Arguments for 7 slots

[TheDoctor11220]

This has been mentioned multiple times in this forum since the beta release of the WX changes. I just want to list my reasons here.

- With 7 slots you could go for some cool thematic combos (which mainly require a 2-2-3) such as: full warrior with two hardy circuits and a dronemaster (2-2-3) or maybe the stop hitting yourself build with hardy circuit, electric circuit and dronemaster (2-2-3) which is my personal favorite, or full cave diver with night vision and thermal circuit (4-3)... you get the idea, you can make a lot of combos.

- The most recent patch nerfed his base stats so this would be a good compensation (also please make it 130 health and 125 hunger instead of the other way around because with hardy 2.0 and super gastroexpansion it would be 280 health and 200 hunger instead of the current 275 health and 205 hunger, my ocd can't handle it).

- Early game he has pretty low health now and you know everyone will want the speed 1.0 circuit. With 7 slots he can also fit in a small hardy circuit. That little extra health can go a long way in the early game for new players until they get situated and get some better circuits 

[loopuleasa]

7 slots would be fine if WX started with 50 health, 50 hunger and 100 sanity

people don't realize how much an extra slot power creeps WX

[Ohan]

I dont think its lost on anyone least of all on the devs what 7 slots would facilitate. I mean everyone can do basic math. 

The light circuit has already been lowered to 3 pins and new 1 pin circuits have been added balanced around the limit of 6 pins. 

6 pins dont stop you from achieving setups similar to what you listed except moggles+thermal which only seems reasonable. And even then u can still do thermal/refrig+light circuits for infinite temp control and light. 

11 hours ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

Early game he has pretty low health now

Its only 25 less than Wilson… 

[cropo]

I really like what I've seen about this rework so far, instead of getting a global stat buff and having a further 3 buffs with a wickerbottom(basically having nearly every possible buff in the game) they get to choose what upgrades to focus on among the pool of already available buffs he used to get globally. Adding in extra slots to him kinda sounds like it's approaching a massive buff because he could essentially have enough perks to be comfortable without having to sacrifice anything and can even do it without a Wickerbottom helping. 

[TheDoctor11220]

55 minutes ago, Ohan said:

Its only 25 less than Wilson… 

It's the second lowest in the game after Wes, 25 less health is nothing to scoff at.

And yeah you could do alternative combos similar to the ones mentioned but I would argue it wouldn't feel as good (less fun). And in a realistic scenario everyone would want at least one speed 2.0 circuit which gives you only 4 pins to play with, so you go either 2-2 or 3-1 and the 3-1 really feels unappealing in late game since 1 cost circuits are weak. Which is a shame since the most interesting circuits are 3-cost. 

If balance is really that big an issue perhaps the 7th slot could be unlockable after defeating fuelweaver or ancient guardian (perhaps a lunar power module would unlock an extra slot).

[Copyafriend]

1 hour ago, Random Guy000 said:

Maybe im just stoopid, but do you care to give an example of broken 7 slot combo? Cant think of anything especially OP

Sarcasm bro

[ArubaroBeefalo]

3 minutes ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

It's the second lowest in the game after Wes, 25 less health is nothing to scoff at.

 

poor maxwell

[TheDoctor11220]

51 minutes ago, cropo said:

I really like what I've seen about this rework so far, instead of getting a global stat buff and having a further 3 buffs with a wickerbottom(basically having nearly every possible buff in the game) they get to choose what upgrades to focus on among the pool of already available buffs he used to get globally. Adding in extra slots to him kinda sounds like it's approaching a massive buff because he could essentially have enough perks to be comfortable without having to sacrifice anything and can even do it without a Wickerbottom helping. 

Before this patch his max stats were 400 health, 200 hunger and 300 sanity. And the wetness downside wasn't as strong as it is now. If we are trying to change WX without nerfing him you have to give compensation for that max potential stat loss.

It's another matter if you think WX needed to be nerfed, in which case 6 slots would be adequate. Not a fan of this personally.

1 minute ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

poor maxwell

Riight, forgot about him

[ArubaroBeefalo]

now that the light module pinnes got reduced to 3 and we get 1 pin stat modules i dont see why they would change it to 7

[TheDoctor11220]

17 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

now that the light module pinnes got reduced to 3 and we get 1 pin stat modules i dont see why they would change it to 7

Exactly my point, the most interesting circuits are 3 pins. So you add a speed to this and are left with 1 pin. The 1 cost modules are meant for early game they just feel bad for late game.

[Ohan]

17 minutes ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

And yeah you could do alternative combos similar to the ones mentioned but I would argue it wouldn't feel as good (less fun).

What anyone personally finds fun only holds value to a a certain extent. There comes a point where subjective fun has to make way for what is balanced. Too much power/no restrictions/no tough choices to make, make any game meaningless. 

17 minutes ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

25 less health is nothing to scoff at.

17 minutes ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

1 cost circuits are weak

Losing 25 hp = nothing to scoff at.
1 pin HP circuit that gives 50 HP = weak

…?

23 minutes ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

It's another matter if you think WX needed to be nerfed, in which case 6 slots would be adequate.

Is it not clear that this is what happened? WX’s absolute power potential has very clearly been lowered in favor of not relying on another character or rare natural lightning to unlock it. And on top of that they got a few brand new toys to play with in addition to a playstyle where the player has to make tough choices instead of walking around with stats that basically amount to godmode. Increasing the number of slots undoes this. 

6 minutes ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

The 1 cost modules are meant for early game they just feel bad for late game.

the 1 pin modules are meant to fill 1 pin on the circuitboard. Thats what theyre meant for. 50 bonus max hp on day 1 is still 50 bonus max hp on day 800. ill refer to this again: 

38 minutes ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

25 less health is nothing to scoff at.

[TheDoctor11220]

10 minutes ago, Ohan said:

What anyone personally finds fun only holds value to a a certain extent. There comes a point where subjective fun has to make way for what is balanced. Too much power/no restrictions/no tough choices to make, make any game meaningless. 

Losing 25 hp = nothing to scoff at.
1 pin HP circuit that gives 50 HP = weak

…?

Is it not clear that this is what happened? WX’s absolute power potential has very clearly been lowered in favor of not relying on another character or rare natural lightning to unlock it. And on top of that they got a few brand new toys to play with in addition to a playstyle where the player has to make tough choices instead of walking around with stats that basically amount to godmode. Increasing the number of slots undoes this. 

the 1 pin modules are meant to fill 1 pin on the circuitboard. Thats what theyre meant for. 50 bonus max hp on day 1 is still 50 bonus max hp on day 800. ill refer to this again: 

They are bad because their upgraded counterparts cost 2 pins but give x3 value. I stand by what I said 25 health is nothing to scoff at, and 50 health is not bad but for just 1 more pin you can get 150 health instead of 100. So the most efficient way to use the circuits late game is 2-2-2 which is more boring than all the 2-2-3 combos you can use. I hope klei considers fun when doing these character updates more than balance. This is not a pvp game where balance is absolutely necessary (like dota or overwatch or whatever). This is a coop survival game. You have your noob players that want a more chill experience and you have your veterans who want a challenge. Having multiple characters means you can cater to both their needs. WX has always been a noob friendly character, my guess would be after this change klei want him to be more fun and yet keep his role as a noob friendly character, so nerfing him is not the way to go about this.

[Karyuendan]

what if eating gears/wires give the extra slot?

[lakhnish]

I don't think he needs the 7th stat anymore after the Illumination circuit became 3 slots.

[Owlrust]

I can see a 7th slot encouraging players to never mix and match circuits or remove them because of how much creativity they're afforded and that kinda goes against the premise of WX's kit as a robot that swaps their circuits as needed.

[Ketrai]

12 minutes ago, Owlrust said:

I can see a 7th slot encouraging players to never mix and match circuits or remove them because of how much creativity they're afforded and that kinda goes against the premise of WX's kit as a robot that swaps their circuits as needed.

If you want to be optimal, you're still going to swap out circuits. Bossfight that's annoying for slower characters to kite? Tank setup. Gathering in winter? Thermal + speed. Going to do some lunar farming? Jack up that brain-power so you can stay insane longer. 

Circuits are a bit like equipment, as long as they have different purposes people will swap them out.

If anything the current 6 pegs makes me want to play around with circuits less, and just go 2.0 health and two speed circuits. If I wanna use like a thermal circuit? Well, then I need to pop out two whole circuits, damaging two. It's a small hassle, but I'm a conservative player so I don't like to waste things like gears, tusk, etc, when others might need them.

Hell, if they add a seventh peg I don't mind them nerfing health modules to take up three pegs so you can't be a giga-tank anymore, but just a super-tank. 

If anything having a little more wiggle room is what I want. Removing 4 pegs at a time to switch in a 3 peg is a lot of downtime too...

[TheDoctor11220]

1 hour ago, lakhnish said:

I don't think he needs the 7th stat anymore after the Illumination circuit became 3 slots.

And you still can't combo it well with other circuits. Either a different 3 slot or a 2-1, which is more likely for the speed and that one forces you to use a 1 slot circuit in the late game.

[Trevindo]

1 hour ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

They are bad because their upgraded counterparts cost 2 pins but give x3 value. I stand by what I said 25 health is nothing to scoff at, and 50 health is not bad but for just 1 more pin you can get 150 health instead of 100. So the most efficient way to use the circuits late game is 2-2-2 which is more boring than all the 2-2-3 combos you can use. I hope klei considers fun when doing these character updates more than balance. This is not a pvp game where balance is absolutely necessary (like dota or overwatch or whatever). This is a coop survival game. You have your noob players that want a more chill experience and you have your veterans who want a challenge. Having multiple characters means you can cater to both their needs. WX has always been a noob friendly character, my guess would be after this change klei want him to be more fun and yet keep his role as a noob friendly character, so nerfing him is not the way to go about this.

With all due respect my dear, but I think you're crazy, DST is a survival game so difficulty and balance are important to make all characters good options with advantages and disadvantages, and the idea behind these changes is that the wx have to choose between the best circuit for the current situation. So if you want to play a relaxing and "easy" game I recommend playing another game that is not survival (Example: Minecraft) or just turn on the god mode which is something very close to what you want.

[TheDoctor11220]

13 minutes ago, Trevindo said:

With all due respect my dear, but I think you're crazy, DST is a survival game so difficulty and balance are important to make all characters good options with advantages and disadvantages, and the idea behind these changes is that the wx have to choose between the best circuit for the current situation. So if you want to play a relaxing and "easy" game I recommend playing another game that is not survival (Example: Minecraft) or just turn on the god mode which is something very close to what you want.

"Go and play another game" is not a viable business plan for a gaming studio. They don't want to be losing players with the changes they make. So with all due respect, god forbid you ever end up working for Klei.

As for the hardness of the game, it's plenty hard already. A 7th slot for fun combos mainly concerns players who get to the late game and at that point it's not a matter of can I survive anymore, it's a matter of how can I thrive in the most fun way.

[Trevindo]

9 minutes ago, TheDoctor11220 said:

"Go and play another game" is not a viable business plan for a gaming studio. They don't want to be losing players with the changes they make. So with all due respect, god forbid you ever end up working for Klei.

As for the hardness lf the game, it's plenty hard already. A 7th slot for fun combos mainly concerns players who get to the late game and at that point it's not a matter of can I survive anymore, it's a matter of how can I thrive in the most fun way.

The purpose of the game is to be a survival game and if you don't like it, it's okay, there's no way to please everyone, but I warn you right away that klei probably won't put 7 spaces, because she's aware that what you are asking is not something designed to facilitate the end of the game (because it's not difficult to survive when you have resources, even without circuits), but to take the difficulty out of choices in the beginning and middle of the game.

[TheDoctor11220]

7 minutes ago, Trevindo said:

The purpose of the game is to be a survival game and if you don't like it, it's okay, there's no way to please everyone, but I warn you right away that klei probably won't put 7 spaces, because she's aware that what you are asking is not something designed to facilitate the end of the game (because it's not difficult to survive when you have resources, even without circuits), but to take the difficulty out of choices in the beginning and middle of the game.

I'm aware it's not likely, I'm just voicing my opinion and saying it should be considered. Some of the circuits require you to scan bosses (bee queen, bearger, dragonfly, deerclops), or a creature only found in the ruins (slurper), so I'd say it's fair to consider the combos late game. In the beginning of the game you're most likely gonna just get by with 1 cost circuits, or go for the speed 1.0 circuit. I don't wanna see potential getting removed. That is what makes WX fun. It's been what made him fun so far and hopefully in the future too. It was not an unpopular character before this change.