Maxwell rework is so disappointing...

[Hyperpsychic]

I'm VERY disappointed with Maxwell rework...

First of all Maxwell always was my favorite character and this rework was the most anticipated for me so I can say that I'm very disappointed because this rework had the greatest potential as Maxwell is a very important character and his background allows him to get great and funny ideas but what we get was not even half of what he deserved and it's so hard not to compare him to characters like Wickerbottom and Wanda that are SO more powerful and gives sense of "unique", sense of "I want to play with that character because they are funny and increndible", it's really hard not to compare him with so successful characters because Maxwell is so important and deserved so much more.

With exception from the pillar and the new shared inventory system all the other changes feels like "quality of life" changes or tottaly disposable changes. Wickerbottom has EIGHTEEN books that can be charged with no cost, Wanda can globaly teleport with the party, evade damage, is a powerhouse in battle, infinite ressurress with almost NO COST and Maxwell can... imprison mobs and get some items from anywhere... and still having the most controversial disadvantage from them (75 HP) common... this is barely fair.

The AI from the puppets stills terrible and they die fast as they are summoned, even now that we can spam they are not even close to compare with Abigail, Berny, Spiders, traps, catapults, weremoose Woody, even the Bees of Wickerbottom can do same and this is only ONE of her books and it does the same as supposedly one of the best features of the character.

This rework lacks of versatility, options, fun and power. The things that Maxwell has now are nice, but he deserved so, so much more.

I like this character so much that many years ago I created a rework concept for him here in this forum
 

And in the beginning of this year I finished another one (this one is not translated but for now you can use google translate if interests you)

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vQIiGEozmI7FhdzkHxTE3z2r86ei565xUXvn03iTt8_6MeNBlZT4BXrmWWx9zbcuUoRzf_GZcdth2ct/pubhtml?fbclid=IwAR0Il6Cls4nMKyFqXN3oKgCDSS9A4PMcE-CRiUaGkikbqujm5G9eA_YU-r4

Please I'm not saying that I have created a better rework, I'm not arrogant to think that my mere anotations is above you guys that work with this for so much time and give us the content and comunity we all love to be in, I'm only showing the love that I have for this character and how much I was waiting for this day, I'm trying to show how much more this character deserved.

Please make Maxwell great, powerful, inviting as characters that we already have in the game because if one character deserves to be all this that character is Maxwell, don't let his enormous potential be wasted like that.

[Frosty_Mentos]

The utility of his shadow prison is insanely good if you know how to use and time it properly, you practically just spam minions and the cage and all of it will do your work for you.

Maxwell before refresh was always a gatherer character while also a sort of a stage magician, the magic hat and all fitting him quite well. His gimmick is 'summon minions to do your bidding' and that's all he he has to kinda do and stand back to be effective. Nothing's out of place for him.

Can't complain about Wicker books tho, cause Maxwell easily can use all of her books whenever he wants. He's even more powerful if you live on the moon island which means infinite casts of any spells he wishes.

[-Nick-]

For this update to be good in my opinion is to KEEP the old minion mechanics. (The infinite minions tied to your sanity. That follow you around.) 

The codex changes i love. Its just the minions that suck. 

 

[Hyperpsychic]

56 minutes ago, Frosty_Mentos said:

The utility of his shadow prison is insanely good if you know how to use and time it properly, you practically just spam minions and the cage and all of it will do your work for you.

Maxwell before refresh was always a gatherer character while also a sort of a stage magician, the magic hat and all fitting him quite well. His gimmick is 'summon minions to do your bidding' and that's all he he has to kinda do and stand back to be effective. Nothing's out of place for him.

Can't complain about Wicker books tho, cause Maxwell easily can use all of her books whenever he wants. He's even more powerful if you live on the moon island which means infinite casts of any spells he wishes.

The utility is only good, even if you spam the minions the mobs can kill them easily, but I already said that this feature is good as the shared inventory but they are really the only things that really matter in the rework. Oh Please Maxwell is not even close of Wickerbottom, Wickerbottom can do much more and her books is nerfed for Maxwell to use and first of all is HER books, you saying that Maxwell can read Wicker books only proves the point that he is not even close to her by yourself. And his gimmick is summon minions but all of her minions can easily be substituted by other characters and features

[Darkysz]

i hope klee see this post

[Hyperpsychic]

On 11/5/2022 at 1:35 AM, Darkysz said:

i hope klee see this post

Yeah, the duelist changes were nice and I really think they are in a great position right now but yet I hope Maxwell can get new features that gives to him more versatility.
Two more unique magic options already would be great.

[Copyafriend]

Honestly? No. I think maxwell is in a good place now. 
 

he isnt a spellcaster, hes a magician. Not a mage or warlock or whatever, hes a one trick pony, he has ONE magic book. Its a strong book, but only 1, and its clearly not that important, charlie let him keep it, she could have easily stolen it. Clearly the codex umbra just let him communicate with THEM and use shadow magic. It isn’t actually all that important outside of that plot relevant purpose. It served its use, maxwel can keep it if he really wants. 
 

it makes sense that wickerbottom is more versatile with magic, she has like 18 different books. 
 

it makes sense that the magical weremoose is tough and strong, have you ever SEEN a moose, they’re bigger than a car!

honestly maxwell being important to the plot has nothing to do with whether he should be strong or not. Honestly if the codex umbra was all that important maxwell probably wouldnt be allowed to keep it

[Necwilt]

Man Im fully agreed with you...Maxwell is my favorite character and I have been waiting for this moment so long but...I mean what they did to him is great, but it just feels like he deserves so much more. With Wickerbottom rework they added so many cool ideas for her books and potential for Maxwell is actually enormous. At least I would like to see more spells for him, some damage spells as well. Also maybe some unique stuff for magic items, buffs for them, etc. 

[Dragonboooorn]

1 minute ago, Copyafriend said:

honestly maxwell being important to the plot has nothing to do with whether he should be strong or not.

Wrong.

Maxwell was and still is the expert on the shadow fuel. He was portraited powerful in game as npc, in animation shorts and well damn in general. Wolfgang is strong with physical related stuff because hes simply build diffrent than other survivors, and do workouts now and then. Wanda is time lord or whatever, she can teleport and for some reason have best weapon in the game, she is portraited as strong character, one that can manipulate time itself.

Some characters just stronger than others, and Maxwell is definitly not the weakest one, nor he should became one. 

[Copyafriend]

3 minutes ago, Dragonboooorn said:

Wrong.

Maxwell was and still is the expert on the shadow fuel. He was portraited powerful in game as npc, in animation shorts and well damn in general. Wolfgang is strong with physical related stuff because hes simply build diffrent than other survivors, and do workouts now and then. Wanda is time lord or whatever, she can teleport and for some reason have best weapon in the game, she is portraited as strong character, one that can manipulate time itself.

Some characters just stronger than others, and Maxwell is definitly not the weakest one, nor he should became one. 

Maxwell may wel BE a master of shadow magic, but he isnt shown to be powerful at all unless he is currently on the macguff- i mean nightmare throne. Which is implied to give virtually limitless control over the constant and some unquantifiable yet large amount of power. In fact i can’t remember a single short with maxwell in it where he’s doing something other than shadow puppets, he doesnt even summon the hands. Which are a staple of shadow magic.

 

as a matter of fact he couldn’t even scare away a REGULAR SPIDER post nightmare throne, hes just a regular dude right now with shadow magic and a body weakened from its use

[Gi-Go]

1 minute ago, Copyafriend said:

In fact i can’t remember a single short with maxwell in it where he’s doing something other than shadow puppets, he doesnt even summon the hands. Which are a staple of shadow magic.

 

That one time he created the strongest character in the game for lolz. 

[Dragonboooorn]

Just now, Copyafriend said:

Maxwell may wel BE a master of shadow magic, but he isnt shown to be powerful at all unless he is currently on the macguff- i mean nightmare throne. Which is implied to give virtually limitless control over the constant and some unquantifiable yet large amount of power. In fact i can’t remember a single short with maxwell in it where he’s doing something other than shadow puppets, he doesnt even summon the hands. Which are a staple of shadow magic.

 

as a matter of fact he couldn’t even scare away a REGULAR SPIDER post nightmare throne, hes just a regular dude right now with shadow magic and a body weakened from its use

Because for some reason Klei prefer to put on screen Webber, Wes or Wendy. 

Since RoT chain update started every character changed too. They got "evolved", some might even say its character devolopment.

Woodie almost got control on curse thanks to Wickerbottom, Webber  learned how to embrace his nature side and even transform spiders with cookies somehow? Every character grown up since DS, sence DST is a sequel. 

Maxwell changed as a person, you can see that in his DST quotes. With the help of the Wickerbottom, Wortox, and heck, maybe even The Moon or Charlie he got more powerful too.

Why do I get a feeling that you have something personal against Maxwell?

[Copyafriend]

2 minutes ago, Gi-Go said:

 

That one time he created the strongest character in the game for lolz. 

That one time the CODEX UMBRA (or THEM lmao) with no assistance from maxwell (he was passed out) created the strongest character in the game to SAVE maxwell. Who couldn’t save himself

3 minutes ago, Dragonboooorn said:

Why do I get a feeling that you have something personal against Maxwell?

Why on earth would i have something personal against a fictional character?

 

honestly theres just no logic behind the “why maxwell not OP” posts.

He’s relevant to the plot not a god of magic

[Dragonboooorn]

2 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

He’s relevant to the plot not a god of magic

Who da hell Wanda is and why she is the best character in the game

[SullyD]

24 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

Honestly? No. I think maxwell is in a good place now. 

wow, you really hate Maxwell, this is very clear to see reading all your other posts, tell me Sir, do you play Maxwell? What is balanced for you? It is a co-op game, you talk as if it is some kind of competition

[Copyafriend]

2 minutes ago, Dragonboooorn said:

Who da hell Wanda is and why she is the best character in the game

Time wizard who got ahold of shadow magic (probably through maxwell or goggle man) shes the best because she’s a glass cannon, and at high play glass cannons are inevitably the best fighters. also cheaper teleportation (time AND space)

any other questions 
 

3 minutes ago, SullyD said:

wow, you really hate Maxwell, this is very clear to see reading all your other posts, tell me Sir, do you play Maxwell? What is balanced for you? It is a co-op game, you talk as if it is some kind of competition

I dont, i have strong opinions about characters growing stronger as time (irl) goes on.

 

its not a COMPETITION per se, but balance needs to exist in every game, smashing everything with ease isnt a fun survival game. Frankly if dont starve was easy i wouldnt play it. 
 

You’re the one comparing maxwell to every other character like he doesnt stack up

[Gi-Go]

7 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

honestly theres just no logic behind the “why maxwell not OP” posts.

He’s relevant to the plot not a god of magic

There is no logic behind freaking out that 15 shadows can take down deerclops, but being completely okay with Wanda's ability to outrange any raid boss in a cage. I guess 2 player combinations are allowed no matter how busted they are? 

[Dragonboooorn]

2 minutes ago, SullyD said:

wow, you really hate Maxwell, this is very clear to see reading all your other posts, tell me Sir, do you play Maxwell? What is balanced for you? It is a co-op game, you talk as if it is some kind of competition

Totally right. DST as survival game is long time dead, its about megabasing and doing end game stuff. In most rework the characters got only huge buffs with very small nerfs or no downsides at all. I have no idea why some characters should get only buffs and some only nerfs to the state the character became bleak and unplayable anymore

[Gi-Go]

4 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

Time wizard who got ahold of shadow magic (probably through maxwell or goggle man) shes the best because she’s a glass cannon, and at high play glass cannons are inevitably the best fighters. also cheaper teleportation (time AND space)

any other questions?

Yeah, one. Have you ever played her?

[Copyafriend]

2 minutes ago, Gi-Go said:

Yeah, one. Have you ever played her?

Of course i have, i described her perfectly.

but you just wanted to be snippy :^)))

[Gi-Go]

6 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

Frankly if dont starve was easy i wouldnt play it. 

Suddenly, everything you ever said makes sence now. Have a great day. 

[Dragonboooorn]

5 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

shes the best because she’s a glass cannon, and at high play glass cannons are inevitably the best fighters

More like impossible to hit cannon. She have watches that tp her back avoiding most of the attack, a heal clock which STOPS taking damage first and then healing. Oh did I mentioned increased range attack of her clock?

What does exactly makes her GLASS canon when she have all the tools not only to deal huge amount of damage, but also dont get hit too?

[Gi-Go]

Just now, Copyafriend said:

Of course i have, i described her perfectly.

but you just wanted to be snippy :^)))

Bluntly speaking I think you are bad at the game. There is nothing wrong with that, it's all about having fun, but you really shouldn't argue about balance if you haven't mastered the game yet. My opinion that is. 

[Hyperpsychic]

1 minute ago, Dragonboooorn said:

Because for some reason Klei prefer to put on screen Webber, Wes or Wendy. 

Since RoT chain update started every character changed too. They got "evolved", some might even say its character devolopment.

Woodie almost got control on curse thanks to Wickerbottom, Webber  learned how to embrace his nature side and even transform spiders with cookies somehow? Every character grown up since DS, sence DST is a sequel. 

Maxwell changed as a person, you can see that in his DST quotes. With the help of the Wickerbottom, Wortox, and heck, maybe even The Moon or Charlie he got more powerful too.

Why do I get a feeling that you have something personal against Maxwell?

I really refuse to discuss with copyafriend as he is clearly trying to sabotage Maxwell rework in literally every topic that I see him participating. I need at least some credibility do start a discuss. All the other Maxwell real fans and myself include are giving some ideas and thoughts about what we were expecting for our very favorite character and this is what matters.
Don't Starve Together is NOT a game for tryharders, if you discuss with people that play survival games you will find that even now DST is a game that most people find difficult to play and is a very punishing game for begginers, if you want real difficult experince you can play with mods that do this for you, you can configure your own server difficult.
Maxwell is literally the most important character in DST right now, he literaly appears in almost every animated short, this rework deserves to be outstanding and no matter what I will buy the Maxwell Pack that will be sold with the rework launching because he is my favorite character and I think nothing will change that, also I love to support Klei as they are a great developer company and nothing will change that too.

[Dragonboooorn]

2 minutes ago, Hyperpsychic said:

copyafriend as he is clearly trying to sabotage Maxwell rework in literally every topic that I see him participating.

A words well spoken. Couldnt say better myself