Super-Compact Metal Volcano Tamer

[blakemw]

1 hour ago, Prince Mandor said:

Also, I again rediscovered a way to build glass towers. It needs 8 solid tiles of not-glass material in 3x3 square without one side tile...

So like this:

Works well, seems like it'd be a good strategy when starting on "Flipped" if the magma sea is continuous, because the tiles can simply be pushed up through the magma sea making a dry column, a perfect insulator too.

[Prince Mandor]

On 6/18/2024 at 11:34 AM, Saturnus said:

Is there a problem leaving the pipes inside the tiles for the verticall aeroglass tiles? Just reuse them for the cooling loop, or ignore that they exist

 

Problem -- no. May be esthetic slightly. But on your pictures you don't have them, so I asked about it.

On 6/18/2024 at 12:14 PM, blakemw said:

So like this:

Works well, seems like it'd be a good strategy when starting on "Flipped" if the magma sea is continuous, because the tiles can simply be pushed up through the magma sea making a dry column, a perfect insulator too.

Exactly. But for me 100mg of glass is worth less than building door and automation, so I just build one solid tile where is bottom tile of your door. This way first bottle come to second tile (top tile of your door), filling it, and all other bottles go to tower. May be duplicant needs to stay one tile higher to have line of sight.

Well, flipped usually have a path through magma, but if not -- this can be used. Also, glass have higher melting point than magma temperature, so even random debris mistakenly placed on top don't ruin it.

I remember, I done ice glasses (cups, not material) with magma inside. But cannot understand why it doesn't work now, ice just disappears in my experiments

[Saturnus]

12 hours ago, Prince Mandor said:

Problem -- no. May be esthetic slightly. But on your pictures you don't have them, so I asked about it.

I did have them though
Even if I make something in debug, I (almost) always make it precisely the same way I'd do it in survival. 

[Prince Mandor]

On 6/21/2024 at 12:26 AM, Saturnus said:

I did have them though

I specifically asked about horizontal part, I cannot get straight horizontal line from pipe above. As Blakemw explained to me, it may depends on game simulation speed, so where you had bottles falling down exactly same distance, forming line, I got jigsaw instead.

Yes, your builds is mostly perfect and easily buildable, not saying a word against it

[Zarquan]

On 6/4/2024 at 12:52 PM, Saturnus said:

Why so needlessly big? 

Obviously joking around a bit but if you are playing with aeroglass why not go all the way?

EDIT: I actually one-upped the build below to not require liquid on top of the build by leaving the 1840kg granite tile that is in the corner and making a 400kg steel tile instead of the metal. The granite tile serves as a massive thermal mass for the ST. And the 400kg steel is obviously better than 100kg at maintaining temperature when the 170c-ish metal rail block enters it. And added a cycle sensor to cut down of sweeper runtime. See image at end of post.

   

New image

I didn't do this because I wanted to avoid the heat deletion bug where a liquid solidifies on a piece of debris and I wanted the metals to be cool enough to be carried by dupes.  

But I could possibly use your build and  put a layer of liquid uranium in the room with temp shift plates to quickly cool the iron, but the iron would still be too hot for unsuited dupes to carry.

[Zarquan]

On 6/24/2024 at 5:06 AM, Prince Mandor said:

I specifically asked about horizontal part, I cannot get straight horizontal line from pipe above. As Blakemw explained to me, it may depends on game simulation speed, so where you had bottles falling down exactly same distance, forming line, I got jigsaw instead.

Yes, your builds is mostly perfect and easily buildable, not saying a word against it

What I do is I try to pause the game the moment the bottle comes out.  If you click the pause button and press space simultaneous at normal speed, you can advance the simulation one tick at a time.  Do that a few times, it will almost always create the tiles in the right spot.  The same idea applies to replacing tiles around a vacuum or a pool or liquid.

I built my aerogel volcano tamers in survival.  I also have taken to running heavi-watt wire through aerogel to get it in to steam rooms.

[Zarquan]

On 6/18/2024 at 3:14 AM, blakemw said:

So like this:

Works well, seems like it'd be a good strategy when starting on "Flipped" if the magma sea is continuous, because the tiles can simply be pushed up through the magma sea making a dry column, a perfect insulator too.

Have you tried replacing the mechanical airlock with a pneumatic door?  I find the game hates to put plumbed bottles in pneumatic doors.

[blakemw]

14 hours ago, Zarquan said:

Have you tried replacing the mechanical airlock with a pneumatic door?  I find the game hates to put plumbed bottles in pneumatic doors.

I did not understand this to work, as I've previously used pneumatic doors partially embedded in natural tiles (to make a 1 tile wide door without mods), and I just tried it again and heat game cheerfully put the bottle inside the pneumatic door creating a partially embedded door. 

[Zarquan]

12 hours ago, blakemw said:

I did not understand this to work, as I've previously used pneumatic doors partially embedded in natural tiles (to make a 1 tile wide door without mods), and I just tried it again and heat game cheerfully put the bottle inside the pneumatic door creating a partially embedded door. 

Odd, because I could not get the game to do it in my 7 person rocket.  I had to use the hydroponic tile trick instead.  Maybe it is when the pipe is behind the door?  I'm not sure.

 

[thegroundbelow]

On 5/16/2024 at 5:30 AM, blakemw said:

That's pretty nice. I can't say I'm a fan of loops though, I always prefer to use a Conveyor Meter to just emit small packets of metal that don't loop, because they are small (like 0.5 kg) they reach thermal equilibrium instantly, and it's easy to counterflow them past the exhaust water Valved down to 1 kg/s.

For example in this case, 2 Aluminium Tiles of Counter-current heat exchanger (Aluminium Tiles and Aluminium Pipes) drops the temperature of the Aluminium to 102 C, while the 1 kg/s of exhaust water enters at about 150 C.

This is using the exhaust water to remove more of the heat from the aluminium instead of paying for the Aquatuner to do it. Using 2 tiles of heat exchange produces a significantly better result than only 1 tile of heat exchange, but even a single tile of heat exchange with the exhaust water will likely produce a better result than exchanging heat with the steam, as in the aluminium temperature will be reduced to something like 120 C instead of something like 160 C before paying the Aquatuner for further cooling.

I often use this technique and it's typically easy enough to integrate the 1 or 2 heat exchange tiles into the access lock so it doesn't even really increase width. And the Liquid Valve could be integrated into floors or walls by exploiting aerogel.

Saturnus, I'm not even going to try to beat you on size, though I will say that the solid steel natural tile feels like more effort than anyone would really go to for a practical tamer. Still crazy even with the liquid on top.

I couldn't help but take this concept Blake posted and play with it a bit, though. My go-to tamer for years now has been this design from /u/maneatingape, and I've yet to find a volcano it couldn't handle. I wanted to try combining the two, make it self powered and squeeze out as much cooling as possible, while trying not to make the footprint significantly bigger.  I've only had a chance to test it on a gold volcano so far, but for the gold volcano you don't even really need the meter. Even with 20kg packets it'll spit out 15C gold with no external power. I didn't manage to keep the access lock for the steam room, but that wasn't really high on my list of priorities

The fact that sensors, conveyor meters, and valves all work while entombed is seriously useful! I was able to sneak a pipe thermo sensor in under the AT (the setup from Blake's post was not working great for me) and embed the conveyor meter in the glass tiles between the steam room and the turbine room.

Overlays in the spoiler

Spoiler

edit: The weakness I've discovered with this design is that if you set the packet size too small on the conveyor meter, then the AT drains the battery of power before all of the gold has finished being actively cooled. I'd recommend a packet size of like 3-5 kg. All in all I think the active cooling addition isn't really worth it, but being able to build it as a standalone self-powered module is nice.

[Saturnus]

Quote

Saturnus, I'm not even going to try to beat you on size, though I will say that the solid steel natural tile feels like more effort than anyone would really go to for a practical tamer. Still crazy even with the liquid on top.

It's just a deconstructed door using the old metal natural tile trick.
Here's just a mechanical instead of manual door to get a 400kg instead of a 200kg natural steel tile.

Quote

The fact that sensors, conveyor meters, and valves all work while entombed is seriously useful! I was able to sneak a pipe thermo sensor in under the AT (the setup from Blake's post was not working great for me) and embed the conveyor meter in the glass tiles between the steam room and the turbine room.

Now we're getting into the dubious territory that borders on being too cheesy for me but definitely noted.

[thegroundbelow]

21 hours ago, Saturnus said:

It's just a deconstructed door using the old metal natural tile trick.
Here's just a mechanical instead of manual door to get a 400kg instead of a 200kg natural steel tile.

Oh, duh. Okay, that puts it firmly back in reasonable territory.

[Zarquan]

On 8/10/2024 at 9:44 PM, thegroundbelow said:

Saturnus, I'm not even going to try to beat you on size, though I will say that the solid steel natural tile feels like more effort than anyone would really go to for a practical tamer.

It's funny you should say that because after I learned pipes and other buildings interact thermally with glass aerogel and can make them evaporate, I've been making my aerogel out of steel and tungsten...

It is harder than glass, but definitely obtainable.  You use a kiln and have it make stuff for a while in a vacuum.  It doesn't overheat, so it keeps getting hotter until it melts.  Then I make a pump and get some in to a pipe using a technique similar to the link below.  I also only ever have to do this once, as I can always load my rockets with 1000 g of molten tungsten in a pipe, good for 10000 aerogel tiles.