Suggestions for the New Rabbit behavior

[Kytra]

I've noticed the new "Scared" Rabbit behavior is Boolean based on whether the Rabbit was <on screen> when another rabbit died nearby. As easy as Rabbit hunting was formerly, I'm finding that it is still extremely farm-able..

Even with the new behavior, I can turn out 25-35 morsels in less than a day (depending on prioritization).

To me, this is still too easy considering how hard the other avenues of obtaining food are proving. It's the challenge I'm after. I lost a sense of wonderment for the rabbits when I discovered they could be axed down in seconds..

(I'm getting to my point, bear with me)

Currently I'm pretty sure this is the rabbit behavior:

"If (all actors-rabbits) are (on screen) when (actor-rabbit) dies, then (all actors -rabbits <on screen>) start ("Scurry Home" behavior).

I'm proposing this.. Let's make an actual "rabbit morsel" item. An inferior tier of meat to the current standard "Morsel."

Then you could implement an even more challenging rabbit behavior based on items in players inventories. Rabbits could "Scare" more easily if a player is carrying a "rabbit morsel" already. To make things even more complicated, the radius of "Scare" could increase as a player gathers more "rabbit morsels." This would keep players from grinding rabbits to self sustain for multiple days unless they divert their attention to storing the morsels before being able to continue grinding.. When a player reaches 20 "rabbit morsels" in their inventory, it could make rabbits NEVER come out of their holes without being trapped- Ultimately causing players to spread their "Wabbit Hunting" out over the course of gameplay, instead of being something able to be "pounded out" in 1-2 days and then ignoring gathering food for 6-10 days.

Just an idea.. I'm finding the "Don't Starve" mindset I once had is now a "Don't Get Hit By Nasty Monsters" Mindset... I'm just looking for ways for the "Starving" function to still scare me.. Right now it doesn't.

This wouldn't even require extensive coding to implement. Still achievable using Boolean scripts.

Edited November 28, 2012 by Kytra

[Palpetinus]

More easy suggestion: Rabbits will never run towards the player. If he blocks the hole, fine, they will just run in the opposite direction.

[mobius187]

I've discussed the issue with rabbits before, and that was even prior to them running away when one of their number perished. I don't think we need to weaken rabbit food because that would negatively impact players who hunt with rabbit traps. I mean, they're not doing anything wrong.

The real issue is with how easy it is to kill rabbits, not their food drop. I've suggested three ideas along these lines in the past:

1) Multiple Holes - Instead of one rabbit per rabbit hole, why not two rabbits holes per rabbit? If you block off one hole and attack the rabbit it should have the option to run for its other rabbit hole instead of running straight at you kamikaze-style.

2) Limited Respawn - Rabbits currently respawn from a hole after a short time. What I suggest is that after you kill a rabbit its rabbit hole(s) wion't spawn a new rabbit for 3-5 days. Sure, this will impact rabbit trap hunters, but overall collecting rabbit meat is too simple in its current format.

3) Bones - When you kill a rabbit by hand (i.e. not trap) it should leave bloody remnants on the ground that you cannot retrieve. These bones and blood should then "spook" rabbits and keep them from spawning in the immediate area for several days until they gradually fade.

Lastly, Kevin has been considering adding "rot" into the game, so meat hoarders will find their food will eventually decay and become useless. It will prevent massive food collections and force us to discard what we cannot eat. That is, until hopefully, Kevin adds in a means to preserve food (i.e. smoking/salting).

[Kytra]

Lastly, Kevin has been considering adding "rot" into the game, so meat hoarders will find their food will eventually decay and become useless. It will prevent massive food collections and force us to discard what we cannot eat. That is, until hopefully, Kevin adds in a means to preserve food (i.e. smoking/salting).

I like this idea a lot. Technically "rot" is already in game if you consider that torches have dwindling percentages and axes have durability loss.. but the real problem is to keep "Older(earliest collected)" pieces of meat "rotting" at a consistent pace when "Newer(most recently collected)" pieces would either reset the "rot" counter or have their own independent "rot" counter separate from those pieces. Currently I don't think the inventory remembers "This stack from that stack" on a chronological timeline.. reason why nothing with a durability rating (such as axes) are stack-able.

None-the-less.. "Rot" gets my vote here.

- - - Updated - - -

Edited November 28, 2012 by Kytra

[mobius187]

I like this idea a lot. Technically "rot" is already in game if you consider that torches have dwindling percentages and axes have durability loss.. but the real problem is to keep "Older(earliest collected)" pieces of meat "rotting" at a consistent pace when "Newer(most recently collected)" pieces would either reset the "rot" counter or have their own independent "rot" counter separate from those pieces. Currently I don't think the inventory remembers "This stack from that stack" on a chronological timeline.. reason why nothing with a durability rating (such as axes) are stack-able.

And basically that's the main issue Kevin was dealing with, how to handle rotting. I think each food item should have its own counter that, when expired, causes the food item to become rotten. That said, the food item would probably still need to remain stacked with other non-rotten food of the same type or this could cause issues with inventory. Of course if you do that then you need a way to extract rotten food from the stack... that or auto-stack all food in chronological order (oldest at the bottom). That way when you reach the first rotten food item you'll know it, and any others in that stack, are all rotten and you can then discard them.

What we need is a way to discard rooten food that's useful... either by feeding it to pig men or creating a new placeable that can recycle rotten food into something useful, like a compost heap.

Edited November 28, 2012 by mobius187

[atarihuana]

More easy suggestion: Rabbits will never run towards the player. If he blocks the hole, fine, they will just run in the opposite direction.

then you cant hunt them at all and need traps. the current system works just fine as it prevents massive farming without effort

[Lezli]

I agree that this thread just brings up the real issue again - hording food.

One might think that getting a stack of morsels in a day is broken, then one makes a berry-farm surrounded by trees, and gets two stacks of berries and 10 drumsticks/morsels in half a day, then one gets some pig followers that Abigail accidentally kills, and finds an infinite source of one of the best foods in the game.

It all detracts down to the fact that being able to have whole stacks of food at a time really detracts from the threat of starving (which is a core part of the game).

I'm kind of going off track here, so to address the original post: once you get more into the game, even though rabbit farming is easy, you will find it's more a waste of time than anything else, since as far as current methods go, it's one of the least efficient ways of farming food in the game. It works in the first few days (which I believe is just right) to give you enough food to get something better going, but after that, is paltry in comparison (not intending to be offensive or condescending here).

Side note: Sleeping bunnies are ADORABLE! -^.^-

[mobius187]

I agree that this thread just brings up the real issue again - hording food.

Yes. When you name your game "Don't Starve" food often ends up coming into the crosshairs. I don't blame them, this sort of balancing just takes time and there are multiple ways to approach the same problem.

One might think that getting a stack of morsels in a day is broken, then one makes a berry-farm surrounded by trees, and gets two stacks of berries and 10 drumsticks/morsels in half a day, then one gets some pig followers that Abigail accidentally kills, and finds an infinite source of one of the best foods in the game.

Yes, it comes down to overall quantity. Mind you the food train has slowed somewhat over the past month. I sued to be hoarding insane amounts of meat morsels and berries... to the point that I eventually stopped picking berries because I had nowhere to put all my food (I already had an entire chest filled only with 40-stacks of boiled berries).

The steps which have helped diminish these returns are the Gobbler, withering berry bushes (i.e. extended growth cycle), bunnies eating veggies/fruits left on the ground, and bunnies spooking when another bunny is killed on screen. But still more needs to be done. And recently spiders were no longer caught in rabbit traps.

On a side note, last time I checked pig men dropped pig butts, not hams since the recent update. Another food nerf?

I'm kind of going off track here, so to address the original post: once you get more into the game, even though rabbit farming is easy, you will find it's more a waste of time than anything else, since as far as current methods go, it's one of the least efficient ways of farming food in the game. It works in the first few days (which I believe is just right) to give you enough food to get something better going, but after that, is paltry in comparison (not intending to be offensive or condescending here).

For me I hunt rabbits only as random attacks of opportunity. I'll be off doing something or going somewhere when I'll come across some rabbits that are too far from their rabbit hole. Bam. Dead rabbit. Now in the old days I literally had meat morsels lying all around my main island... I never even bother picking up my kills. Maybe spiders should eat all meat morsels in darkness. And by that I mean they should all unspawn and we can assume spiders ate them. Spiders do eat any other meat on the ground.

As such my diet these days is usually morsel stew and cooked berries, with random crock pot meals thrown in for good measure.

On a side note, baitless traps should never catch birds. I setup three traps once and watched birds get trapped one after another, to the point where I could only watch in blank amazement. Shouldn't a caught bird scare off other birds? There's a thought.

[Lezli]

Quoth Mobius:

"And by that I mean they should all unspawn and we can assume spiders ate them. Spiders do eat any other meat on the ground."

At the VERY LEAST this could be a quick-fix! With chests only taking 12 wood each now instead of 24, I can't see how having food on the ground De-spawn could be even a slightly bad thing. Have you suggested this before? If you have, I am amazed it hasn't already been prioritized or implemented.

[mobius187]

Have you suggested this before? If you have, I am amazed it hasn't already been prioritized or implemented.

Actually no, I haven't. My subconscious must have been all like, "Dude... don't ruin a good thing!".

Now the way it should work is that any meat that is swollowed up by darkness at night should either automatically disappear or maybe get a counter, say 10 seconds, after which if the meat is still in the darkness it disappears. Obviously meat that is in the light, say, your campfire radius, should remain untouched or that would be strange.

If rot is introduced then maybe the meat would rot and then "decay". But regardless, meat shouldn't be stored randomly around the islands on the ground.