Simplifications to Stress Mechanic

[Magheat2009]

Currently, there are a lot of sources of stress in the game. Dupes will get stressed on having a full bladder and dupes will get stressed on having low oxygen. This makes sense thematically. However, from the perspective of game-play and balancing, this is bad.

Dupes running around with full bladder will cause indirect stress anyway, so there is no need to add a stress de-buff there. Similar argument can be made for low oxygen. The player is already incentivized to solve bathroom issues and low oxygen, there is no need for further mechanic on top of that.

Games are much easier to balance when there is a limited number of things going on. Games are also made easier to understand when there is less going on. Oxygen Not Included is pretty complex as is. This bloated stress sources makes it hard for devs to balance the stress mechanic.

In my opinion there need to be limited, clear sources of stress problems. This would make stress much more easy to understand and thereby manage while also increasing the incentive to not get dupes wet and mopping the floor. Problems which otherwise player would not solve or pay attention to, these are-

1. Low Morale: 3.5% per cycle for each morale point below required morale. No more than 25% per cycle on normal difficulty. (Probably same, cannot confirm)
2. Soggy Feet: 10% per cycle for 0.3 cycles
3. Sopping Wet: 15% for 2 cycles (Liquid Locks, my precious)
4. Popped Eardrums: 20% for 2 cycles
5. Toasty Surroundings: 10% per cycle for the duration of the exposure.
6. Soiled Suit: 20% per cycle for the duration of exposure.
7. Sunburn:10% for 2 cycles (Dupes wont sunburn inside rockets)
8. Disturbed by Wailing
9. Eye Irritation: 10% per cycle for 0.2 cycles with each exposure (Only with Chlorine, keeping in mind that NH4 will block the bright and cheerful stress reduction)

Please keep in mind showering gets rid of all de-buffs. Duration of some negative effects is expanded to 2 cycles to make showering more relevant.

Dead Tired (being interrupted in sleep) should cause decreased stamina recovery, not stress. While mourning is somewhat thematic, I prefer the old morb spawning mechanism, as it introduces a potential source of slime-lung even in the late game. Mourning can also precipitate an early game death spiral.

There is under-explored idea in the game of focusing on ways of reducing stress. To make this come into effect, additional morale related stress reduction has been taken out. I will recommend following sources of morale decrease-

1. Pleasant Chit-chat: -5% per cycle for 0.4 cycles. Not available if one of the dupes crosses 60% on stress.
2. Seen-a-friend: -5% per cycle for 0.4 cycles
3. Bright and Cheerful: -10% per cycle for the duration of exposure. Lux requirement reduced from 40,000 lux to 1000 lux, increasing the importance of lighting. Bright and cheerful will always be available in the rocket. 
4. Carpet Tiles: -20% stress per cycle for the duration of running on them.
5. Sleeping: -20% per cycle for the duration of the sleep.
6. Mechanical Surf-boat: -5% per cycle for one cycle.
7. Sauna: -15% per cycle for 1 cycle. 
8. Jukebot: -10% per cycle for 1 cycle. Wattage decreased to 960 Watts. (Hint: Use four toilets)
9. Game Arcade: -20% per cycle for duration of the exposure, used as long as downtime lasts.
10. Vertical Wind Tunnel: -15% per cycle for one cycle. 
11. Hot Tub: -20% per cycle for one cycle.

Under this system, it should be possible to run duplicant a few points below requirement for sometime if there is adequate amount of stress reduction. Low morale is a problem one would still have to solve eventually.

Overjoyed Reactions should replace passive stress decrease as reward for morale above requirement. There should be a 5% chance for a duplicant to be overjoyed for each morale point above requirement.

It is worth mentioning that message table is almost always accessible to save the day in case of high stress, even inside some rockets. Also, keep in mind, a duplicant having a stress reactions is not the end of the world.

Under this proposal, soiled suit, low morale and soggy feet remain the only sources of possible stress in rockets, making it hopefully quite manageable.

Under this proposal, soaking wet is the most scary source of stress early game, as it should be. Who likes to move around in cloth drenched in water for an entire day.

 

 

 

 

[Knurek]

For me devs already made it perfect. I love it the way it is.

[Primalflower]

i'm sorry but i don't see the point

[Magheat2009]

5 hours ago, Primalflower said:

i'm sorry but i don't see the point

I will probably record a video on this at some point when I find time. It is hard to get the point across in written format.

To put it different words, the game makes it hard to think clearly about stress. It is hard to read as there are too many sources of stress gain. Managing stress is an uncommon or non-existent game-play style. Stress is mostly seen as a side-dish to morale. Stress and Morale are supposed to be different, but related mechanics. Currently, low morale outshines most sources of stress.

[sakura_sk]

23 minutes ago, Magheat2009 said:

Stress and Morale are supposed to be different

Why? The game connects them and you need both to manage stress. Why do they need to be different? High morale gives stress reduction that lets you manage most stress sources. If it can't do that, there is massage clinic and other things that straight up reduce stress

[Magheat2009]

4 hours ago, sakura_sk said:

Why do they need to be different?

Right now Stress is to Morale what Scalding is to Heat. If you look at the game carefully, stress is supposed to be much more than that. It is supposed to be a larger mechanic. Passive stress reduction from morale above requirement is boring. Setting up a sauna or avoiding the few sources of stress, is much more dynamic. In the change I have proposed, 0 stress is achieved by playing the game ok, not just as a by-product of cooking too much BBQ.

The aim I have is to help make the game more dynamic. To make all aspects of it come forth and shine. Not to make it harder. I have provided specific argument as to why stress won't be hard to manage under the scheme I have proposed.

[sakura_sk]

4 hours ago, Magheat2009 said:

I have provided specific argument as to why stress won't be hard to manage under the scheme I have proposed.

I don't see that. What I see is stress getting "easier" which an option you already have when you start a map. Managing stress is already balanced enough and not because of BBQ.

[Sasza22]

Whenever i get a stressed dupe it`s usually the digger since he needs a tier 3 skill to be useful and keeps going into liquids and areas with high pressure. Most of the time my base gets stressed is when a random area causes pooped eardrums. The fix is to find that spot and deal with it rather than improve food.

Improving food is long lasting so it allows me to assign more skill points to dupes. Meanwhile temporary stress sources can be dealt with restricting movement or buiulding an emergency massge bed when the dupe gets too stressed.

The thing i don`t like about the system is decor bombing. IMO it looks goofy to have a single area with insane decor to bring the average high.

[asurendra]

Right now stress means nothing. While you keep good moral it compensate all sources of stress. And keeping good moral is easy as usually dupes do not need many skills to learn. 

Besides that we have so many sources of direct stress relief like smelling flowers or carpet in bedroom... And devs keep adding more. Big brain ruine, new brackene, they all give dupes -stress buff, which is not necessary on that stage of game. Even with maximum difficulty. 

Actually I want devs to add more stress sources. At least give me option to set basic stress higher tham +20 so I have to use this new mechanics, not just ignore them

[Magheat2009]

4 hours ago, asurendra said:

Actually I want devs to add more stress sources.

The problem I have with this, is it makes it hard to parse the game. Right now, if you ever click on a dupe stressing out, the game hits you with 9 different values which are hard to understand. I will rather have limited but more impactful sources of morale. I will also take out the above morale requirement passive stress relief, so that there is more reason to use buildings like Jukebox or Water Cooler (Brackene) to give dupes stress relief. I agree with you, it is much more interesting that way, without making the game hopefully not much harder.

[asurendra]

2 hours ago, Magheat2009 said:

The problem I have with this, is it makes it hard to parse the game. Right now, if you ever click on a dupe stressing out, the game hits you with 9 different values which are hard to understand. 

Well, you dont need to understand them. Its much easier to add stress relief than removing stress sources. Most of them ad 1-2% per cycle which can be ignored. 

I understand your point. So much info can terrify new players who dont know what is important. Morale system surely needs rebalance, it doesnt works as it is. 

[Magheat2009]

1 hour ago, asurendra said:

Its much easier to add stress relief than removing stress sources. Most of them ad 1-2% per cycle which can be ignored. 

That is a very good point.

[Charletrom]

I love how the stress system works, would love it even more if diseases and low HP caused stress too. That way you would need to build hospitals to avoid stress reactions.

 

 

[cyberwarlord]

Agree with more everything: challenges make it fun, multiple solutions make it interactive. Game mechanics having multiple uses makes it interesting.(example: Still think floral germs should go inert on solids an liquids for more use) 

Few ideas-random stress encounters as challenges or punishment for messing up. Dupes insulting each other instead of socialize sometimes or when highly stressed. Trip sometimes when soggy feat. Shock themselves working on live wires or when sopping wet. Doing dirty jobs. Touching dangerous or dirty material without a suit. Mad or hungry Critters biting. Fall damage!

1 hour ago, Charletrom said:

I love how the stress system works, would love it even more if diseases and low HP caused stress too. That way you would need to build hospitals to avoid stress reactions.

 

 

 

On 8/9/2023 at 11:53 AM, asurendra said:

Well, you dont need to understand them. Its much easier to add stress relief than removing stress sources. Most of them ad 1-2% per cycle which can be ignored. 

I understand your point. So much info can terrify new players who dont know what is important. Morale system surely needs rebalance, it doesnt works as it is. 

 

On 8/9/2023 at 4:36 AM, asurendra said:

Right now stress means nothing. While you keep good moral it compensate all sources of stress. And keeping good moral is easy as usually dupes do not need many skills to learn. 

Besides that we have so many sources of direct stress relief like smelling flowers or carpet in bedroom... And devs keep adding more. Big brain ruine, new brackene, they all give dupes -stress buff, which is not necessary on that stage of game. Even with maximum difficulty. 

Actually I want devs to add more stress sources. At least give me option to set basic stress higher tham +20 so I have to use this new mechanics, not just ignore them

 

On 8/8/2023 at 10:58 AM, Sasza22 said:

Whenever i get a stressed dupe it`s usually the digger since he needs a tier 3 skill to be useful and keeps going into liquids and areas with high pressure. Most of the time my base gets stressed is when a random area causes pooped eardrums. The fix is to find that spot and deal with it rather than improve food.

Improving food is long lasting so it allows me to assign more skill points to dupes. Meanwhile temporary stress sources can be dealt with restricting movement or buiulding an emergency massge bed when the dupe gets too stressed.

The thing i don`t like about the system is decor bombing. IMO it looks goofy to have a single area with insane decor to bring the average high.

 

[Henlikuoth]

I agree the stress system should be more diverse and interactive with regards to many mechanics.

I usually use the highest difficulty when it comes to stress (+20% stress per cycle).

But once high morale, food, and atmo suits are established, the stress factor practically disappears.

No challenge = no fun.

Maybe the developers can make the stress mechanics depend on the difficulty setting. 

Then people who feel overwhelmed by a difficult stress system can simply stay on default (or lower).

Having said that, the difficulty settings should be improved overall anyway, as I mentioned in another post.