Lore question

[Hi.]

Can some please explain what the caves are? Maxwell says that it was just him and the nightmare creatures when he arrived which really doesn't make any sense because the ruins still exist in game and if there was truly nothing left then the ruins wouldn't be there. Im assuming Tenebrau or whatever that portal thing destroyed most of the world except for alter and maxwell doesn't know too much about lunar magic so maybe he didn't know that alter existed? idk I could be really wrong thats why im asking the fourms. (also maxwell said he plugged the cave entrances so maybe he built over the ruins?)

[Jakepeng99]

57 minutes ago, Hi. said:

Can some please explain what the caves are? Maxwell says that it was just him and the nightmare creatures when he arrived which really doesn't make any sense because the ruins still exist in game and if there was truly nothing left then the ruins wouldn't be there. Im assuming Tenebrau or whatever that portal thing destroyed most of the world except for alter and maxwell doesn't know too much about lunar magic so maybe he didn't know that alter existed? idk I could be really wrong thats why im asking the fourms. (also maxwell said he plugged the cave entrances so maybe he built over the ruins?)

In solo DS, the ruins are canonically a third layer deeper so it’s possible they existed before him

[-Variant]

1 hour ago, Hi. said:

Maxwell says that it was just him and the nightmare creatures when he arrived which really doesn't make any sense because the ruins still exist in game and if there was truly nothing left then the ruins wouldn't be there.

He's talking about the Throne Room specifically!

The Throne room is, quite literally, just dust.
The only thing you can find there are player made structures, and Maxwells own statues.
If you were to apply his quote to the Constant itself, everything falls about entirely. Half the mobs and stuff we see in-game predate Maxwell showing up. The Forge predates him. Ruins all predate him. The entire cave system, the clockwork army made by the Ancients even predate him. Its true he's made plenty in the world, but it was a thriving ecosystem far before he showed up.

[gaymime]

25 minutes ago, -Variant said:

He's talking about the Throne Room specifically!

The Throne room is, quite literally, just dust.
The only thing you can find there are player made structures, and Maxwells own statues.
If you were to apply his quote to the Constant itself, everything falls about entirely. Half the mobs and stuff we see in-game predate Maxwell showing up. The Forge predates him. Ruins all predate him. The entire cave system, the clockwork army made by the Ancients even predate him. Its true he's made plenty in the world, but it was a thriving ecosystem far before he showed up.

hm, i was pretty sure he made the clockworks himself based on what he says about them? i know he takes personal responsibility for the piles and i think the bishop

 

also the way time works in the constant it seems that once something comes into being it is if it had always been there meaning there could be many, many threads of history that weaves in and out of being(wanda also gives this some merit as well)

Edited February 28 by gaymime

[ZeRoboButler]

4 hours ago, gaymime said:

hm, i was pretty sure he made the clockworks himself based on what he says about them? i know he takes personal responsibility for the piles and i think the bishop

Based off his quote for the archives fountains of knowledge...

It seems that what ever bits of information he could gather, and the fact he probably got some knowledge on the throne (or the codex umbra for that matter) on how to read ancient text, he probably made some assumptions. I believe the ancient guardian also has something similar in the sense that what ever he is supposed to look like, nightmare fuel has changed his appearance or strengthened it in some way, more apparent now that A.G. has a second form.

Edited February 28 by ZeRoboButler

[gaymime]

8 hours ago, ZeRoboButler said:

Based off his quote for the archives fountains of knowledge...

It seems that what ever bits of information he could gather, and the fact he probably got some knowledge on the throne (or the codex umbra for that matter) on how to read ancient text, he probably made some assumptions. I believe the ancient guardian also has something similar in the sense that what ever he is supposed to look like, nightmare fuel has changed his appearance or strengthened it in some way, more apparent now that A.G. has a second form.

that is true! (by the way i do feel a bit of a way that he apologies for the death of the guardian and calls it his friend)

[-Variant]

19 hours ago, gaymime said:

hm, i was pretty sure he made the clockworks himself based on what he says about them? i know he takes personal responsibility for the piles and i think the bishop

The most likely case is that he's taking credit for them, especially repairing them. It makes a bit more sense in that context.

There's entire biomes and rooms outright called Military zones filled to the brim with old broken down clockworks, and clockwork piles. We see Ancients bringing about the clockwork gears in the murals as well. What makes the most sense to me is that whilst Maxwell was on the throne, he took and repaired the pieces and placed them on the surface.


If he made them all, it makes the thousands we find underground a lot more confusing seeing as how they're littered across the ancients homeland and in such disrepair.
Some quotes could go either way, I feel. Like the bishop and piles. I choose to read them as him being proud of repairing them, and not finishing their repair job.


HOWEVER he also outright states someone else built them!