Dupe motion sensors are awesome but annoying

[Greybear]

I love the new sensors and hook them up to all my lights. However, the area they trigger within is locked, making it hassle to set them up, sometimes they cover too much and often they don't cover enough. Allowing us to set our own range, maybe a radius between 1-10 would really improve the experience. 

Also, the artwork is too big for my liking - I have them all over the place and they are very aesthetically invasive. 

But thanks for adding them - they're awesome. 

[metallichydra]

i use them for turning my lights of near my science machines, but i rarely survive long enough to actually use them for other stuff

[Nightinggale]

What we need is adjustable width of the detection zone. When decreasing the width, increase the range. The player can then pick if it should be detecting an area, a row (like on stairs) or something in between.

[Lilalaunekuh]

Call me old fashioned, but with the current range of duplicant motion seensors:

 

I am still preferring and using weight plates (with filter/buffer gates) to trigger lights or activate checkpoints.

Spoiler

I don´t want an equal amount of sinks and lavatories just to be 100% sure everyone is washing their hands.

=> I use a weight plate under the left tile of my sink with a duplicant checkpoint

1

 

[Nightinggale]

3 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

I am still preferring and using weight plates (with filter/buffer gates) to trigger lights or activate checkpoints.

What I learned from designing my own sensors is that you can have two sensors to complete the same task, there are cases where otherwise identical sensors can't provide the same.

A good example is the item temperature sensor. You can set it to above 0 K. Since it's 0 K with no item, it will tell if there is an item, hence doing the same job as a pressure plate sensor. However since the item temperature sensor isn't part of the floor, it can be placed in mid air and make an automation spike whenever there is a falling item. Alternatively it can detect items lying on a horizontal door meaning it can be used to let items fall through the door, but otherwise keep it closed due to gas leakage.

Having a bunch of sensors is fine. Allowing a certain amount of overlap, hence have situations where multiple different sensors can provide the same signal is fine. What you should pay attention to would be the cases where two sensors would not be interchangeable. If you can find such cases, then both sensors are justified.

Keep in mind that all sensors are optional. You don't have to use a sensor just because it's in the game. Dupe sensors make sense if you want to detect over an area. Pressure plate sensors makes sense if you want to fill the room with pumps to keep it a vacuum as gas can "hide" on the motion sensor. Motion sensors will not falsely trigger on something dupes have dropped on the floor. This means the two sensors aren't interchangeable in a number of cases. However in the cases where they are, feel free to use whatever you want. There is no wrong way to set up sensors if what you do provides the automation signal you want.

[Lilalaunekuh]

10 minutes ago, Nightinggale said:

What you should pay attention to would be the cases where two sensors would not be interchangeable. If you can find such cases, then both sensors are justified.

My point is that in the current state there is not much(/not enough) to justify the duplicant motion sensor.

 

12 minutes ago, Nightinggale said:

Pressure plate sensors makes sense if you want to fill the room with pumps to keep it a vacuum as gas can "hide" on the motion sensor. Motion sensors will not falsely trigger on something dupes have dropped on the floor.

If you put a weight plate under the door of a room, you will register if a duplicant enters or leaves.

(The door will push everything to one side while closing, so there is no prolonged false positive.)

Why should I use maybe 3+ motion sensors to cover a whole room, instead of checking if someone enters/leaves.

 

=> I really love the idea of a motion sensor, but the current implementation doesn´t really fit.

[Nightinggale]

2 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

If you put a weight plate under the door of a room, you will register if a duplicant enters or leaves.

(The door will push everything to one side while closing, so there is no prolonged false positive.)

Why should I use maybe 3+ motion sensors to cover a whole room, instead of checking if someone enters/leaves.

Two dupes run into the room together. One leave. You now have one dupe in a room your sensor setup have detected as dupe free. There is currently no door sensor, which can detect dupes in a room without ever detecting incorrectly. Dupe sensors are more reliable in that aspect.

I once proposed a sensor, which counts dupe passes. +1 for one way and -1 for the other way. Add that sensor, set it at the door and set it to above 0 dupes. If that sensor is on the only path in and out of the room, then you can detect for certain if there are dupes in the room. The problem is, nobody coded that sensor (yet), be it Klei or in a mod.

[Lilalaunekuh]

5 minutes ago, Nightinggale said:

Two dupes run into the room together. One leave. You now have one dupe in a room your sensor setup have detected as dupe free. There is currently no door sensor, which can detect dupes in a room without ever detecting incorrectly. Dupe sensors are more reliable in that aspect.

Sure you can find a case where it doesn´t work, but you can overcome these problems.

(Duplicant checkpoints, restricted access for just specific duplicants, keeping just a single active errand in the room ...)

=> Not saying my detection is perfect, but at least I can make it work errorless.

 

9 minutes ago, Nightinggale said:

I once proposed a sensor, which counts dupe passes. +1 for one way and -1 for the other way. Add that sensor, set it at the door and set it to above 0 dupes. If that sensor is on the only path in and out of the room, then you can detect for certain if there are dupes in the room. The problem is, nobody coded that sensor (yet), be it Klei or in a mod.

Loving this idea, it should replace the current duplicant sensor.

[Nightinggale]

21 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

Loving this idea, it should replace the current duplicant sensor.

There is no need to remove an already implemented and working sensor. By now people would miss it and it's free to keep.

The problem with a "walk by counter" sensor isn't the idea. It's simple enough. The problem is actually implementing it. What we have to work with are the events of dupes entering and leaving the sensor cell. If we add the dupe facing direction at the time of those two events, then we can figure out the direction of traveling... or can we?

Let's make it simple. Every time a dupe enters the cell, it count one for the facing direction. It works when a dupe enters from left and exits right. What is a dupe enters from left and exits left? What if a dupe enters or exits up or down? What if a dupe dies on the cell? What if there are multiple ways to get into the room and the sensor detects 700 dupes entering the room and none leave? (even if it's the same dupe each time. It doesn't remember specific dupes). What if there are 5 dupes in the room when the sensor was added? What if there was 0 dupes when it was added?

It's a simple idea by concept, but less simple to implement. Maybe that's why Klei didn't implement it despite most likely having read my suggestion. I know it's all those cases, which have made me not implement it myself despite having released lots of mod created sensors.

[Lilalaunekuh]

2 minutes ago, Nightinggale said:

It's a simple idea by concept, but less simple to implement.

Just use 2 motions sensors close to each other.^^

You can use a buffer connected to one of the sensors so only if a duplicant passes in a specific direction both sensors will be active together. (To prevent duplicants sneaking by you can use some checkpoints or limit the possible errands in an area.)

I´ve done similar builds using weight plates to count duplicants entering or leaving an area.

 

=> So the current motion sensor doesn´t really provide more tools to automate stuff than we already had.

(If the sensor could be set to register a minimum duplicant count inside the covered area like the critter sensor, or if we would be able to change the range/ use different motion sensors with altered properties, then it would allow us to build "new" or currently "impractical" solutions.)