For Those That Hate The Flower Armor

[Sustenance]

Ive seen a lot of people calling it weak. originally i didnt want to bring attention to it in case klei nerfed it lmao but here we go.

The flower armor is kinda crazy, it redirects all dmg to abby (including indirect like over heating). All healing wendy would receive is also given to abby instead (such as healing foods and potentially tox souls but i havent checked that one)

Id argue that the armor actually helps abigails survivability in that sense since you can have a healing potion on her and be chugging pierogis or dragon pies making her very hard to kill.

Additionally all the dmg abby receives from the cloak is post mitigation player damage. For instance a rook does more damage to a npc than a player which is then further reduced by armor. so with her base 600 hp she eats even hits from bosses like dfly easily.

there might even be a strat where you intentionally target her away using the "go to attack" command against aoe bosses (i havent tried yet) which would eliminate her only weakness and make wendy insanely tanky

 

In conclusion: flower armor kinda busted imo, wouldnt be suprised if kei actually nerf it (but i also thought that about max cage so well have to see)

[This14Real]

It is pretty busted, combined with gestalt Abi both of them become boss killing beasts, the Shroud completely eliminates all damage from Wendy and any good helmet also decreases damage from Abigail, which she can heal pretty quickly and avoid major hits by just kiting with her gestalt ability.
If klei swaps both lunar and shadow alignment skills Wendy will be even more busted with constant gestalt Abi damage aura.
Another thing is that people forget the Eye Mask and Shield of Terror are a thing, if both combined with the Shroud Wendy and Abi become a crazy tank/dps and the only cost would be a few potions and monster meat.

[WenericMember]

Yeah. I apologize for ragging on it throughout most of today, Klei pls don't nerf it too hard.

It at least still requires a fair bit of skill to use - decent cost, and if you don't take care to kite with Abigail at all she'll probably still die relatively quickly.

Delete the post after a little bit so Klei doesn't catch on

[flamboyant wolf]

I liked using it, pretty neat, especially with gestalt Abi.

[Tranoze]

26 minutes ago, Sustenance said:

Wouldnt be suprised if kei actually nerf it 

Please remove this post so klei wouldnt know flower armor is actually op.

[This14Real]

1 minute ago, Tranoze said:

Please remove this post so klei wouldnt know flower armor is actually op.

Well it’s busted but it needs some getting to it, as long as Klei doesn’t nerf it to the ground, the skill definitely needs some tuning. Shroud should have a post rift resource cost and redirect some damage to Abi, not all damage. Still would be pretty strong.

[WenericMember]

Its weird, because on it's own, it's not too bad - as of 2 days ago Abigail surviving combat is 2/3rds of the struggle of fighting with Wendy. But now she has overheal, an extended Dodge and Gesalt form, keeping Abigail alive isn't too bad. 

I just hope that as long as it is nerfed, Wendy gets some utility buffs in exchange, because having effective immunity to out of combat damage is some really unique utility.

5 minutes ago, This14Real said:

Well it’s busted but it needs some getting to it, as long as Klei doesn’t nerf it to the ground, the skill definitely needs some tuning. Shroud should have a post rift resource cost and redirect some damage to Abi, not all damage. Still would be pretty strong.

It's very weird. I think cutting down the freshness timer could be a fair nerf? The problem with only redirecting some damage is then it just becomes an incredibly expesnive, and debatable worse, suit armour.

Either way I think it's too early to nerf in either way. In a vacuum it may be good, but It still struggles against bosses with AOE for all the same reasons Vanilla Wendy & Abi struggle with AOE, not to mention how time consuming it might be to get in a playthrough.

[Mysterious box]

1 minute ago, WenericMember said:

because having effective immunity to out of combat damage is some really unique utility.

This is definitely a bug Wurt had this too with her water armor before they patched it due to it being unintended.

[This14Real]

2 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

The problem with only redirecting some damage is then it just becomes an incredibly expesnive, and debatable worse, suit armour.

Good point.

[WenericMember]

2 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

This is definitely a bug Wurt had this too with her water armor before they patched it due to it being unintended.

Yeah... :c

I think between that bug getting fixed and some nerfs to Freshness it'll be in an alright spot. Make it an item you have to actively prepare rather than just a passive insurance you wear at all times.

[Siren11]

11 minutes ago, This14Real said:

Shroud should have a post rift resource cost

Wendy is known for being an easy character for newer players, so I don’t think it’s a good idea to lock one of her more interesting/useful items behind endgame bosses. Even a player that can’t beat CC or AFW can get utility out of the shroud, and it does still require some skill/strategy (or spamming healing items ig) to use effectively.

[WenericMember]

1 minute ago, Siren11 said:

Wendy is known for being an easy character for newer players, so I don’t think it’s a good idea to lock one of her more interesting/useful items behind endgame bosses. Even a player that can’t beat CC or AFW can get utility out of the shroud, and it does still require some skill/strategy (or spamming healing items ig) to use effectively.

I think the solution is to bring the Freshness down to something like a 5 minute timer. As far as I can tell RN it's comparable to the hambat - roughly 10 in game days.

[Siren11]

Just now, WenericMember said:

I think the solution is to bring the Freshness down to something like a 5 minute timer. As far as I can tell RN it's comparable to the hambat - roughly 10 in game days.

Five minutes is awfully short. I would say most of my fights last longer than that, so having at least a slightly longer timer would be nice. But faster spoilage would certainly be a way to nerf it.

[WenericMember]

Just now, Siren11 said:

Five minutes is awfully short. I would say most of my fights last longer than that, so having at least a slightly longer timer would be nice. But faster spoilage would certainly be a way to nerf it.

Yeah, i guess it just depends on if you're solo or in a group, what you're facing, etc.

Another Idea for how to nerf it would be to make Planar Damage pierce this redirection.

[WenericMember]

Its still good, but after testing I don't think it needs that big of a nerf in combat because it still doesn't eliminate Wendy's biggest weakness- Bosses with massive AOE.  Obviously it depends on the boss, but even attempting to facetank with deerclops and Abigail gets immediately shredded.

I don't really know how to think about it. It's kinda broken, but hard to use, but also probably overall unhealthy.

I just hope it doesn't stop the other areas of Wendy's tree getting fixed.

[Cheggf]

2 hours ago, Sustenance said:

Additionally all the dmg abby receives from the cloak is post mitigation player damage.

What if you wear a helmet? Can you reduce it further, or is it only the base damage dealt to players?

[flamboyant wolf]

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

What if you wear a helmet? Can you reduce it further, or is it only the base damage dealt to players?

yes, armor goes first. 

so if you wear a football healmet and the flower armor, the helmet takes 80% of the dmg, and then Abigail gets the remaining 20%.