Not A Fan Of Scion

[Radicaljoe]

I am not a fan of the scion fight. The Warbot half is fun and enjoyable, I really like that half. But scion is nowhere near as enjoyable.

It has 3 attacks, the Nova which is cool but unfortunately relies a lot on where Warbot died. The dash, which is more of a repositioning attack for Scion. And the dreaded arena obliterating creep attack, which is really where 90% of the difficulty from Scion comes from.

The fight doesn't really feel like a "fight." It's more like a timer challenge where you just have to defeat Scion before it manages to run to the center of the arena and erase half the walkable space.

I would tone down the creep attack but add a few more attacks to compensate(maybe some of the ones from the concept art). Because I've seen people say changing the creep would make it too easy, but like I said that's because 90% of the actual threat is creep attack.

(also the loot stinky but that's a different issue)

[Well-met]

given the idea behind the terrain corruption is that its meant to scale with higher player count much like klaus, it really makes no sense that its so large when you're playing solo.

[SilverSpoon]

Well, Scion really got many divided opinion. You weren't the only player to give him a negative review.

However, in my opinion, I like the Scion fight, rather it’s one of my favorites. There are already over 30 normal "Boss Fight",  so I'm fine to have 1 like a DPS check so long as it’s fair. If you’re short on DPS, you can stand in the damage field and lead the direction of slam, so you can survive even a hundred slams that way.
I also like that the loot isn’t too good. Player don’t get FOMO so you are not forced a win. Maybe the real loot is the experience and friends you make along the way.

That said, I agree the Nova safe spots depend far too much on part placement and player can’t even reset. I’d prefer fixed drop points for the parts regardless of WARBOT dead point.

Edited August 18, 2025 by SilverSpoon

[AveHortor]

I like the Scion fight. It's so much easier compared to its predecessor. The fight's manageable to the point where I beat it solo, no damage taken. And overall, pretty tame when using Bone Armor and controlling where the Scion sprays.

Edited August 18, 2025 by AveHortor
Things V2

[Hungry French]

58 minutes ago, Well-met said:

Учитывая, что идея, лежащая в основе порчи ландшафта, заключается в том, что она должна масштабироваться с увеличением количества игроков, как и Клаус, то нет никакого смысла в том, чтобы она была такой большой, когда вы играете в одиночку.

It makes no sense that the world of one player is no different from 6 players.

[Evelo]

It is really funny to me how contentious the player base feels toward the lingering ground effect. Just because of how common it is in MMOs. I think nothing of it personally. I just think the combat isn't enjoyable in DST so any fight won't be enjoyable imo.

[Hungry French]

31 minutes ago, Evelo said:

Мне действительно смешно наблюдать за тем, как игроки возмущаются из-за эффекта «застывшей земли». Просто потому, что он часто встречается в MMO. Лично я ничего не имею против. Я просто считаю, что бои в DST не приносят удовольствия, так что, на мой взгляд, ни один бой не будет приятным.

Didn't you like any of the fights? Are you attracted to any boss or mob?

Edited August 18, 2025 by Hungry French

[Evelo]

56 minutes ago, Hungry French said:

Didn't you like any of the fights? Are you attracted to any boss or mob?

I like Deerclops, Bearger, Antlion, Great Depths Worm, and Malbitross because they annoy the player which forces the player to deal with them, or suffer some consequence of ignoring them. As far as the boss fight itself, no. There is no fun mob/boss to fight in DST. In my opinion of course. Combat is the weakest part of Don't Starve.

Edited August 18, 2025 by Evelo

[Cruvimaster]

The developers don't create a difficult fight without offering solutions. Wilson can handle this fight, but it's easier if you choose Wolfgang/Wigfrid. The boss becomes even easier if you use Brightshade Bomb (you don't need to use bombs exclusively, but as a damage supplement). There are countless strategies against the late-game boss. And strategy has always been a part of DST.

[SilverSpoon]

30 minutes ago, Evelo said:

I like Deerclops, Bearger, Antlion, Great Depths Worm, and Malbitross because they annoy the player which forces the player to deal with them, or suffer some consequence of ignoring them. As far as the boss fight itself, no. There is no fun mob/boss to fight in DST. In my opinion of course. Combat is the weakest part of Don't Starve.

Huh... The first word in Don't Starve Together Steam description is literally "Fight." I'm just curious, so why did you buy and are continuing this game?

I love fighting of DST.

Edited August 18, 2025 by SilverSpoon

[Well-met]

1 hour ago, Cruvimaster said:

The developers don't create a difficult fight without offering solutions. Wilson can handle this fight, but it's easier if you choose Wolfgang/Wigfrid. The boss becomes even easier if you use Brightshade Bomb (you don't need to use bombs exclusively, but as a damage supplement). There are countless strategies against the late-game boss. And strategy has always been a part of DST.

exploiting bad ai is not something intuitive than any reasonable player can expect to find out on their own

[Hungry French]

1 hour ago, Evelo said:

Мне нравятся Дирклопс, Беарджер, Антлайон, Червь Великих Глубин и Мальбитросс, потому что они раздражают игрока, заставляя его либо разбираться с ними, либо страдать от последствий их игнорирования. Что касается самого босса сражения, то нет. В DST нет забавных мобов/боссов, с которыми можно было бы сразиться. Это моё мнение, конечно. Бои — самая слабая часть Don’t Starve.

Well, Antlion and Great Depth Worm are my favorite bosses. They're more exciting than Deerclops and their music is cool and the way the fight goes.  And when you're fighting, you don't feel like you're just hitting the walls...

1 hour ago, SilverSpoon said:

Хм... Первое слово в описании Don't Starve Together в Steam — это буквально «Сражайтесь». Мне просто любопытно, почему вы купили эту игру и продолжаете в неё играть?

Я люблю играть в DST.

Well, you don't have to fight bosses. Fighting mobs is pretty exciting.

[hyoton123]

1 hour ago, Evelo said:

In my opinion of course. Combat is the weakest part of Don't Starve.

Yeah. Speaking for myself, the decisions around combat can be fun but the actual execution is pretty dull and clunky. 

[BeargerIsCute]

34 minutes ago, Well-met said:

exploiting bad ai is not something intuitive than any reasonable player can expect to find out on their own

True, but Cruvimaster didn't say anything about the AI, only that bringing specific items, or characters, can make the fight quicker/easier!

[Cruvimaster]

1 hour ago, Well-met said:

exploiting bad ai is not something intuitive than any reasonable player can expect to find out on their own

Are AFW, Misey Toadstool and Crab King intuitive to a reasonable person like you?

[Mike23Ua]

11 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

Are AFW, Misey Toadstool and Crab King intuitive to a reasonable person like you?

That would depend on what Klei Entertainment views as a reasonable fighting strategy, as well as what they deem to be cheats, exploits or something they feel must be nerfed into oblivion because they only want a fight done a specific way.

using another game as an example: Last night I built a map that in order to “kill” an enemy that had a ton of health, you needed to simultaneously fire pirate boat Canonballs at the boss from multiple directions at the same time.

The way I built the map you could stand on an pressure weight to activate each canon manually one by one, but this alone: Would not kill the monster fast enough and you will almost certainly fail, however… if you set fire charge trails and then light the charge so all canons go off at once.. this is the most effective way I planned the map to be beaten.

What does any of this have to do with dst??? Because the DST game actually has Gunpowder charges and Pirate canons but I guarantee you “Set off all canons at once” was not a strategy Klei planned for us to use against Crab King.

Some bosses even have built in Gunpowder Resistance now because: Klei wants it done in a Specific way I guess.

Edited August 19, 2025 by Mike23Ua

[Evelo]

3 hours ago, SilverSpoon said:

Huh... The first word in Don't Starve Together Steam description is literally "Fight." I'm just curious, so why did you buy and are continuing this game?

I love fighting of DST.

Sure, but it also states, "in the standalone multiplayer expansion to the uncompromising wilderness survival game, Don't Starve."

So I bought it because it is a survival game. Not to mention the latency issues with DST makes multiplayer combat even more atrocious compared to the solo experience. Cool glad you love fighting, but it could be significantly better in every possible aspect.

[Uedo]

56 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

That would depend on what Klei Entertainment views as a reasonable fighting strategy, as well as what they deem to be cheats, exploits or something they feel must be nerfed into oblivion because they only want a fight done a specific way.

using another game as an example: Last night I built a map that in order to “kill” an enemy that had a ton of health, you needed to simultaneously fire pirate boat Canonballs at the boss from multiple directions at the same time.

The way I built the map you could stand on an pressure weight to activate each canon manually one by one, but this alone: Would not kill the monster fast enough and you will almost certainly fail, however… if you set fire charge trails and then light the charge so all canons go off at once.. this is the most effective way I planned the map to be beaten.

What does any of this have to do with dst??? Because the DST game actually has Gunpowder charges and Pirate canons but I guarantee you “Set off all canons at once” was not a strategy Klei planned for us to use against Crab King.

Some bosses even have built in Gunpowder Resistance now because: Klei wants it done in a Specific way I guess.

Did you test it with a broader sample than yourself? I have a feeling your map wouldn't be as satisfying as you feel it would.

[Ohan]

Yeah I dont like scion either, like at all. 

ive sat down to practice the fight twice now and i can kill enlightened warbot fine but scion is just waay too unforgiving and relies way too much on precise positioning of the boss with its clunky big unclear hitbox dashes. 

The way you have to keep scion around the edges of the arena at all times and make it slam towards the edges just so the arena doesnt get completely covered by the creep feels so clunky and looks unintentional, like making FW’s bone cage bug out by hugging the pillars. 

the way the ground creep attack is implemented right now is just so bad. The supernova attack and hiding behind warbot legs is cool but the dashes and the creep slam are just clunky clunk clunk. 

The two times ive sat down to practice it ive asked myself why am i doing this after the 4th reroll or something and then just closed the game and played a different game thats much more enjoyable.

[SilverSpoon]

11 hours ago, Evelo said:

Sure, but it also states, "in the standalone multiplayer expansion to the uncompromising wilderness survival game, Don't Starve."

So I bought it because it is a survival game. Not to mention the latency issues with DST makes multiplayer combat even more atrocious compared to the solo experience. Cool glad you love fighting, but it could be significantly better in every possible aspect.

"the uncompromising wilderness survival game" is only solo Don't Starve, and DST is just an expansion of that. Complaining that DST doesn't have uncompromising survival is like complaining that Mario Kart doesn't have platforming.

If you persistently disparage DST's fight and demand for it to introduce survival stuffs, maybe you should play solo Don't Starve instead of Don't Starve Together.

---

Considering how much effort the developers put into implementing bosses and combat stuffs, it seems like the majority of the DST player base is enjoying the fights. Sure, the latency issue leaves something to be desired, but DST's combat is good enough.

Edited August 19, 2025 by SilverSpoon

[Cruvimaster]

We'll certainly always have a segment of the community who dislike certain bosses. They don't like Scion, AFW, and they certainly wouldn't like Dragonfly if Klei prevented them from using walls.

For some, a good boss design seems to be one where the giant can be defeated with just a hambat and a football helmet. Anything that requires other resources EXISTING in the game is labeled cheese or bad design by these players.

In other games, difficult bosses are treated as a reason to improve the player's skill. In DST, if something is difficult, they just come to the forums and beg to make it easier for them (and for everyone else who didn't want it).

Nobody needs the Celestial Jewel to defeat anything in this game. But they know it's a very powerful item. So they beg Klei to make it easy for them.

[Uedo]

41 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

We'll certainly always have a segment of the community who dislike certain bosses.

No necessarily, assume people have views because they believe them? 

I think Scion, specifically, is lazy. 
Dfly is fine, bit clunky but that's fine considering the spawning mechanics.
FW is often praised as being one of the best bosses in the game for design(not necessarily going into how awkward it can be). Thematically and functionally, it makes very good stylistic sense, the scripting for behaviour makes a lot of sense, it's actually quite clean too. Again, it's just a lot if you view each element in isolation, but great design overall.

So yeah, we'll may have a segment of the community who dislike certain bosses, but it's valid feedback cause they can point out what they don't like? They don't have grudges or anything, that's weird.

46 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

Nobody needs the Celestial Jewel to defeat anything in this game. But they know it's a very powerful item. So they beg Klei to make it easy for them.

Holy generalisation, Batman.

[SilverSpoon]

1 hour ago, Cruvimaster said:

For some, a good boss design seems to be one where the giant can be defeated with just a hambat and a football helmet. Anything that requires other resources EXISTING in the game is labeled cheese or bad design by these players.

Requiring resource grinding just to fight the boss fairly is actually Bad design. I like Scion fight, but I don't like having to grind Mushy Cakes or Moon Shrooms just to deal with grogginess and just to fight him fairly. Regarding AFW, if you unless have The Lazy Explorer or use what I don't know the details whatever totally not intuitive method, it won't be even fight.

Example to counter this is to ease or delete the grind gatekeeping. Such as for AFW, by putting The Lazy Explorer or Weather Pain in the Ornate Chests along the way to the Atrium.

1 hour ago, Cruvimaster said:

In DST, if something is difficult, they just come to the forums and beg to make it easier for them (and for everyone else who didn't want it).

They don't only want the difficult stuff to be easy, there are many request to improve something actually bad design... In your opinion, about Inimical Gestalt was it beg to make it easier?

Edited August 19, 2025 by SilverSpoon

[Evelo]

3 hours ago, SilverSpoon said:

"the uncompromising wilderness survival game" is only solo Don't Starve, and ...

There's a whole host of misconstrued comments here and I am pretty sure any comment won't help you understand because of my inability to properly articulate my thoughts. So I won't bother. 

[SilverSpoon]

3 minutes ago, Evelo said:

There's a whole host of misconstrued comments here and I am pretty sure any comment won't help you understand because of my inability to properly articulate my thoughts. So I won't bother. 

Then please tell me only this. Am I saying incorrect in terms of English grammar? I'm not a native speaker, after all.