POLL - Wortox's Affinities

[asdsaax]

Checking how people feel about current state of Wortox's post-rift abilities

[kehun]

I like both tbh but after defeating fuelweaver with lunar affinity i will change to shadow 

I like the fact that you can obtain affinity skill with specific items which i guess it's cool because Wortox on his own is pretty good

[Baark0]

the damage from shadow affinity rarely feels like it outdamages just holding f with a fully charged void cowl, especially since the soul hop time is time you are unable to attack, which usually leads to you losing your streak. maybe the aoe part of it feels better, but having to soul hop just to get the aoe is kind of clunky imo.

lunar affinity feels good, instead of having to soul hop 2 extra times to avoid getting hit, you just keep holding f, leading to more dps since no kiting/getting hit.

overall i just wish the affinities did something outside of the damage and damage reduction buffs before you unlock rifts. no other character is locked out of both affinities unique abilities until rifts are active, the closest i can think of being some of winonas lunar skills (but not all) and wormwoods brightshade branch, but even then the characters still have other affinity skills to choose from.

[Echsrick]

but does the scythe still call wortox a mortal?

[OMEGASCRUFF]

I'm sorry, but I just don't see the purpose in Shadow Harvester unless you're willing to drop Soul Decoy III, and it has overlap in functionality with Soul Pierce too. I skill swap to it for killing Bee Queen in my long-term world, but I switch off ASAP because there's no way I can fit Capricious Movement into a full AoE Naughty build, and that skill alone reduces how much jar refilling I need to do by a monumental amount.

I know people generally like it more, and I thought it was better initially too, but I just don't see the point. It really only helps in a significant way for one fight in this game. I guess two if you count Possessed Varg, but Lunar Swindler is really good in that fight anyways. I dunno. Redundancy is what makes it feel so bad, to me, I think. And I care too much about maximizing my DPS, which Lunar Swindler does better. Below average damage is Wortox's only major weakness, so I put extra effort into it.

In multiplayer, I don't think it's as bad, especially since your personal DPS matters significantly less and your utility matters more, but you'd still only get high value out of it on a full Nice build, which I don't think is worthwhile. You can keep Overflowing Greed and Soul Decoy III with a Nice build by just taking Reaching Souls I for the Nice inclination point, and we all know Soul Bastion is worth skipping. (...It's funny. I found a good use case for Soul Bastion in a solo long-term world, but never did the same in multiplayer. That skill is so wack, dude, what's up with that?)

I remember bringing this up in my very first forum thread. We've all been talking about this for awhile.

They're both kinda sauceless though. I wish they had an additional effect that you could utilize pre-rift, other than the innate affinity bonus.

On top of all that, I don't think Reverberation should affect either of these skills. I think they should behave the way the currently do with Reverberation, by default, regardless of whether or not you take it. Having both affinities dependent on another unrelated skill is super lame. I'd be able to take Capricious Movement in that aforementioned AoE build if it wasn't like this, because Reverberation loses value later on into your playthrough anyways if it weren't for its impact on both affinities.

Edit: I lied. I did find a use for it. I skill swapped to it for the innate damage bonus to pearled Crab King during an all-bosses run, because that fight is still agonizing on base damage even after the rework. I didn't rush Fuelweaver first because shadow rifts don't restrict access to an early boss like lunar rifts do for year 1 Crystal Deerclops. So this was without the weapon. Lol...

[aidancode]

The fact that Wortox's affinities do effectively nothing until after killing the final bosses (a trait literally no other skill tree has, though Wilson's is close) is really lame IMO. Shadow Harvester totally could do a weaker version of the same ability when equipt with other weapons, and Lunar Swindler could just remove hit stun for 2 hits but not protect from damage when wearing other armors maybe? But yeah these skills locked entirely to the endgame are pretty boring. Like, yay, you get the shadow reaper and you're gonna be stronger for 3 bosses that you haven't already done. The AoE is useful for one of the three. I say all this coming from the PoV that these skills are awesome but extremely underutilized.

[Theukon-dos]

I still think that Wortox should have Forge and Gorge alignments instead of Shadow and Lunar alignments.

He's a dimension-hopping hooligan who knows too much yet shares so little. He's not trapped in the constant at all and only sticks around because the survivors are a fun group, and is responsable for atleast 1 crossover with an entirely seperate game.

If Wortox doesn't have to follow the rules, then why should his skill tree?

 

As for the perks themselves... bleugh. As others have said, the fact that they're completely locked to post-rift content is a real drag sense it means picking them is a dead perk point for who knows how long. But more than that, what do either of the alignment skills have to do with Wortox as a character? Like, shadow-alignment bolstering the reaper is absolutly just a pun about him reaping souls. Which is fair, but also extremely lame. But what does brightshade armor have to do with him at all? There's absolutely no connecting thread between him as a character and his lunar-armor effects. You could mad-libs whatever item the effect is tied to and it would hardly change anything in the grand scheme of things. It's just a perk for the sake of having an alignment perk.

 

I've talked about alignment perks before and how I wish they'd be far more impactful than simply just "You get X instead of Y". And Wortox is no exception. I've actually been thinking about what alignment perks I'd want him to have for a while, so if it was up to me, the perks he'd get would be called "Fire-Forged Fiend" and "Engorged Goetia".

Fire-Forged Fiend causes Wortox to occasionally knock soul splinters out of whatever enemy he's hitting that immediately heal him and any nearby allies for a small amount once they hit the ground. But in exchange his souls are replaced with vengeful spirits that give him and his allies a temporary/stacking planar damage buff when released. This would cut back on his ability to support allies, but in exchange encourages a much more agressive playstyle and encourages going after larger prey instead of just camping the world's bee farm for five minutes.

While Engorged Goetia would increase Wortox's maximum hunger and hunger drain, but in exchange he would be able to use his teleportation abilities by spending hunger instead of souls. This would double down on his food problems, but reward any player who can manage them properly with much easier to use warping while saving souls for more important matters.

[asdsaax]

Bump to collect more opinions if possible

[Mysterious box]

I know it's too late in the cycle but considering how Wortox is supposed to know more I think it would have been more in line for him to have a universal effect that carried between any post rift items for his aligment

[YouKnowWho142]

2 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

I know it's too late in the cycle but considering how Wortox is supposed to know more I think it would have been more in line for him to have a universal effect that carried between any post rift items for his aligment

it gives the impression that they don't really intend to add much other post-rift gear, if they do it absolutely needs to be changed but even now it feels kind of bad and even if we ignore the item specific requirements and the requirement for post rift progression the actual perks arent that interesting to me

[OMEGASCRUFF]

3 minutes ago, YouKnowWho142 said:

it gives the impression that they don't really intend to add much other post-rift gear, if they do it absolutely needs to be changed

I'm worried about this, too. It's very much not future-proofed at the moment.

[Mr. Furman]

Is it just me or these two affinity perks are extremely alike from appearance to function?

I am honestly looking forward to more interesting stuff in the affinity perks...

[Grove]

I honestly really like the double hit from the shadoe one. Does it make you do less damage? Idk but I already soul hop to dodge as Wortox. And it's honestly really cool to be rewarded for avoiding attacks in a character specific way.

[asdsaax]

One last bump to highlight the opinions, since beta is probably coming to an end

Thank you for voting and sharing your perspective

[OMEGASCRUFF]

Hypothetically, if Lunar Swindler/Shadow Harvester never existed, and we were to design them from scratch on our own, what kind of effect would you want the affinities to do on Wortox?

I had a bit of a hard time coming up with an answer, myself, that is actually up-to-snuff with other affinities. Wondering if other people have any ideas.

[WilsonHiggs]

Is sad that wortox got such bad, unfun(moon affinity), and not usable in early affinities (atleast the shadow one is fun to use) while... other character got such ammount of perks.

Well, his entire tree is kind of bad...

he just got:

- a way to break the balance of his soul storage mechanic

- souls dealing damage which is only useful against 1 boss and when you want to get tons of souls

- a tool to gather stuff which is also a cheap dark soul but doesnt make sense because is an storage item that doesnt give any storage slot but is linked to your character inventory to deal damage because it gets filled when you fill his inventory(?)...is like the jars mechanic were at first designed for the pouch but they scrapped it and added the jars...

- tons of filler perks...wow and entire skill point to make souls come at your faster super useful. Meanwhile wendy got skill points with 4836262 effects....

- tons of skills that are only useful in multiplayer...

 

 

Klei is unbalancing the characters by adding boring skill points instead of adding fun stuff

[Hollow soul 3]

1 hour ago, OMEGASCRUFF said:

Hypothetically, if Lunar Swindler/Shadow Harvester never existed, and we were to design them from scratch on our own, what kind of effect would you want the affinities to do on Wortox?

I had a bit of a hard time coming up with an answer, myself, that is actually up-to-snuff with other affinities. Wondering if other people have any ideas.

I'm genuinely surprised they didn't give us a new way to use souls. Teleporting and healing are great, but it's not a wortox specific ability any more.

With two branches in Walters still tree, he gets all the abilities wortox started with. Maybe it's time to give wortox something that makes him stand out more