A simple germ killer that processes a continuous full pipe of input.

[Tonyroid]

1 hour ago, hpongledd said:

No plastic. No powers. Does the same

Ah, I see. It's not terribly complicated but it's not exactly "simple", and that's the trade-off. They all have strengths and weaknesses. Look at the lengths you have to go to avoid using a germ sensor to sense germs just because it has plastic in it.

Did you see the new one I put up a couple posts ago with no plastic and no power?

[Yunru]

17 hours ago, Tonyroid said:

without having to keep all the reservoirs full.

It's not like that's hard. Have the output prefer to loop back to the input, but the input takes priority.

[Tonyroid]

12 minutes ago, Yunru said:

It's not like that's hard. Have the output prefer to loop back to the input, but the input takes priority.

What happens to the output while the input is taking priority? If you make it stop completely then there's no exit from the system. If you make it redirect somewhere else then the reservoir doesn't fill. If you change the strategy so you share the pipe with the input then you don't get 10kg/s throughput. There are, of course, ways to deal with these things, and the way I know that you've never actually tried to design one is that you said "It's not like it's that hard". 

[Yunru]

1 minute ago, Tonyroid said:

What happens to the output while the input is taking priority? If you make it stop completely then there's no exit from the system. If you make it redirect somewhere else then the reservoir doesn't fill. If you change the strategy so you share the pipe with the input then you don't get 10kg/s throughput. There are, of course, ways to deal with these things, and the way I know that you've never actually tried to design one is that you said "It's not like it's that hard". 

It goes where it's supposed to. The feedback loop just ensures the buffer stays full. 

It's really not that hard, so I postulate that you may be the one who has failed to try it. 

[Tonyroid]

4 minutes ago, Yunru said:

It goes where it's supposed to. The feedback loop just ensures the buffer stays full. 

It's really not that hard, so I postulate that you may be the one who has failed to try it. 

If the exit goes somewhere else then it's draining the reservoir. If you are draining the reservoir as fast as you fill it, then all it is is an big piece of pipe that accomplishes nothing. You have to come up with a way to make the reservoir drain slower than it fills, and once it's full, you have to come up with a way to prevent the reservoir from blocking your 10kg/s of input. I posted two designs in this thread, let's see yours.

[Yunru]

Just now, Tonyroid said:

If the exit goes somewhere else then it's draining the reservoir. If you are draining the reservoir as fast as you fill it, then all it is is an big piece of pipe that accomplishes nothing. You have to come up with a way to make the reservoir drain slower than it fills, and once it's full, you have to come up with a way to prevent the reservoir from blocking your 10kg/s of input. I posted two designs in this thread, let's see yours.

Okay, here's a brief mock-up (of the feedback loop, not the whole thing) that took less time to design than the game took to boot:

As you can see, something as simple as a length of pipe and two bridges insures that the buffer only empties as it fills.

[Tonyroid]

34 minutes ago, Yunru said:

Okay, here's a brief mock-up (of the feedback loop, not the whole thing) that took less time to design than the game took to boot:

As you can see, something as simple as a length of pipe and two bridges insures that the buffer only empties as it fills.

Here's an animated gif of your design failing miserably. The reservoirs are nothing but glorified pipe segments, just like I said before I even saw it. If there is more to this disinfector that somehow makes it work, I would very much like to see it.

 

[Yunru]

4 minutes ago, Tonyroid said:

Here's an animated gif of your design failing miserably. The reservoirs are nothing but glorified pipe segments, just like I said before I even saw it. If there is more to this disinfector that somehow makes it work, I would very much like to see it.

 

... That's exactly how it's supposed to work. You get exactly as much out as you put in. You just negated to fill the buffer before connecting the output. 

 

EDIT: In fact, I'm still testing, but this setup seems to work perfectly:

Just remember to have the reservoir full of germ-free pwater before you hook up anything to it's output.

[Nightinggale]

3 minutes ago, Yunru said:

... That's exactly how it's supposed to work. You get exactly as much out as you put in. You just negated to fill the buffer before connecting the output. 

That's a very important detail, which wasn't clear in your previous posts. I was thinking "That's won't work" because I predicted... well precisely what happens in the gif. If everything is packed full from the start then.... yeah it could work.

[Yunru]

2 minutes ago, Nightinggale said:

If everything is packed full from the start then.... yeah it could work.

Initial testing is optimistic. So far roughly 7750kg of pwater with ~1,000,000 germs has passed through a single reservoir without keeping any germs.

[Tonyroid]

6 minutes ago, Yunru said:

... That's exactly how it's supposed to work. You get exactly as much out as you put in. You just negated to fill the buffer before connecting the output. 

1 minute ago, Nightinggale said:

That's a very important detail, which wasn't clear in your previous posts. I was thinking "That's won't work" because I predicted... well precisely what happens in the gif. If everything is packed full from the start then.... yeah it could work.

Ah, so the weakness of this method is that you have to pre-fill the reservoirs and it won't handle a large load of germs. I know everyone likes it their own way but I'm not keen on either of those.

 

[Yunru]

Just now, Tonyroid said:

Ah, so the weakness of this method is that you have to pre-fill the reservoirs and it won't handle a large load of germs. I know everyone likes it their own way but I'm not keen on either of those.

Umm... no?

You have to pre-fill it yes, but so far it's easily handling a million germs.

[Tonyroid]

Just now, Yunru said:

Initial testing is optimistic. So far roughly 7750kg of pwater with ~1,000,000 germs has passed through a single reservoir without keeping any germs.

I've done enough of this to know that you won't continuously disinfect a full pipe with 1,000,000 germs per tile without 3 reservoirs. Maybe you need a bit more germs than that, but it's very close.

[Yunru]

3 minutes ago, Tonyroid said:

I've done enough of this to know that you won't continuously disinfect a full pipe with 1,000,000 germs per tile without 3 reservoirs. Maybe you need a bit more germs than that, but it's very close.

Well I'm currently waiting for the germs to grow to denser numbers, but it is continuously disinfecting a full pipe with 1,000,000 germs per tile on a single reservoir.

Of course, should it be insufficient, adding another reservoir should hardly complicate matters.

[Nightinggale]

4 minutes ago, Tonyroid said:

Ah, so the weakness of this method is that you have to pre-fill the reservoirs and it won't handle a large load of germs. I know everyone likes it their own way but I'm not keen on either of those.

It can handle a large amount of germs. What happens is 10 kg goes into the first reservoir and the germs is now in 5000 kg. When the 10 kg leaves, it takes 10/5000 or 0.2% of the germs with it. Do that 2-3 times and due to rounding germ free water comes out. The germs are left in the reservoir, which are then killed by chlorine.

[Tonyroid]

16 minutes ago, Nightinggale said:

It can handle a large amount of germs. What happens is 10 kg goes into the first reservoir and the germs is now in 5000 kg. When the 10 kg leaves, it takes 10/5000 or 0.5% of the germs with it. Do that 2-3 times and due to rounding germ free water comes out. The germs are left in the reservoir, which are then killed by chlorine.

I'm trying it with 6,000,000 germ ph2o. I get about 20,000 germs in the second reservoir and 40 germs per bubble in the output pipe. That seems about on par to me for what I expected. I'm still not so sure you are going to get much more than 1mil.

Edit: Naw, apparently 2 reservoirs are better than I thought, I'm getting it clean with 4million germs.

Another Edit: Okay, seriously, about 1mil germs is all you can disinfect at 10kg/s with 2 reservoirs.

[Yunru]

1 minute ago, Tonyroid said:

I'm trying it with 6,000,000 germ ph2o. I get about 20,000 germs in the second reservoir and 40 germs per bubble in the output pipe. That seems about on par to me for what I expected. I'm still not so sure you are going to get much more than 1mil.

How are you getting 6mil germs?! 

Just waiting is taking forever, and I can only paint up to 1 mil. 

[Tonyroid]

1 minute ago, Yunru said:

How are you getting 6mil germs?! 

Just waiting is taking forever, and I can only paint up to 1 mil. 

I've been messing with these designs for a couple days so I have a sandbox ready.

[Yunru]

Right, well I just started playing around in debug mode, and with 6 million germs it does break down. 

[Nightinggale]

3 minutes ago, Tonyroid said:

I'm trying it with 6,000,000 germ ph2o. I get about 20,000 germs in the second reservoir and 40 germs per bubble in the output pipe. That seems about on par to me for what I expected. I'm still not so sure you are going to get much more than 1mil.

Great, you quoted me before I fixed the typo. Now it looks like I don't know math

40 per bubble will certainly turn to 0 with one more reservoir. The question is if there is a realistic setup where more than 2 reservoir will be needed.

[Yunru]

Test results are in, two reservoirs can handle at least 6 million germs per packet, if you need that much. 

[Tonyroid]

8 minutes ago, Nightinggale said:

Great, you quoted me before I fixed the typo. Now it looks like I don't know math

40 per bubble will certainly turn to 0 with one more reservoir. The question is if there is a realistic setup where more than 2 reservoir will be needed.

I had a thing happen a few days ago in an early-game base where my water all had 40,000,000 germs per tile. Nothing really came of it and I have no idea where it came from, but I know it happens.

1 minute ago, Yunru said:

Test results are in, two reservoirs can handle at least 6 million germs per packet, if you need that much. 

No. Dude, no. I edited my edit in that post. I was testing with 6mil germs per tile of ph2o, not per packet, and also I was wrong. I have it narrowed down to 1mil to 1.5mil of germs per tile. It's hard to pin down exactly.

[Yunru]

6 minutes ago, Tonyroid said:

No. Dude, no. I edited my edit in that post. I was testing with 6mil germs per tile of ph2o, not per packet, and also I was wrong. I have it narrowed down to 1mil to 1.5mil of germs per tile. It's hard to pin down exactly.

Well I can post you my save, because my setup is handling it fine, as the pictures show.

IT WORKS MUHAHAHA.sav

[Tonyroid]

4 minutes ago, Yunru said:

Well I can post you my save, because my setup is handling it fine, as the pictures show.

IT WORKS MUHAHAHA.sav

No. Not possible. Not unless you just discovered something unintentionally. I think it's more likely that you meant something different than what you typed. Did you really mean to say 6,000,000 germs per packet? Does "packet" mean something different to you than it does to me? Or maybe you left out an important detail, like... did you add more reservoirs? I made the mistake of thinking it works better than it does like... literally a few posts ago, and now I know for sure it can't handle that much.

[Yunru]

Just now, Tonyroid said:

No. Not possible. Not unless you just discovered something unintentionally. I think it's more likely that you meant something different than what you typed. Did you really mean to say 6,000,000 germs per packet? Does "packet" mean something different to you than it does to me? Or maybe you left out an important detail, like... did you add more reservoirs? I made the mistake of thinking it works better than it does like... literally a few posts ago, and now I know for sure it can't handle that much.

Ah, fair point. Packet's only have a fraction of the content of the tile. As the save will probably reveal.