It's an Alpha for sure.. my issues 30hours in.

[Bussaca]

So, I didn't want to throw a bug report in. I'm sure most of these have been known. So, i understand i'm just screaming into the darkness here.

I fully understand this is an Alpha, and it's gonna have some problems. Here's my 2 cents.

I don't know if this is a management game or some sort of Pavlovian social experiment, to see how many people will keep pushing the button, without a reward.. If the point is to lose no matter your skill or understanding of the mechanics.. WHATS THE POINT.. I can beat my head against a wall hoping for skittles to come out for FREE. Rant sorta over.

Everything is designed as a monkeys paw, NOTHING has a positive benefit. there's managing an overly complex system, hitting prat-falls, minefeilds and obstacles, and then this seems more like a system designed with only 1 outcome.. that might be fun for a little.. very little.

I'm glad to hear you've released a patch with some fixes (hopefully) and more implementations of features, to make the game even more complex..

My suggestion, please fix things before you add more layers.

Pipe bridges that don't work. or are hit or miss, they'll work over there but not here for reasons

I had a giant pool of semi-contaminated water (happens when endless pissing/vomiting occurs) (I understand that's a game style as well, to me it seems inevitable) so I pumped it all thru a filter and back where it came from.. problem is the pump will drain the pond, and the filter only gives 20:1 back. I'd understand if there was a boiling process (implicitly stated), but it filters with a sand medium.. so how i can lose 3/4 of the water put in.. boggles my mind.

Then there are the duplicates themselves. I'm not asking for AI.. but some sense of self preservation might be nice. you have a button (code red) that will make them ignore everything till the point of dying. I ask why, they do that already. They will IGNORE a level 9 priority EVEN when EVERYTHING else is set to 1. For 90 cycles they would not load sand into a water filter, despite 30,000kg of sand available to them, despite me demolishing every other task on the map they would NOT load sand into the one thing that would save thier lives..

another suggestion. setting a priority is NOT enough.. You NEED to be able to individually micromanage them at times.. YOU grab some sand GO over there, PUT IT IN THE GOD DAMB FILTER.. 30 duplicants just content with drinking their own piss, endlessly putting contaminated water on algae piles..

They will prioritize the musher, algae piles, slime distillers, endlessly loading them with bad water..if you destroy that task they will find another.. meanwhile ignoring the one thing you have set at level 9..

It's more than frustrating..

At the start of a game a duplicant will fill up some water, go get some dirt, go to a musher, and make some food, 60-90 cycles in, this is a 5-6 trip effort. I got TOOONNNNs of dirt, and plenty of water, but it will take 6-10 tips for water, and 4-6 trips for dirt.. FOR A SINGLE MUSH BAR... either a bug, or designed that way..

Any particular reason why we cant fry licebars? or why we would BOTHER even growing lice at all.. is one better than the other (minus the extra tips to the bathroom).. only benefit i can see is less trips to the musher, at least they can just pick the lice off the tree and eat, when they're hungry.

It's also not really a management game if you're NEVER supposed to stay in one place.. in fact it's NIGH impossible.. you must continually keep moving and expending what little to no resources there are.. all the while knee deep in piss and vomit.. That sounds like a FUN game.

water mechanics that boggle the mind as well. oh you made it a point to make sure piss drips every where.. as if these guys hold 30 gallons of water, way more than they intake.. but if you plan on a collection point it never really settles, but sticks to the walls.. negating the pumps at the bottom, almost avoiding them all together..

why does mopping destroy the water, I've mopped before, i usually come home with water.. i wouldn't drink it.. but my bucket has the liquid i mopped. 300 gallons of piss in a room, disappears.. un-storeable, un-cleanable, just more nuisance than anything..

I want, so bad to like this game..

It isn't challenging, it's an uphill battle, in knee deep yellow snow, both ways, the whole time kicking you in the balls..

fix it.. you will lose more players than you will gain, and this sentiment will get out.. driving potential customers away.

But I know.. It's an alpha, these are all bugs and not design/gameplay flaws.

I will wait with baited breath.

P.S. when does the game update in steam.. still haven't been able to try the THERMAL update yet..

Thank you for letting me get that off my chest.

Bussaca

[Masterpintsman]

4 hours ago, Bussaca said:

P.S. when does the game update in steam.. still haven't been able to try the THERMAL update yet..

Go to steam library, right-click ONI, properties, betas, select thermal_upgrade_preview.

[Ecu]

4 hours ago, Bussaca said:

I don't know if this is a management game or some sort of Pavlovian social experiment, to see how many people will keep pushing the button, without a reward.. If the point is to lose no matter your skill or understanding of the mechanics.. WHATS THE POINT.. I can beat my head against a wall hoping for skittles to come out for FREE. Rant sorta over.

The journey is the point.  What would be the purpose of surviving forever without change because you became perfectly stable and there was no way to lose?  At that point, you no longer have a journey.  Instead, I feel it is a whole lot more interesting to play as long as I can manage to survive.  When my colony eventually perishes, I have a story to tell.  The next time I play, my world isn't quite the same and as such can present different challenges and therefore a different story.

---

Reading through the rest of your post it sounds like a combination of running into potential bugs (which should be reported, including save and screenshots) and gripes about the intentional gameplay style.

Things like limited AI control, challenging stress and resource management, etc. are all intentional aspects of the game.  To be completely honest, games like ONI tend to be more appealing to engineers and simulation fans.  You can see a lot of parallels between ONI and games like Dwarf Fortress or RimWorld.  They are challenging colony management games where you will (generally speaking) lose more than you ever win.

I bring this up because many of these complaints you have come off as if you don't like these various aspects of the game.  Given that these aspects are obviously intentional and not mistakes, I can only feel like maybe it's not an issue with the game.  Not every game will appeal to every player and perhaps this one just doesn't appeal to you as much as you thought it would.

[Sepequ]

1 hour ago, Ecu said:

I bring this up because many of these complaints you have come off as if you don't like these various aspects of the game.  Given that these aspects are obviously intentional and not mistakes, I can only feel like maybe it's not an issue with the game.  Not every game will appeal to every player and perhaps this one just doesn't appeal to you as much as you thought it would.

I think you hit the right spot here. Not every person likes every game, so if your tastes or appeals for a particular game aren´t satisfactory enough, move on. At least is the best option, especially in a early alpha game like this. ^^

[Yokhen]

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

I don't know if this is a management game or some sort of Pavlovian social experiment, to see how many people will keep pushing the button, without a reward.. If the point is to lose no matter your skill or understanding of the mechanics.. WHATS THE POINT.. I can beat my head against a wall hoping for skittles to come out for FREE. Rant sorta over.

I kinda take it as "how far can you take it": the further, the greater the achievement; but I reckon we need some sort of win condition, like reaching the outside of the asteroid or something just to achieve closure. Kinda like in Factorio you have the rocket launching, even though the game can continue even after that, it still provides closure.

I am currently on my 280th cycle and going strong (just need to find one a few more geysers before my water supply runs out by turn 400). If you are having very short games, you are going to need to revise your strategy, so git gud. Because a long game is achievable.

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

 

Pipe bridges that don't work. or are hit or miss, they'll work over there but not here for reasons

That's the first I've heard about it. In my personal experience they always work, although their status as a building instead of a pipe is kind of annoying.

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

At the start of a game a duplicant will fill up some water, go get some dirt, go to a musher, and make some food, 60-90 cycles in, this is a 5-6 trip effort. I got TOOONNNNs of dirt, and plenty of water, but it will take 6-10 tips for water, and 4-6 trips for dirt.. FOR A SINGLE MUSH BAR... either a bug, or designed that way..

Yeah that IS an issue. Strength never gets leveled up I don't know why.

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

Any particular reason why we cant fry licebars? or why we would BOTHER even growing lice at all.. is one better than the other (minus the extra tips to the bathroom).. only benefit i can see is less trips to the musher, at least they can just pick the lice off the tree and eat, when they're hungry.

The musher will drain your water supply faster than women changing their mind, while plants will only consume fertilizer which can be produced from your poop.

Why can't fry licebars? I don't know, they probably just haven't implemented it yet. The Food department in general is lacking A LOT of content and tuning. There is an entire gameplay style dedicated to avoiding the use of fridges and microbe mushers (which is the best one since it doesn't spend water and electricity needlessly).

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

It's also not really a management game if you're NEVER supposed to stay in one place.. in fact it's NIGH impossible.. you must continually keep moving and expending what little to no resources there are

I think you just defined "management" in that last sentence.

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

all the while knee deep in piss and vomit

Yeah, that's why you just must not let it get to that point at all costs otherwise, unless you are incredibly skilled and savvy, it's game over.

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

water mechanics that boggle the mind as well. oh you made it a point to make sure piss drips every where.. as if these guys hold 30 gallons of water, way more than they intake.. but if you plan on a collection point it never really settles, but sticks to the walls.. negating the pumps at the bottom, almost avoiding them all together..

I am not sure what it means that it "sticks to the walls" for it's never happened to me, but you sound like you would do well with simply moping it and/or adding mesh tiles to your rooms.

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

why does mopping destroy the water, I've mopped before, i usually come home with water.. i wouldn't drink it.. but my bucket has the liquid i mopped. 300 gallons of piss in a room, disappears.. un-storeable, un-cleanable, just more nuisance than anything..

Yes, MESH Tiles.

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

fix it..

Yes, I support the idea, although...

15 hours ago, Bussaca said:

you will lose more players than you will gain

I disagree with this idea, some of us enjoy a certain level of masochistic yet solvable challenge (a category in which this game falls under)