Okay stupid question. But does anybody think about what happens when you bake stuff into base kit

[Cats_On_Fire]

Like I know we all have ideas on how the game should be balanced but...

 

Rarely does anybody think about replacing said skills for the trees.

Like if we bake in all of Wilson's transmutations by defualt we now have to replace 9 skills. If we bake in wurts basic structures we now have to replace 3. Which is admittedly easier since wurt wants new buildings anyways. (Mermchants missed pun opportunity) And utility.

And removing portability and baking it in is not a big deal.

Idk I think all nerfs are justified especially on the hard end to control the games difficulty. Which I think a lot of the old school don't starve players want. They want to starve in every season and be under constant anxiety and pressure. Which dst has lost some people don't want this. But that can be tuned in beta.

Any skills I missed or things that need to be talked about please leave a response. I am very curious to hear what you all have to say

[Anis5240]

7 minutes ago, Cats_On_Fire said:

Wilson's transmutations by defualt we now have to replace 9 skills

It's 10 bruh. The first thing in the transmute tree was the twig-log transmute.

The problem with what Klei did with his entire skill tree is that they stretch out every possible damn thing in it. Why the hell you need 3 DAMN TIERS FOR EITHER TORCH DURABILITY/BRIGHTNESS ONLY???????? The beard is at least a bit understandable, but I'd prefer more if it's just 2 tiers (25% and 50% for either insulation or growth).

Why the hell they didn't combine the regular ores (flint, rock, gold, nitre) into one tier only??????

[Edible Coal]

2 hours ago, Anis5240 said:

It's 10 bruh. The first thing in the transmute tree was the twig-log transmute.

The problem with what Klei did with his entire skill tree is that they stretch out every possible damn thing in it. Why the hell you need 3 DAMN TIERS FOR EITHER TORCH DURABILITY/BRIGHTNESS ONLY???????? The beard is at least a bit understandable, but I'd prefer more if it's just 2 tiers (25% and 50% for either insulation or growth).

Why the hell they didn't combine the regular ores (flint, rock, gold, nitre) into one tier only??????

you should summon 2 billion willson player out of thin air so klei will compress the skill tree like wendy's

[Cats_On_Fire]

8 hours ago, Anis5240 said:

It's 10 bruh. The first thing in the transmute tree was the twig-log transmute.

The problem with what Klei did with his entire skill tree is that they stretch out every possible damn thing in it. Why the hell you need 3 DAMN TIERS FOR EITHER TORCH DURABILITY/BRIGHTNESS ONLY???????? The beard is at least a bit understandable, but I'd prefer more if it's just 2 tiers (25% and 50% for either insulation or growth).

Why the hell they didn't combine the regular ores (flint, rock, gold, nitre) into one tier only??????

So you want more unique skills 

2 hours ago, SSneaky said:

Because it would make certain things fit better, like willows fire spells (by making embers, ignite, and combustion base kit, it makes her less "she's suddenly a fire mage now")

And you want it for theming cool

[Maxposting]

5 hours ago, Edible Coal said:

you should summon 2 billion willson player out of thin air so klei will compress the skill tree like wendy's

new anis transmutation skill tree unlock confirmed?

[Anis5240]

1 hour ago, Maxposting said:

6 hours ago, Edible Coal said:

you should summon 2 billion willson player out of thin air so klei will compress the skill tree like wendy's

new anis transmutation skill tree unlock confirmed?

Haha, very funny; didn't laugh.

[Frosty_Mentos]

Renewability killed the anxiety, as well as resource abundance made. The game's core anxiety was that resources are limited so we had to find creative ways to farm them, otherwise DLC's existed as worlds we travel for that.

Wilson's skill tree was assumed to be to make him remain mostly the same but with new additions just to have him some resourcefulness. At least that was the idea, he isn't going to be a minion haver, nor he'll be damage character (unless alignment skills count) nor he'll be a gatherer. He is just as he always was, but with minor improvements cause he is the poster child of a useless lost weirdo that can't figure out what he wants to do with his life. So they made him have his torches last long and beard to become a food part storage, cause why not.

Alignment skills for Wilson though are decent only cause I can transmute stupid amounts of pure brilliance with him. Only to be said same for dreadstone...

[Cats_On_Fire]

 

11 hours ago, Anis5240 said:

 

 

6 hours ago, SSneaky said:

 

 

30 minutes ago, Frosty_Mentos said:

Renewability killed the anxiety, as well as resource abundance made. The game's core anxiety was that resources are limited so we had to find creative ways to farm them, otherwise DLC's existed as worlds we travel for that.

Wilson's skill tree was assumed to be to make him remain mostly the same but with new additions just to have him some resourcefulness. At least that was the idea, he isn't going to be a minion haver, nor he'll be damage character (unless alignment skills count) nor he'll be a gatherer. He is just as he always was, but with minor improvements cause he is the poster child of a useless lost weirdo that can't figure out what he wants to do with his life. So they made him have his torches last long and beard to become a food part storage, cause why not.

Alignment skills for Wilson though are decent only cause I can transmute stupid amounts of pure brilliance with him. Only to be said same for dreadstone...

So I need to nerf all the food sources and remove the ability to get more stuff. Gotcha gonna keep this in mind for my next nerf thread.

[Frosty_Mentos]

18 minutes ago, Cats_On_Fire said:

So I need to nerf all the food sources and remove the ability to get more stuff. Gotcha gonna keep this in mind for my next nerf thread.

Yes and no, there's never been issues with food in the game, we just got more variety of it in general. There's resource abundance too since renewability. It all made sandbox of the game more bearable and fun longterm.

[Cats_On_Fire]

6 minutes ago, Frosty_Mentos said:

Yes and no, there's never been issues with food in the game, we just got more variety of it in general. There's resource abundance too since renewability. It all made sandbox of the game more bearable and fun longterm.

Maybe just make less resources available 

[Well-met]

4 hours ago, Anis5240 said:

Haha, very funny; didn't laugh.

can you stop barging in every single thread about how you're upset with wilson?

[Evelo]

Yeah, I have thought about that. Extensively.

Wilson Transmutations - Remove it and replace with anything that does not add new items. Move transmutations to a new crafting station that is accessible by everyone. This would remove him being a "swap" character for only transmuting.

Wormwood - Remove the plant crafts (sans Lureplant) and move them to a new crafting station. (I had a clever name for it but forgot will have to look for what I wrote). This way Wormwood isn't a "swap" character for base builders or people who want to just craft the stuff. Replace it with anything that does something so there is a reason to go down that line. Even if it is something that lets him ally with plant creatures in some way as follower-esque things.

Winona - Make the Pickup talent that you are required to take baseline. Additionally the remote just to power your catapults on and off really should be baseline, another "why make this a talent" thing. Her middle line is awesome with percentage boosts. More of those for everyone please. Love love love them.

Willow - the biggest of "this needs to be baseline". Bake in the new ember spells, Change their utility to be significantly lower. Combustion has a smaller radius or has a cap on the number of targets it can burn. Damage increase from burning frenzy is only 10%. Fireball does not produce sunlight and lasts for 2 minutes. Give her an "ultimate" that maybe just throws a firebomb on a location to deal ranged damage.

Next the skills will buff up the abilities to their current values and the lunar/shadow talents replace her "ultimate". This way players get the rework that is given with the skill tree without locking the new stuff behind skills.

Wigfrid - I have no comments, I think she has a horrible skill tree and it should be completely reworked in my opinion. Given what we have with Upgrades in Walter's slingshot maybe something like that, but she is a performer so maybe not, idk. But for the love of all that is winter, give her the Music Canister baseline, why lock that behind a talent? Seriously?

Wurt - just give her the 3 base buildings and the talents can upgrade them. Not rocket science.

Wolfgang - The skill tree isn't a rework for him in any way.

Woodie - idk. I just wish he had a downside. His skill tree is fine I guess. Nothing needs to be baseline for him realistically.

Wendy - The Picnic Casket. That's it. Just make that baseline and i'm a happy camper.

Wortox - Soul Jars, maybe make a talent related to it so it can hold more souls. People have wanted soul jars for so long, locking them behind a skill seems so weird to me.

Walter - The Woby Training station baseline with upgrades based on how fast the xp gain is, the potency of it, that whole system is awesome but I dislike how it is locked behind skills when it makes him so much more interesting as a whole.

[Juanasdf]

14 hours ago, Anis5240 said:

3 DAMN TIERS FOR EITHER TORCH DURABILITY/BRIGHTNESS ONLY????????

Because this way they make the "strong" perks to need a higher amount of points to unlock and also to limit how many different perks they need to give a certain skill tree, while also giving the player a sense of choice. (to be fair his torch toss skill is not strong, so i get your point on this)

The same thing happened to Wolfgang:
Wolfgang was (arguably) in a perfectly good position until planar enemies were added to the game. The skill tree (like all the rest of the skill trees) aimed to fix his issues, so they gave him planar damage to compensate for the fact that planar defense was subtracting quite a lot of dps from his mighty form.
The problem is Wolfgang would be very good if he had 15 different skills added to his already strong kit (again arguably because i know Wolf is a touchy subject). So instead of giving Wolfgang 15 new abilities for players to choose from they gave him 5 entire points of planar damage when it could have easily been just 1 point, and thus limited wolfgang to only choose 1 or 2 of his new skills... which to be fair weren't too exciting.

Another similar case for points being diluted into 2 or 3 tiers is Woodie and the tree guard idol. A very strong perk by itself but requires you to spend 2 whole points on the previous two tiers that give damage against tree guards only.

EDIT: Realized my point might not be as clear so TLDR:
If they made Wilson's skill tree not divided into tiers, and allowed you to pick 99% of the good perks it would feel very different from other skill trees. They would need to add new skills (which would buff him away from his "0 downsides / 0 upsides" archetype) or dilute others to keep that "sense of choice".

[Anis5240]

1 hour ago, Well-met said:

can you stop barging in every single thread about how you're upset with wilson?

No.

[Anis5240]

1 hour ago, Juanasdf said:

a higher amount of points to unlock

Wow, 6 rot -> 1 poop is most valuable of all transmutes???? You must be joking.

1 hour ago, Juanasdf said:

dilute others

Yes, Klei should do this instead of giving characters "broken OP" things that barely make sense to them.

[Volskygge]

i'll say it til the end, merm culture should be expanded

Maybe they will add something in the future and i'll have to eat my words but until then i'll hope

btw i love mutating merms

[Cats_On_Fire]

1 hour ago, Volskygge said:

i'll say it til the end, merm culture should be expanded

Maybe they will add something in the future and i'll have to eat my words but until then i'll hope

btw i love mutating merms

 We need mermchants and farmerms 

[W0l0l0]

I feel like some standard survivor abilities could have been added into the skill trees instead of additional abilities; it would have been a great way to drip feed us the changes instead of overwhelming us with so much stuff in each character.

It would have been nice to have most characters behave similarly to Wilson and change gradually into who they are via the skill trees. It would just be annoying to do it each time you played on a new server.

And also it technically counts as a nerf so it's outta the question.

[Swiyss]

We allllllllllllllllllllllllllll know that the skill trees are basically reworks number 2 and I'm tired of pretending it's not.

[Masked Koopa]

22 hours ago, Volskygge said:

i'll say it til the end, merm culture should be expanded

Maybe they will add something in the future and i'll have to eat my words but until then i'll hope

btw i love mutating merms

I think Klei should expand Pigs, and then extend the improvements to merms where applicable. They use the same rig for their animations as well as sharing most of their animations, so it wouldn't be too difficult, and Pigs sorely need some attention. This would also let the improvements be usable by every character (and yes that includes Wortox Webber and Wonkey - they can use one man band to hire pigs) instead of giving a single character disproportionate attention.

[Cats_On_Fire]

1 hour ago, Swiyss said:

We allllllllllllllllllllllllllll know that the skill trees are basically reworks number 2 and I'm tired of pretending it's not.

Yeah but also a vast majority of the playerbase doesn't want environment updates. For some reason?

[Cats_On_Fire]

7 hours ago, Masked Koopa said:

I think Klei should expand Pigs, and then extend the improvements to merms where applicable. They use the same rig for their animations as well as sharing most of their animations, so it wouldn't be too difficult, and Pigs sorely need some attention. This would also let the improvements be usable by every character (and yes that includes Wortox Webber and Wonkey - they can use one man band to hire pigs) instead of giving a single character disproportionate attention.

I mean we kinda know thier whole ordeal. The only thing that could maybe be added is pig raids. If we don't trade pig king enough 

[Volskygge]

12 hours ago, Cats_On_Fire said:

I mean we kinda know thier whole ordeal. The only thing that could maybe be added is pig raids. If we don't trade pig king enough 

Also if Wilba appears i'm sure pigs will receive a lot of love, btw loved your idea of raids