Can't wait for when Willow gets rebalanced

[SilverSpoon]

2 minutes ago, astareus said:

I disagree with that. Why are we removing combat interaction? I guess Klei WANTS that for certain characters, but not for others.

OK, I actually think Willow's moonfire is a bit OP, but it's been so long since it was implemented that players have become familiar with it. My conclusion is better to leave it as it is, even if it's a bit OP insted rather than taking it away now and making players unhappy.

I can't agree with you, but I also don't think your opinion is wrong.

[Wawchik]

22 minutes ago, astareus said:

Absolutely ridiculous to want to ban someone from saying their opinion just because it goes against what you believe. Imagine if it was the opposite and people were trying to silence you for just having an opinion?

This just shows me you haven't actually used the skill.

Once, with any character. That's not balanced. You can most definitely kill the celestial champion being a noob if you just have someone telling you what to do. It's mostly tasks and repeated patterns, not that difficult. Also, you have to consider multiplayer, which makes it even more easy.

Why should killing the celestial champion once make you a powerhouse overpowered character that completely negates the fighting aspect of MOST creatures in the game instead of actually making it easier to get to CC?

Again, I am reiterating it here, It's better for Klei to make the journey to CC quicker, than to completely destroy mobs and creatures with a blast, removing any further interaction with that character. And also, why only Willow? Other character's perks in skill trees are definitely not as useful as this one, no matter what they do and how differently they do it.

They're not a noob if they kill CC, you can't kill one of the two strongest bosses in the game after just watching a guide, the game is not this easy. And what mobs do you even use the lunar flames on? Spiders? There are many aoe options in the game to do that. Beefalos? They drop meat and wool, which lets be real aren't some insanely valuable loot and you can kill them one by one pretty fast anyway. Like the only boss this skill is better against than shadow flame is bee queen and fw 

[Swiyss]

18 minutes ago, SilverSpoon said:

OK, I actually think Willow's moonfire is a bit OP, but it's been so long since it was implemented that players have become familiar with it. My conclusion is better to leave it as it is, even if it's a bit OP insted rather than taking it away now and making players unhappy.

I can't agree with you, but I also don't think your opinion is wrong.

So how long would it take for you to eat up anything they put up in a plate?

7 minutes ago, Wawchik said:

They're not a noob if they kill CC, you can't kill one of the two strongest bosses in the game after just watching a guide, the game is not this easy. And what mobs do you even use the lunar flames on? Spiders? There are many aoe options in the game to do that. Beefalos? They drop meat and wool, which lets be real aren't some insanely valuable loot and you can kill them one by one pretty fast anyway. Like the only boss this skill is better against than shadow flame is bee queen and fw 

I know they're not a noob anymore if they kill cc, but my noob friend can kill cc if I'm next to him showing him what to do. This just shows how the game is more trial and error and then 'try again' rather than plain difficulty (aside from the fuelweaver fight).

And about the other mobs? Well, frogs, spiders, pigs, hounds, bees, volt goat, grass geckos, tallbirds, any ocean enemy far away from you, dfly larvae, beefalo, depth worms etc.. All of them are a joke if you prepared a stack of embers on the go. And if not overpowered enough, 95% of them can be set on fire beforehand to get additional damage AND some embers back (recycling).

[Keller Max]

When was the last time Klei nerfed a character?

[DVGMedia]

4 hours ago, astareus said:

I disagree with that. Why are we removing combat interaction? I guess Klei WANTS that for certain characters, but not for others.

thats why there just needs to be consistency.  there shouldn't be weaker trees or stronger trees there should be a consistency of whats established.

There shouldn't be any argument of overspoweredness because we can only use what we have currently against what currently exists. .
i think its important that the tools get established so that way klei can design challenges that fit with those tools. 

like they can devlope bosses that will rush people that attack from range. to balance things out instead of just removing the tools we have now to fit with what currently exists.

 

Edited May 10, 2025 by DVGMedia

[GrapeVruit]

22 minutes ago, Keller Max said:

When was the last time Klei nerfed a character?

From the top of my head, it was the first iteration of Wolfgang's refresh. They removed his speed, reduced his max health to 200, and made his mightiness tied with a gym and dumbbells instead of his hunger meter. While it could be argued he was much stronger than before, having constant 2x damage and added benefits being mighty, most people on the forums saw this as a nerf. Heck, even JoeW himself said that Wolfgang needed a bit of a nerf. Though, seeing the strengths of characters nowadays, it's freaking hilarious looking at this in hindsight. 

 

10 minutes ago, DVGMedia said:

thats why there just needs to be consistency.  there shouldn't be weaker trees or stronger trees there should be a consistency of whats established.

While I agree with having trees be equal in strength, I don't know if that'd even be possible. In games where you have multiple characters to choose from, there's always going to be ones that are way better than others and some that are weaker than others, and honestly, I don't think that's entirely a bad thing. If anything, it's inevitable. 

Edited May 10, 2025 by GrapeVruit

[DVGMedia]

10 minutes ago, GrapeVruit said:

While I agree with having trees be equal in strength, I don't know if that'd even be possible. In games where you have multiple characters to choose from, there's always going to be ones that are way better than others and some that are weaker than others, and honestly, I don't think that's entirely a bad thing. If anything, it's inevitable. 

Not really It just depends on what people value.
For some reason people heavily value combat.  The reasoning being that better gear is tied to bosses.
But like the best combat character is wilson because all he has to do is farm meat and blow up everything.

Is it boring? maybe. But its definitely easier than any other combat character.

What really matters is how skills and attributes are approached. Because there are ways to make characters unique and fun without them being super strong.
And klei has really missed out on alot of that for the sake of some concept of balance.

[Nikki Darks]

On 5/10/2025 at 4:44 AM, Balter said:

Okay lets talk about the elephant in the room, Willows firepower, specfically lunar Bidon blast. Compared to everyone else's skill trees this sticks out like a sore thumb and the only reason people aren't addressing it is because they like having an unbalanced character that can blast everything to Ohio, asside from this there is literally no reason why Willow should have a godtier arm cannon, it doesn't even fit into her character.

 

But if they decide to keep this skill, I would suggest changing up the planar damage in which the flames will only deal this extra damage to plant-like mobs to fit more with the constant fire logic.

I lived through the era of useless Willow, and I'd like to enjoy this era of mindlessly OP Willow. 

Please go away and leave us, Willow mains alone.

[Hungry French]

It all depends on the context.
In solo, Willow is a normal single player character. And her boss damage is not bad.
But it's not balanced **** in multiplayer.

[BB Marioni]

willow is fine as she is, burning bernie needs to be more accessible IMHO

[shaurun]

Willow feels OP only in PvP and only with lunar flame. Shadow flame in PvP, just to compare, has problems targeting other players, considering them allies/netral (idk) and thus it requires skill to make it work in PvP (if it's even possiblle at all).

Lunar flame I'm not opposed to nerf, it should make less damage due to AoE, so yes it's still will be valid for BQ and FW, but shadow flame I believe should significantly overdps it. Atm damage of lunar and shadow flames is mostly equal, but since lunar has aoe it's more powerful, despite you have slow movement animation and should position yourself - that's all relatively easy.

But to be honest Willow doesn't have much in the pocket besides dps. Cooking food, free light, Bernie tank - no fast traveling perks, no fast resource gathering, no inventory economy. She is all about being pyromaniac, so let her be. Not OP except lunar flame skill.I hope her Bernie branch will be improved.

[Nikki Darks]

Hot take:

Buff weaker characters instead of nerfing op ones. It's okay to have OP characters as long as you have good characters.

[Hungry French]

4 minutes ago, Nikki Darks said:

Горячий прием:

Усиливайте более слабых персонажей вместо того, чтобы нерфить оп-персонажей. Иметь ОП-персонажей нормально, если у вас есть хорошие персонажи.

Super Hot Take :
We need to weaken everything in the game.

[Mr Giggio]

What I think that will happen in the end of skill trees is - the skills that are lunar and shadow aligned will be unlocked by server which means we will need to kill fuelweaver/CC to access them every new server we join

Those are in general the strong ones and it's quite weird to see a day 1 lunar blast ngl

The skill ain't bRokEN oP but overturned for sure. Locking it behind the  bosskill makes up for how good value it has.

It also attracts the player towards doing those chores and give a sense of reward - which is healthy for the game 

Edited May 19, 2025 by Mr Giggio

[Flarezen]

1 hour ago, Hungry French said:

Super Hot Take :
We need to weaken everything in the game.

mega hot take: remove everyone but wes and decrease his damage even more 

[Wawchik]

1 hour ago, Nikki Darks said:

Hot take:

Buff weaker characters instead of nerfing op ones. It's okay to have OP characters as long as you have good characters.

Just op is eh but strong and fun would be great like Walter and willow

1 hour ago, Mr Giggio said:

What I think that will happen in the end of skill trees is - the skills that are lunar and shadow aligned will be unlocked by server which means we will need to kill fuelweaver/CC to access them every new server we join

Those are in general the strong ones and it's quite weird to see a day 1 lunar blast ngl

The skill ain't bRokEN oP but overturned for sure. Locking it behind the  bosskill makes up for how good value it has.

It also attracts the player towards doing those chores and give a sense of reward - which is healthy for the game 

Lunar blast is strong but there are also weak skills so this probably isn't happening unless they rework some trees. 

[Edible Coal]

hot take: bees should not drop ember or souls

[FreyaMaluk]

DST is not really about balance and the new changes to all characters so far really prove that. I think it is more about offering different ways to play and developing strategies to suit the kind of character and playstyle you enjoy the most. If anything I hope they change Wilson's skill tree cuz it is a bit lacking in the "science" department and doesn't have that many fun features.

[Uedo]

*Narrator* Despite saying they wouldn't take the bait, they took it anyways.

[SilverSpoon]

24 minutes ago, Uedo said:

*Narrator* Despite saying they wouldn't take the bait, they took it anyways.

In the end, it might simply be an intellectual surrender to judge a statement as bait based on who said it, rather than on its actual content.

[Nikki Darks]

2 hours ago, Edible Coal said:

hot take: bees should not drop ember or souls

We found the mandatory Uncompromising player. 

[Bumber64]

Hot take: Buff bees.

With muscles.

[Flarezen]

1 hour ago, Bumber64 said:

Hot take: Buff bees.

With muscles.

give them the old ds attack range

[Uedo]

3 hours ago, SilverSpoon said:

In the end, it might simply be an intellectual surrender to judge a statement as bait based on who said it, rather than on its actual content.

I mean, we can certainly consider that. But it's probably better to make judgements based on common sense. Balter is a s***-poster and rage baiter, so it's unlikely they took a random chance to say how they feel.

The content might be worth talking about, but the likelihood is he wanted this to happen. You both win!

 

[Mr Giggio]

6 hours ago, Wawchik said:

but there are also weak skills

I was talking about only the shadow and lunar align ones

Shadow and lunar blast, for example

Edited May 19, 2025 by Mr Giggio