efficient crockpot ingredient combinations. Farm plots also take significantly more upkeep than other intentionally farmable food sources like lure plants, berry bushes, banana bushes, kelp, etc, so it makes the worst crops even less desirable. 

Klei please make carrot cake a thing your staple veggie doesn't have a unique crockpot dish to my knowledge

We could have a vegetable version of Meaty Stew that serves as a more powerful option than Ratatouille; the problem with that though being that most vegetables already provide 1 veg anyway...