Nightmare Saddle makes beefalos extremely tanky and nobody is talking about it

[Picklesaurus]

6 hours ago, HellHeater said:

Night armor makes Wilson have 3000 effective hp with 20x  effective healing.

This very endgame item that you claim to be too tanky is weaker than a base character with marble/night armor which are available soon after game starts.

This was not directed at me but caught me off guard... Weaker?! marble/night armor are 95% non planar protection armor that gimp most characters by making you need sanity food or slowing you down by -30%, they occupy the chest  slot and they break 4 to 5 times quicker than the beefalo would be at a danger of dying with the new saddle, those two especially break quickly because they have high damage absorption when compared to their durability, the hp you save by using them you have to pay in materials which you would also need to carry around if you wanted to keep using them up to 2500+ hp and you still need to heal yourself when using them. Even if you gave those two armor self fixing properties it wouldn't be comparable to the new beefalo saddle not only because they would break 4 or 5 times quicker than your beefalo would die but also because you would still need to heal your character when using them. This is before taking into account that none of those armor have planar protection and that beefalos not only keep your chest slot free for a backpack or another piece of armor and dont gimp your character like those two do but it also gives you a massive boom to your mobility.

The interesting thing is that getting caught of guard by you saying Nightmare Saddle is weaker than Marble and Night armor, thinking about it and articulating to type this response it ended up opening my eyes for how unreasonably tanky the new saddle makes beefalos.

[Cruvimaster]

This new saddle represents a quality of life for beefalos and is a good incentive to tame beefalos and, most importantly, a new reward for defeating AFW.

It is a late game item for those who play the normal game path.

What I realize here is that to request an item improvement, the community must complain in large numbers for the developers to accept it, but to harm an item that almost everyone is enjoying, 10 members of the community complain (against 38 thousand players) is enough for the developers.

I hope this doesn't happen in this update.

If it's to make it harder to make the item, that's fine with me. But changing the stats, no.

[WereBruhver]

7 hours ago, HellHeater said:

Night armor makes Wilson have 3000 effective hp with 20x  effective healing.

This very endgame item that you claim to be too tanky is weaker than a base character with marble/night armor which are available soon after game starts.

A better comparison would be to find an armor that gives 94% damage reduction to a Wilson (150÷0,06 = 2500) or 97% damage reduction to a Wes or Maxwell (75÷0,03=2500), 50% up to 100% planar damage reduction,  69% up to 93% movement speed - depeding if you are using it on an ornery/default or rider - that also self fixes, regenerates your health and doesn't occupy your chest nor head slot. I'm questioning if this isn't too much safety, it is ultra self suficient tankyness that in turn becomes tankier - read safer - because it is also ultra mobile so you also avoid harm easier, all in the same in package. Wouldn't 50% instead of 60% damage reduction for normal damage already be more than enough? I dont see my beefalo ever dying even with 50%, let alone 60%. We are also receing a reviving bell in the same update, isn't this enough a safety net? When will I use it if my beefalo feels Imortal?

1 hour ago, Cruvimaster said:

If it's to make it harder to make the item, that's fine with me. But changing the stats, no.

 

23 minutes ago, WereBruhver said:

Wouldn't 50% instead of 60% damage reduction for normal damage already be more than enough? I dont see my beefalo ever dying even with 50%, let alone 60%. We are also receiving a reviving bell in the same update, isn't this enough of a safety net? When will I use it if my beefalo feels Imortal?

 

[Cruvimaster]

11 minutes ago, WereBruhver said:

A better comparison would be to find an armor that gives 94% damage reduction to a Wilson (150÷0,06 = 2500) or 97% damage reduction to a Wes (75÷0,03=2500), 50% up to 100% planar damage reduction,  69% up to 93% movement speed - depeding if you are using it on an ornery/default or rider - that also self fixes, regenerates your health and doesn't occupy your chest nor head slot. I'm questioning if this isn't too much safety, it is ultra self suficient tankyness that in turn becomes tankier - read safer - because it is also ultra mobile so you also avoid harm easier, all in the same in package. Wouldn't 50% instead of 60% damage reduction for normal damage already be more than enough? I dont see my beefalo ever dying even with 50%, let alone 60%. We are also receing a reviving bell in the same update, isn't this enough a safety net? When will I use it if my beefalo feels Imortal?

The yardstick you use to measure something as broken or as quality of life is based on your gameplay. That's how we all do it, actually.

To get access to this saddle, all 6 players must have beaten AFW (gameplay without activating the event) and then have several Shadow Atriums. We're talking about 13 Shadow Atriums for everyone to have full access to the new beefalo features. That represents 281 game days (considering game day 21).

Many players lose interest in continuing a world with 300 days, for example.

The new saddle is a late game item and represents a quality of life. Fighting with beefalo has lower damage per second compared to normal weapons.

I won't go into detail here about cheese, animation cancellation or world settings to activate the event, as that would apply to so many other things in the game.

[arubaro]

1 hour ago, Cruvimaster said:

quality of life

I think you dont know what the term means 

[_zwb]

who cares? beefalos are garbage against knockback effects

[Cruvimaster]

13 minutes ago, arubaro said:

I think you dont know what the term means 

Maybe you are the owner of the truth and can tell us what this means.

1 hour ago, WereBruhver said:

When will I use it if my beefalo feels Imortal?

A beefalo, which took more than 20 days to tame, dies.

Players:

a) Will tame another one in another 23 to 26 days

b) Will rollback.

Beefalos are already immortal for most players. The difference is that Klei is giving the option to effectively avoid rollback.

You need to be pragmatic and get out of this world of illusions.

Rollback is very broken too. Are they going to ask Klei to nerf it too?

[arubaro]

3 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

Maybe you are the owner of the truth and can tell us what this means.

Changes that barelly affects balance to make the game run smoother or make certain stuff less annoying 

A new endgame saddle isnt QoL

You are welcome

[abrocator]

I wasn’t around for the Wigfrid skill tree beta. But I didn’t seem to see a lot of people making a big deal out of the 40% built-in armor. To me that is massive and why I always prefer it for any kind of battle situation.

[WereBruhver]

4 hours ago, abrocator said:

I wasn’t around for the Wigfrid skill tree beta. But I didn’t seem to see a lot of people making a big deal out of the 40% built-in armor. To me that is massive and why I always prefer it for any kind of battle situation.

Because the difference between a damage reduction of 40% and 60% is not 20% less damage taken but 33% less damage taken and this is tricky for our brain to understand but we can easily feel it while playing, it is why 90% feels much more tanky than 80% and 95% much more than 90% even if the number increase seems so small. This becomes clear especially on something with a high HP and regen such as a beefalo, beefalo effective hp with a 40% saddle becomes 1666 hp, beefalo effective hp with a 60% saddle becomes 2500, in other words Wigfrid saddle has an effective hp increase of 666 and the new saddle has an effective hp increase of 1500, 1500 is equal x2,25 times 666. Also wigfrid saddle was slower than a basic saddle, which made it feel obnoxious to use while also having x3 less extra damage than the war saddle, so there was not really a situation where most people felt like it shine especially not in a character already as tanky as Wigfrid. The new saddle is faster than a basic saddle in fact it is the second fastest saddle only loosing to Glossamer Saddle, deals more damage than the War saddle and makes beefalo 50% (2500/1666 = 1,5) more tanky than Wig's saddle. It is an incomparably better package than Wig's Battle saddle. 

[abrocator]

2 minutes ago, WereBruhver said:

Because the difference between a damage reduction of 40% and 60% is not 20% less damage taken but 33% less damage taken and this is tricky for our brain to understand but we can easily feel it while playing,

Thank you for explaining math to me.

[chirsg]

43 minutes ago, abrocator said:

I wasn’t around for the Wigfrid skill tree beta. But I didn’t seem to see a lot of people making a big deal out of the 40% built-in armor. To me that is massive and why I always prefer it for any kind of battle situation.

Wigfrid's saddle sucks. You shouldn't have been fighting on saddleback post rifts until now. 

More-so now. Wigfrid's spear has the strongest spine, carrying her entire skill tree. Saddle sucks, affinities suck, Reprise sucks.

 

Anyone using Wigfrid's saddle was the outlier. If you used it as non wigfrid, you were just slower and weaker. 

[WereBruhver]

2 minutes ago, abrocator said:

Thank you for explaining math to me.

From the bottom of my heart I was not trying to be condescending, I just thought you could find it interesting.

[grm9]

56 minutes ago, abrocator said:

I wasn’t around for the Wigfrid skill tree beta. But I didn’t seem to see a lot of people making a big deal out of the 40% built-in armor. To me that is massive and why I always prefer it for any kind of battle situation

because it was generally better to use another saddle and try to not get hit since even if you did a few times, you'dn't need to heal beefalo any way if you started the fight at full hp

[Cruvimaster]

Is it better to have 60% late game protection or 100% protection on day 1 with rollback?

[abrocator]

8 minutes ago, grm9 said:

because it was generally better to use another saddle and try to not get hit since even if you did a few times, you'dn't need to heal beefalo any way if you started the fight at full hp

“but why would you use X if you could just not get hit/play optimally/rush FW/”

Because I suck.

[arubaro]

What i dont like is how now every beefalo can be speedy but good in combat. Before you needed to chose tendency and saddle, now speedy tendency can bypass the 50 threshold while being really fast 

And sure, the armor makes them more stupid ijbmaxwell, now his only "downside" matters even less 

[Jakepeng99]

It looks busted and kinda just combines all the saddles into one.

[grm9]

1 hour ago, arubaro said:

now speedy tendency can bypass the 50 threshold

still can't btw, 25 (rider beefalo default damage) + 18 (saddle damage increase) = 43 and you can get 50 even with war saddle if using a default beefalo

[arubaro]

1 minute ago, grm9 said:

still can't btw, 25 (rider beefalo default damage) + 18 (saddle damage increase) = 43

Oh, damn, i though it has extra planar damage

My bad

[flamboyant wolf]

20 minutes ago, arubaro said:

Oh, damn, i though it has extra planar damage

My bad

The 18 damage it adds is all planar, iirc. It doesn't add regular dmg though, to my understanding.

[loonreaper]

2 hours ago, arubaro said:

Oh, damn, i though it has extra planar damage

My bad

Jesus, do people usually jump on the hate/nerf-wagon without even understanding the numbers or testing it in-game? 

[Mr Giggio]

15 hours ago, loonreaper said:

Jesus, do people usually jump on the hate/nerf-wagon without even understanding the numbers or testing it in-game? 

Welcome to the forums hahahaha