Some Non-Bug Feedback

[ViralMeme]

 

Hi Klei,

Big fan since Don't Starve, and Griftlands is quickly becoming one of my favorites. Here is some minor feedback I have so far.

1. Hunter/Grifter. The hero is alternately called both Hunter and Grifter by NPCs. Not sure if that's intentional.
2. Deck Selection Screen - At game start the user selects from a deck type. It's not clear what exactly is happening here (increasing the cards for that type of deck, I believe) and there ought to be some description. On my first game, I assumed if I selected Negotiation, that I would be unable to do battle, so I was confused when Battle was an option. If this screen described what this selection means, that would be helpful.
3. Playstyle Options - In the 2017 trailer there are options not seen in the Alpha: CHARM and STEAL. I know the game has undergone pretty major changes since then, but I took CHARM to mean charisma could be a factor. Just curious if that's planned or scrapped.
4. Upgraded Cards - I'm guessing that the look of Upgraded cards is temporary, I just wanted to point out that it would be nice if Upgraded meant the card was much nicer/possibly animated (a la Hearthstone) I see it now, really subtle though.
5. Negotiations - It's notable how complicated Negotiations are compared to Battle. There are so many arguments to target, whereas Battle is really straightforward. I am curious if there will be more options in Battle later. Also, do the Arguments in Negotiation need to rotate? Seems needless.
6. Hired Guns - Please make it clear how long a hired mercenary will be in your party.

Thanks, loving the game so far!

[deathofbarney]

Grifter I think alludes to the use of the bio-mechanical augmentations, whereas hunter is an occupation that some ( most I think) grifters do.

[Smife]

A grifter is a factionless person, an opportunist. Sal's also a bounty hunter. The game tells you that. OP should play some more and forget about the 2017 trailer.

[Dagar]

Hey,

first time poster, but since I wanted to give my feedback as well, I figured I can just use this thread.

Context: I am a 30-ish years old guy with a family. English is not my native language, so some of the ingame lingo is rather abstract to me. I have bought the Alpha about a year ago, had played the first day with Sal twice then and then no more time for gaming at all due to real life reasons. I now found some time and Griftlands was high on my list. My experience with deck builders is limited to card games such as Dominion, Eminent Domain, Thunderstone and the like. I have never really played one on PC. I watched a couple of episodes of a Let's Play of Slay The Spire recently, so I am not comletely new to the genre, but definitely one of the least experienced players here.

As for performance, I made it to day 3 with Sal, then finished the game with Sal (accidentally having the Vendetta modifier on, which I realized was my fault and not the game's normal state only after it was over. Also had the +5 negotiation health from my previous failed run), then played the available content with Rook today.

All in all I like the game very much, and I will definitely play more when life allows for that. It takes me very long to play a session, because I do not know the cards by heart and only learn what good synergies might be. Over 3 hours for the full Sal run. Compared to the 30 minutes an experiences StS player can get, this seems long, but I am confident that with experience Griftlands can be played about as fast.

Now some more concrete remarks:

• Deck feeling: Sal has easy to understand main routes to go with both decks. I found Diplomacy overall more engaging than Threat with him because of the reliable damage (with Influence). His combat options are also easy to grasp, and I had good success with my Combo deck. Rook in my opinion has harder to grasp concepts, but to me that makes them that much more engaging. The coin mechanism is really cool, but makes it harder to efficiently go one path in negotiations. I have seen a coin with 90% Snails likelihood, which would make that easier. But an ambush rig card, sticky rigs or according grafts would be nice (and I have not encountered any of these). I find it cool to be able to flip the coin symbols on according cards with upgrades, that really makes you think about dragging bad cards through to make them good, and gives merit to the +XP buyable card. Rooks combat actions are also cool, but I struggled since I tried for a bit of both burn/scorch and overcharge. My three favourite cards I have actually used are Sal's stun attack, Rooks card that purges debuffs for damage and Rooks list of names.
• Deck building (i.e. card removal): Sal had very few opportunities to get cards out of the deck, especially when compared to how often you can gain cards. That means most of the time I will not pick a new card and take the money instead. In my winning run, only a few of the starting cards rolled the destruction upgrade, and all but one of them I would rather have kept instead (I decided to trash them this way anyway since it slimmed my deck). Rook can more often buy card removals, since his market is always open. On the other hand, none of his starting cards rolled the destruction upgrade, so I am inclined to say it is not possible (okay, I levelled none of the kicks for example, so I cannot know for sure). Suggestion here: what about a salesperson which can re-roll or flat let you choose an upgrade for a card anew? Especially with these starter cards that would lead to a more satisfying build-up, but I can also see the argument that these chances and choices are part of the game.
• Grafts: Sal gets showered in Grafts to the point where it gets annoying that you have so few slots and getting more costs so much (and HP, which I am reluctant to pay). Rook on the other hand has so many slots I could always pick and buy in the first few days, and could have done so the next day at least. That makes for a more important change in play style of both than I first thought.
• Social system: It's really great! Definitely keep that! It really influences decisions you make when someone is your friend (or foe). Two minor grudges here: It is not clarified if the boon that removes debuffs when healing stacks, and in Rooks campaign you gain "Lovers" extremely fast. Yeah sure someone loves you when you save their lives from vile beasts, but I feel in Sal's campaign that was more gradual.
• Game mechanism (cards): As far as I have seen, it is rather similar to what StS does. And that is a good thing. I first struggled with the Evoke and Discard mechanisms on cards, for me as a non-native speaker that could have been explained clearer. Replenish equipment is great, I rarely use anything that does not have that ability.
• Game mechanisms (other): Pets are cool in general, but especially the way your pet first gives you a malus on negotiations and then a bonus is very nice. The food and drink system is great as it hurts you for having to refill on health apart from the money you spend. Rooks coin and the fact that you can trade for other coins with other abilities is really engaging, and I wish there was something like this for Sal.
• Encounters I disliked: Negotiating with traders that steal you shills per card played. Even worse if they then also infuse your deck with more "give me shills" cards. Especially bad if you cannot play these cards because you are broke; at that moment your deck is so clogged up with useless cards that it is near impossible to do anything. I had that twice with the same trader in the same quest (something like first convincing her to join the party, then convincing her to split the loot). I feel that if you were to play for your bounty, that would be more satisfying. Like it was in earlier versions where you could increase the bounty via Negotiation maybe.
• Encounters I particularly liked: The robot fight that gave you sparks into your deck which had the threat of blowing you up for huge damage. That was really tense! Seeing characters from Sal's campaign again with Rook. The roach queen fight with its armour negation cards was cool, along with the negotiation who "volunteers" to help. The way the assassin could be made easier by talking to him first was also really satisfying. The gambler you can encounter with Rook is just hilarious!
• Options I was missing: to be able to negate enemy buffs. Apart from stunning them, I found nothing that could e.g. circumvent retaliation damage or some other nasty stuff. I also found little options to drain your charge as Rook for more defense.
• QoL improvements: before discarding a card I want to look through my decks (especially if deciding to remove one or the other). I might also look at the upgrade options of these cards. Once, I wanted to have another look at the options of one card, and clicked it before realizing I was already in the discard selection screen, discarding it as a consequence. It would be nice if you could click the card and then another button to discard instead of instantly removing it. Make it more clear that you can get out of a negotiation. I only saw that button late in my Rook run, and would have used it in a couple of earlier instances.

That is all I can think of right now, though I likely have forgotten stuff I wanted to report. Hope it helps nonetheless!

[TF3]

5 hours ago, Dagar said:

It takes me very long to play a session, because I do not know the cards by heart and only learn what good synergies might be. Over 3 hours for the full Sal run. Compared to the 30 minutes an experiences StS player can get, this seems long, but I am confident that with experience Griftlands can be played about as fast.

Unfortunately, if you're looking for a speedy experience, even knowing most of the cards wont help. Takes me a bit over 2 hours to complete Sal's campaign with all the positive mutators and Fast Mode enabled. Fortunately the game saves often at the start of every event/when you visit a location so you can leave your game and come back whenever easily.

 

5 hours ago, Dagar said:

But an ambush rig card, sticky rigs or according grafts would be nice (and I have not encountered any of these).

There are actually grafts that give Rigs for either Heads or Snails at the start of negotiaion, called Reflexor: Heads and Reflexor: Snails. Both are common rarity, so Im sure you'll find them eventually. As for cards, there's a card called Foresight that lets you rig the coin to either side at the end of each turn. One of its upgrades gives it Ambush as well. Its a rare card, so you'll have to check in the card shop often for it.

5 hours ago, Dagar said:

On the other hand, none of his starting cards rolled the destruction upgrade, so I am inclined to say it is not possible (okay, I levelled none of the kicks for example, so I cannot know for sure).

Most of his starting cards do have a Destroy upgrade, same with Sal. Unfortunately, its pure rng as to when you get them, since those cards have randomly chosen upgrades. The starting cards for both Sal and Rook that dont have random upgrades are Quick Thinking, Sal's Instincts, Sal's Daggers, Fight Dirty, Call It, Trickery, Ammo Pouch, Hair Trigger, and Crank. You can look at the random upgrade cards through the Compendium to see all of their potential upgrade options.

 

5 hours ago, Dagar said:

and in Rooks campaign you gain "Lovers" extremely fast. Yeah sure someone loves you when you save their lives from vile beasts, but I feel in Sal's campaign that was more gradual.

From a pure story perspective, usually when Sal found someone in a similar situation as the people in Rook's campaign, the target also ends up loving Sal. Grout Bog's a very dangerous place where unfortunately thats commonplace. From a gameplay perspective, Sal's missions are often handed to her directly by random  NPCs allowing her to accumulate more "likes" that can be made into "loves". Rook's missions are given to him by a select few NPCs, so in order for him to gain boons, the game has to offer them through random events and opportunities.

[Dagar]

@TF3 Thanks for the in-depth answer! 2 hours are pretty long, compared to StS. What is good though is the fact that you have all the info available to you to catch up after a pause.