Can we give Wanda a Watch Pouch?

[Mike23Ua]

21 minutes ago, Y0sH said:

And exactly what i thought would happen every time Wanda's name gets brought up in discussions did happen. The conversation just immediately turns into a "She does x amount of damage, she's OP! She needs MORE downsides." etc... *sigh*

How can you expect anything differently when Klei’s own design description for her claims her to be a “Glass Canon” 

Sadly I don’t think Klei actually know what a Glass Canon is, I can’t really blame them for their lack of understanding of the Term. 
 

But I can give you a really good example of what a Glass Canon is-

THIS is a Glass Canon:

THIS is Not..

What is my point? Wanda needs to be Nerfed.. if I’m to take “Glass Canon” as a serious claim.

Adding a pouch to store watches would further and further push her away from the glass canon role she’s supposed to have.

Dont get me wrong your idea is solid, however.. It would make a character who already has too many strengths and not nearly enough weaknesses.. (for the role she’s intended to fulfill) that much stronger.

[NPCMaxwell]

13 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

How can you expect anything differently when Klei’s own design description for her claims her to be a “Glass Canon” 

Sadly I don’t think Klei actually know what a Glass Canon is, I can’t really blame them for their lack of understanding of the Term. 
 

But I can give you a really good example of what a Glass Canon is-

THIS is a Glass Canon:

THIS is Not..

What is my point? Wanda needs to be Nerfed.. if I’m to take “Glass Canon” as a serious claim.

Adding a pouch to store watches would further and further push her away from the glass canon role she’s supposed to have.

Dont get me wrong your idea is solid, however.. It would make a character who already has too many strengths and not nearly enough weaknesses.. (for the role she’s intended to fulfill) that much stronger.

The only literal glass canon term I know is the item from the binding of Isaac that reduces your health to permanently a half hitpoint [= instant death in one hit] while making you spawn a GIANT tear in a short regeneration time [= tear size means more attack / more area damage + being able to use the glasscanon ability in short time after another.] Comparing this to Wanda she really isn't that much of a glass canon. So ok although I "voted" for the pouch I now get how her inventory management is supposed to be part of her downside.

But what if her skill-tree [which will certainly come on day] will make her glass canon by attaching a downside to each of her skill-tree abilities? Would this add to her "glass-canon"-y meant to be class? I don't know, I'm just asking. [I probably will never spend money to play her, but I like this character and try to understand this nerfing which I suppose means reduce strength vs being too OP vs add abilities / items to her discussion.]

[BeastNleashed]

Don't know, Wanda is such a strong character, super high range dmg, all the cool and special Utility, no Downsides for death and so on and that even PRE-Skilltree, why would she need a pouch now? But i mean why not shes now OP and utility wise much better than the rest so i guess with her Skilltree she will even be more OP and yes also get a pouch. 

53 minutes ago, Y0sH said:

Edit: Also if you aren't playing Wanda to not fight then there are way better options of characters to pick that do her non-fighting perks much better.

Who better Rezz themself without Downside than Wanda? Who better rezz others back to they corpse and have no downside? Who better teleport than Wanda? Who better backstep better? Oh no one. because others CAN'T.

Sure others can rezz themselfes with Life Amulet, but they also need a slot for this don't they? 

[x YOsH x]

1 hour ago, BeastNleashed said:

Who better Rezz themself without Downside than Wanda? Who better rezz others back to they corpse and have no downside? Who better teleport than Wanda? Who better backstep better? Oh no one. because others CAN'T.

Sure others can rezz themselfes with Life Amulet, but they also need a slot for this don't they? 

If you rezz yourself with your own second chance watch you break it losing half of the items needed to make it so it's a one time use. So literally a touchstone, amulet, effigy all better rezzing than Wanda without "downside". 

Rezzing others is definitely better until you consider that the cooldown is half a day or so. In which case I'm sure the person needing to be revived can find a touchstone by then or the other options above.

Who better teleports or back step than Wanda? Literally Wortox exists in the game. Have you even played the game?

Again, Endgame Wanda has a lot of inventory being cluttered with watch stuff that could easily go into a pouch and it wouldn't hurt her "Glass Cannon OP" angle you all like to cling on so desperately.

[El Harry]

5 hours ago, Y0sH said:

I have over 2k hours with Wanda and the most prevalent issue I've had with this character is her inventory. Watch pieces, Ageless Watches, Alarming Clock, 2nd Chance Watch and Backtreck watches eat inventory space. Not to mention the slot that will be inevitably reserved for nightmare fuel. I get this character is supposed to be the "Glass Cannon" and any talk of her seems to just jump to "she's OP she doesn't need changes." but i disagree. I think a small upgrade to her kit would be amazing with a pouch that can ONLY hold watches and the related items even if it's only 4 slots that can stay open on screen much like Wilson's beard storage.

Yeah I'd be a good idea I tend to have my inventory filled up with watches late game (  1 backstep 2 ageless 1 backtreck) that's already 4 slots that's more than what every other character carries with their exclusive items, using bundle wraps can help but it isn't a viable option.

As long as it's expensive enough to balance it's use it's fine ( Maybe Pure horror + dark tatters + time pieces? and make it look like a vortex cloack type bag) at that point you'd already have access to bundle wraps so it'd be fair enough.

I'd be a good QoL for her skill tree 

[Demigardenerner]

2 hours ago, Well-met said:

nice try

limited 27 dmg whips is not the same as the alarming clock's infinite 300 dps

I may be a tad basis but Wanda is not very good right now planar mechanics damage over time it’s just killers hers and you can’t say infinite dps because if you get hit once by something like crystal deerclops your dead.wanda is not op in my eyes which I’m probably wrong but still she does nowhere near Wolfgang damage now just about every other character is getting some type of teleporting skill which I’m not complaining about reviving skills which depending on where they died might be useless.and the backstep watch yea that is a tad good for kiting.most of her op parts are overshadowed and weak in the new games direction alarming clock range doesn’t matter if she’s old  and doing like 68 damage.i just hope her skill tree isn’t going to be boring like Wolfgang and the inventory issues it could be worse I suppose

[arubaro]

18 minutes ago, El Harry said:

Yeah I'd be a good idea I tend to have my inventory filled up with watches late game (  1 backstep 2 ageless 1 backtreck)

That is the thing, you dont need at all times 1 backstep and 2 ageless because you wont be fighting. Sadly, right now, the only non optional fights are hounds (that you encounter like 4 times per ingame year), deerclops and bearger(1 time per year). We can include brightshades but they are stationary so you have room to prepare more clocks if needed

So the only thing you must bring is fuel for the weapon, a alarming clock, 1 ageless and 1 backtreck. That is only 2 extra items compared to other characters (ageless and backtreck) one of them being a powerful tp item and the other is an infinite source of healing (i dont think her healing is op but is true that you arent wasting resources so is fair it takes an slot)

Is like saying every character needs extra slots just because i bring with me at all times flint, gold, torch, lantern, rope, grass, a random tool i won't use, miner hat, NF, another tool i wont use, a trinket and  3 life giving amulets

[El Harry]

48 minutes ago, arubaro said:

That is the thing, you dont need at all times 1 backstep and 2 ageless because you wont be fighting. Sadly, right now, the only non optional fights are hounds (that you encounter like 4 times per ingame year), deerclops and bearger(1 time per year). We can include brightshades but they are stationary so you have room to prepare more clocks if needed

So the only thing you must bring is fuel for the weapon, a alarming clock, 1 ageless and 1 backtreck. That is only 2 extra items compared to other characters (ageless and backtreck) one of them being a powerful tp item and the other is an infinite source of healing (i dont think her healing is op but is true that you arent wasting resources so is fair it takes an slot)

Is like saying every character needs extra slots just because i bring with me at all times flint, gold, torch, lantern, rope, grass, a random tool i won't use, miner hat, NF, another tool i wont use, a trinket and  3 life giving amulets

Almost every character that has items like that have a way to get extra slots for them Walter has woby, maxwell has the magicians hat, wigfrid has the battle call canister Wicker has her library, the only one who doesn't posses an item for that and has a lot of items is winona and maybe Wx but you won't be carrying around a lot of circuits.

It seems fair considering what you'd need to make it That's kind of why I suggested dark tatters an end game material for it since it only would be really useful lategame for the extra watches you'd need for the mutated bosses if you take more than 2 hits and planar damage in general, and a QoL.

I usually make a piggybag or get a krampus sack anyways when playing as wanda but it'd be nice to get those slots to gather more resources lategame.

And continuing that train of tough of "Is like saying every character needs extra slots just because i bring with me at all times flint, gold, torch, lantern, rope, grass, a random tool i won't use, miner hat, NF, another tool i wont use, a trinket and  3 life giving amulets", you can use bundles for that You can even use bundles for watches but the issue is that it isn't convenient to bundle up watches to use them later. a "watchbox" would just make it easier and that's fine since there's already a universal alternative for it that being the bundling wrap. 

[Mysterious box]

4 hours ago, BeastNleashed said:

Don't know, Wanda is such a strong character, super high range dmg, all the cool and special Utility, no Downsides for death and so on and that even PRE-Skilltree, why would she need a pouch now? But i mean why not shes now OP and utility wise much better than the rest so i guess with her Skilltree she will even be more OP and yes also get a pouch. 

I mean this is debatable with the current state of things Winona powercrept Wanda's resurrection and teleportation. Wanda's resurrection item breaks and she needs to get more materials for it after she uses it and she only keeps her character specific items on her person and must revive to her original spot of death. Winona's resurrection Also breaks but she gets it for free, is sent to a safe location of her choice, and keeps everything she's carrying. Then there's the teleportation Wanda needs in game years to setup a proper network while also needing separate watches for each location while Winona just needs her umbrella. You could even argue with her portable catapults she even beats Wanda in high ranged damage.

1 hour ago, El Harry said:

Almost every character that has items like that have a way to get extra slots for them Walter has woby

Tbf I think Woby was more so to push Walter away from using a backpack with football helmet and instead using body armor with his hat. Either way though he still has massive inventory issues if you use his slingshot fully.

[BeastNleashed]

3 hours ago, x YOsH x said:

If you rezz yourself with your own second chance watch you break it losing half of the items needed to make it so it's a one time use. So literally a touchstone, amulet, effigy all better rezzing than Wanda without "downside". 

Rezzing others is definitely better until you consider that the cooldown is half a day or so. In which case I'm sure the person needing to be revived can find a touchstone by then or the other options above.

Who better teleports or back step than Wanda? Literally Wortox exists in the game. Have you even played the game?

Again, Endgame Wanda has a lot of inventory being cluttered with watch stuff that could easily go into a pouch and it wouldn't hurt her "Glass Cannon OP" angle you all like to cling on so desperately.

Yes dont get me wrong i mean its totally fine if she gets a Pouch but i think she should only get it WITH Skilltree.
the 2 Chance Watch breaks yeah but i mean its not that expensive, you can go to Archives day 2-3ish, and Archive isn't really hard is it? The only thing that is maybe hard to get are the Living Logs if you dont have a Wormwood. But since you Wanda you can delete Treeguards in Seconds so..

I really DID NOT know that Wortox can Teleport others too? Thanks i will test it, i may haven't played the Game!

But typical Wandas.. i mean People here really compare Tail o' Three Cats with AlarmingClock wtf.. even Young Wanda deals 81 Dmg with it and HAS Range. .. Same goes for Squishyness.. just play Young Wanda, or maybe normal One, you still DPS most Characters out.. and this on day one. Or maybe "Don't get hit" like some people would say (me not im bad)
 

2 hours ago, El Harry said:

Almost every character that has items like that have a way to get extra slots for them Walter has woby, maxwell has the magicians hat, wigfrid has the battle call canister Wicker has her library, the only one who doesn't posses an item for that and has a lot of items is winona and maybe Wx but you won't be carrying around a lot of circuits.

Again, Wanda is PRE-Skilltree, Wickerbottom also has no Pouch for her Books, Wigrid also just got it with Skilltree and both also have tons of Items. Wendy got no Items for Abigail Stuff, Webber doesnt have stuff. Woody doesnt have. Willow doesn't have for her Lighter, Bernie and Embers, as far as i know WX doesnt have anything for his Jimmy, Prints, Circuits, but i guess your right?

 

17 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

I mean this is debatable with the current state of things Winona powercrept Wanda's resurrection and teleportation. Wanda's resurrection item breaks and she needs to get more materials for it after she uses it and she only keeps her character specific items on her person and mu

Tbf I think Woby was more so to push Walter away from using a backpack with football helmet and instead using body armor with his hat. Either way though he still has massive inventory issues if you use his slingshot fully.

I really get this, but again Winona got her Skilltree now (well today) and since its the Beta Thread, for stuff at Beta i guess x Yosh x wants it NOW (as soon as possible). 

[gaymime]

6 hours ago, Demigardenerner said:

Zero downsides?? She’s literally a glass cannon that’s pretty weak with the planar mechanics yall want wanna Wanda op Wanda op but she’s not anymore she has 17.5 hp while old and planar damage goes through armor you have to stay middle aged/young and then she’s not doing any real damage the whole Wanda op thing died when they released the rifts

except planar mechanics are only a small part of the end game for a lot of people and not even part of the game at all for as many more. that is like saying "the last three bites of this whole entire cake also contain laxative, this makes the cake way more risky to eat!" most people aren't going to eat a whole cake so those last three bites aren't really going to be relevant in most cases and most people are not going to get far enough in to unlock+use all the rift content to see for themselves how she fares against planar damage. do try to remember that the forums are not representative of the general userbase, most of the people on here are the hard-core fans and the super-duper-no-cap hardcore fans, heck on here someone like me is an absolute scrub and i am just about at 2800 hours of playtime and know about a quarter of the wiki by heart. i have seen dozens of hours of people bodying bosses n' minibosses with her(including in my own games), she is really good with the kit she was designed with and very well-balanced in a 1v1 setting against the world of the constant. she is so well-made that people regularly get in fights about whether or not she is 1rst or 2nd best.

i guess the tldr is; in the right hands she is (almost)peerless up until that point and if you are good enough to get her to that point you really shouldn't be so abysmal at inventory management that a couple extra slots are going to be the make-or-break of the character for you.

 

this all being said i feel the desire for a pouch isn't because wanda players actually "need" these slots to be available to justify the necessary kit for playing optimally but that it would instead be nice to have what is essentially a character-specific tackle-box so that you have just as many(or more) regular inventory slots for your regular stuff which begs the question of why not give all the characters character-specific tackle-boxes for their unique items to fairly reduce inventory costs? this of course then begs the question of why have them be character-specific since everyone needs one, why not just have a special inventory(a-la beard storage) built into the game that can hold a character's kit + nessisary resources which then gets us down to the actual bones of what drives the question; klei, we want more storage so we can carry more stuff, can you please add more mobile storage, we don't have enough room for everything we want to lug around and it is hard to choose between three items each of which we are sure we need.

this question isn't a new one and isn't one that would be solved even if wanda did indeed get a watch(plus other stuff) pouch it would just move the goal-post over a little bit for a small portion of the playerbase because dst is, in part, an inventory management sim and in inventory management sims there is always going to be more stuff than space, more need for space to hold that stuff than is acquirable and ultimately a desire for just one or two more spaces, in perpetuity, as the strain of encumbrance becomes too agitating to ignore.

 

-edit-

ok so in the like 3 hours it took me to start this reply, eat dinner, come back to my reply then post a few other people have come to the same conclusion, so, first good job everyone who recognises that the problem is deeper than wanda's watches but also heck, some of you are waaaay more articulate than i am x''D

 

 

[Demigardenerner]

54 minutes ago, gaymime said:

except planar mechanics are only a small part of the end game for a lot of people and not even part of the game at all for as many more. that is like saying "the last three bites of this whole entire cake also contain laxative, this makes the cake way more risky to eat!" most people aren't going to eat a whole cake so those last three bites aren't really going to be relevant in most cases and most people are not going to get far enough in to unlock+use all the rift content to see for themselves how she fares against planar damage. do try to remember that the forums are not representative of the general userbase, most of the people on here are the hard-core fans and the super-duper-no-cap hardcore fans, heck on here someone like me is an absolute scrub and i am just about at 2800 hours of playtime and know about a quarter of the wiki by heart. i have seen dozens of hours of people bodying bosses n' minibosses with her(including in my own games), she is really good with the kit she was designed with and very well-balanced in a 1v1 setting against the world of the constant. she is so well-made that people regularly get in fights about whether or not she is 1rst or 2nd best.

i guess the tldr is; in the right hands she is (almost)peerless up until that point and if you are good enough to get her to that point you really shouldn't be so abysmal at inventory management that a couple extra slots are going to be the make-or-break of the character for you.

 

this all being said i feel the desire for a pouch isn't because wanda players actually "need" these slots to be available to justify the necessary kit for playing optimally but that it would instead be nice to have what is essentially a character-specific tackle-box so that you have just as many(or more) regular inventory slots for your regular stuff which begs the question of why not give all the characters character-specific tackle-boxes for their unique items to fairly reduce inventory costs? this of course then begs the question of why have them be character-specific since everyone needs one, why not just have a special inventory(a-la beard storage) built into the game that can hold a character's kit + nessisary resources which then gets us down to the actual bones of what drives the question; klei, we want more storage so we can carry more stuff, can you please add more mobile storage, we don't have enough room for everything we want to lug around and it is hard to choose between three items each of which we are sure we need.

this question isn't a new one and isn't one that would be solved even if wanda did indeed get a watch(plus other stuff) pouch it would just move the goal-post over a little bit for a small portion of the playerbase because dst is, in part, an inventory management sim and in inventory management sims there is always going to be more stuff than space, more need for space to hold that stuff than is acquirable and ultimately a desire for just one or two more spaces, in perpetuity, as the strain of encumbrance becomes too agitating to ignore.

 

-edit-

ok so in the like 3 hours it took me to start this reply, eat dinner, come back to my reply then post a few other people have come to the same conclusion, so, first good job everyone who recognises that the problem is deeper than wanda's watches but also heck, some of you are waaaay more articulate than i am x''D

 

 

Your right I be forgetting this game isn’t just veterans who already done everything multiple times.and when you put it like that Wanda is very good pre rifts.and I suppose inventory management is an part of her downside.

[gaymime]

23 minutes ago, Demigardenerner said:

Your right I be forgetting this game isn’t just veterans who already done everything multiple times.and when you put it like that Wanda is very good pre rifts.and I suppose inventory management is an part of her downside.

yeah, i was off of here for like two years so i have basically been playing with people who still can't make it through the first winter in a lightsout world(my current fav way to play dst) and sometimes can't make it to the first winter in a regular world so it was a bit of shell-shock to come back and find people talking about advance mid/end-game tactics like it is the most common thing, you guys are top of the top x''D

[Y0sH]

10 hours ago, BeastNleashed said:

I really DID NOT know that Wortox can Teleport others too? Thanks i will test it, i may haven't played the Game!
 

You never said anything about Wanda teleporting others in your original comment... I replied to what was typed. Several other characters have their own storage in fact with less items than Wanda. Wanda's skilltree much like every time she's mentioned in forums will be controversial, I'm sure of it. Adding a watch pouch now instead of when it's heavily criticized along with her skilltree (whenever that'll be) can just circumvent the scrutiny to come... well some of it.

[Cruvimaster]

4 hours ago, Y0sH said:

You never said anything about Wanda teleporting others in your original comment... I replied to what was typed. Several other characters have their own storage in fact with less items than Wanda. Wanda's skilltree much like every time she's mentioned in forums will be controversial, I'm sure of it. Adding a watch pouch now instead of when it's heavily criticized along with her skilltree (whenever that'll be) can just circumvent the scrutiny to come... well some of it.

Wanda is one of the most hated characters on this forum. She even had a poll that made this clear.

Some who say that Wanda has no downsides are, for example, Wendy players.

Others who say she's a crystal cannon pretend that Wolfgang doesn't exist.

The fact is that the entire debate here will be forgotten, especially if Wanda is the last to receive skill trees (+ - 18 months).

I forgot to mention Wanda players who are very experienced in the game (maybe more than 3000 hours) and who want to nerf the character in a way that only they can play with her.