Wendy Skill Tree Poll

[WenericMember]

Since theres a lot of heightened tensions in regards to sentiments about Wendys tree, and minimal confirmed further changes by Klei, i feel like we should gather opinions on the state of her tree.

[WenericMember]

Just now, Fitzee said:

I want Team Spirit to be better so badly.

Team spirit and gravestones for me, then im happy. A few other skills can get some improvements, but thats whats needed imo.

[yigejuhao]

The tree needs to be rebuilt from the ground up !

[Peasant]

Both alignment lines needs rework or adjustment imo, sisturn still provides little use (or maybe I'm just eager to see my own idea get accepted), as for mourning glory line…The empty space here is too little to write them down.

[WenericMember]

3 minutes ago, Fitzee said:

I still have a deep desire to be able to control Abigail and Wendy at the same time, but I'm hard coping and need to let go; my recent suggestion would be the next best thing. 

Perhaps you could bump/make a thread describing your gravestone suggestion. 

I have a few times. They've probably seen it by now, but I might make one last one after the weekend. I dont really feel invested with any singular perk, just so long as buffs are made.

[purelove]

Humorous behavior, because some people think that all opinions only exist in the forum, in fact, the outside world discontent far more than here

[cloudf]

Only 12% voted satisfied and 43% voted complete rework is needed.

I suppose it is bad?

[Harvey2000]

The tree needs to be rebuilt from the ground up

[Ugur01]

There's something suspicious about this poll. There's very few conversation, despite 85 forum members participating in the poll. It's as if there are new members who just signed up to vote in this poll.

[JoeW]

7 minutes ago, Ugur01 said:

There's something suspicious about this poll. There's very few conversation, despite 85 forum members participating in the poll. It's as if there are new members who just signed up to vote in this poll.

Most of the of the participants in this poll are not posting about it. Only a small part of the responders are brand new, and even then we have a lot of brand new accounts joining to give feedback.  

I don't see anything to suggest something weird going on. 

[Wilson-brb]

The skill tree does not need to be build from the ground up imo, i think its very good the way it is right now , Abigail is strong, sinergizes well fighting with wendy , and wendy has some cool stuff too besides abigail, i like t

[WenericMember]

17 minutes ago, Ugur01 said:

There's something suspicious about this poll. There's very few conversation, despite 85 forum members participating in the poll. It's as if there are new members who just signed up to vote in this poll.

I thonk the conversations just been played out tbh. Theres been so many different threads, ideas and argunents in the past few weeks that there isnt much new to say. Plus ive already done a few of these polls.

6 hours ago, cloudf said:

Only 12% voted satisfied and 43% voted complete rework is needed.

I suppose it is bad?

Relatively yes. I think the bigger issue though is there hasnt been any movement. Wortoxs tree started in an only mildly better state, but in later polls improved massively iirc. Wendys reception just isnt changing, even with the patches.

 

8 minutes ago, Wilson-brb said:

The skill tree does not need to be build from the ground up imo, i think its very good the way it is right now , Abigail is strong, sinergizes well fighting with wendy , and wendy has some cool stuff too besides abigail, i like t

Yeah, i like it overall although  I think some lines could still use some buffs. Itll be interesting to see what will happen in the end. Wendys tree being reworked again later seems likely atp, as theyre running out of beta time. 

If they do rework it again, i just hope they keep shadow alignment, team spirit, vengeful ghost, the first two potion tiers,  and the design for the new flower crown. Theres a lot to love in her tree and id hate to see it go to waste.

[Mike23Ua]

I voted potions need a rework, but anyone can easily understand why…

Klei never intended for us to be able to directly drink them, now that we CAN they need their own effects, perhaps add some new ones that can only be used by Abigail or Wendy but not the other?

I don’t know I’m just spitballing here but Vigor Mortis is a completely useless potion, I despise it’s entire existence.. haunting them as a dead player to gain a temporary speed boost to float faster is soooooo boring- Painfully boring..

And the potions intended use “speed up how fast Abigail follows behind you” is hardly any better… Bernie got to move faster via a nice QoL patch, Abby however… needs this dumb potion to do what QoL should allow her to do.

that said… we can now DRINK them, which if it allowed us to have the same effects as Wes Speedy Balloons (with roughly the same duration) the Vigor Mortis potion would see significantly more use, and would actually be viable for boss fights.

Other then a full potions rework I think the new skill tree is fine, but I don’t want potion drinking to feel like it was just tacked on for a little flavor.. (pun intended) I want a lot of genuine thought and creativity to go into it.

Same with Abigail’s “haunt” command, I can now target things in the world and ask Abigail to haunt them…

So what will this do if I tell Abby to “haunt” myself, my Beefalo, or even another player?

Essentially this turns Wendys playstyle into the Spell Caster/Summoner/Potion Drinker but…. That’s the vibe I get from her Skill tree anyway.

[DegenerateFurry]

Dude, I want Wendy to have a "skull tree" now. That sounds metal.

[WenericMember]

3 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Dude, I want Wendy to have a "skull tree" now. That sounds metal.

Rofllllllll just noticed that, am NOT used to mobile

[Ridepod]

At this point I think demanding that the skill tree needs to be scrapped and re-done entirely is just selfish. Even if it were, it would just cause more discord and I don't think the people calling for it would be appeased. Like, I think Wendy is still a great and fun character pre-skill tree, what exactly are you expecting the skill tree to turn her into at this point?

[WenericMember]

12 minutes ago, Ridepod said:

At this point I think demanding that the skill tree needs to be scrapped and re-done entirely is just selfish. Even if it were, it would just cause more discord and I don't think the people calling for it would be appeased. Like, I think Wendy is still a great and fun character pre-skill tree, what exactly are you expecting the skill tree to turn her into at this point?

I dont know. I just wish there was  a clearer consensus. Under 30% I woud call their opinions an obvious minority, and over 55% enough that it should be remade, but ~40% is a weird midle ground where its too much to ignore, but too little to justify the drastic action being proposed.

[DegenerateFurry]

3 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

I dont know. I just wish there was  a clearer consensus. Under 30% I woud call their opinions an obvious minority, and over 55% enough that it should be remade, but ~40% is a weird midle ground where its too much to ignore, but too little to justify the drastic action being proposed.

Keep in mind, we do know that there's been a lot of brigading from a Chinese-speaking forum lately, so this poll is likely being messed with by them. It'd explain the discrepancy between the poll's results and what we see talked about on this forum (which is that people are generally liking the changes and have more minor complaints). 

[WenericMember]

5 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Keep in mind, we do know that there's been a lot of brigading from a Chinese-speaking forum lately, so this poll is likely being messed with by them. It'd explain the discrepancy between the poll's results and what we see talked about on this forum (which is that people are generally liking the changes and have more minor complaints). 

Thats probably true to some extent, the people who are happy wouldnt need to make accounts.  That said its quite difficult to judge the polls skew, and their opinions are just as valid, so its probably best to take at face value imo.

[Mike23Ua]

51 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Dude, I want Wendy to have a "skull tree" now. That sounds metal.

I know this is intended as a joke, but Wendy’s skill tree revolves almost if not entirely around playing the game a very specific way…

if the player is playing on “Wilderness Mode” or “Delete my world if I die” then Wendy misses out on ALOT of what her skill tree is intended to do for her.

She can’t make her own GMBW tombstones without a skeleton, she can’t create skeletons without dying… (so yes Wendy does in fact need a SKULL tree Lmao.)

The perk so dead players ghosts can temporarily deal damage on the land of the living- that perk doesn’t work anymore either (though I consider this one just for fun flavor or maybe to help noobs with Varg hound waves) 

There are ways to make these things more viable for Solo players though-

Such as allowing Wendy to craft her own skeleton decor (the chicks literally wearing a dead birds skull as a hairbow so don’t tell me it’s unfitting for her to do so.)

And to also allow hired followers that are killed (probably a maximum limit for balance purposes) to temporarily turn into a ghost & make use of the “vengeful spirit” perk outside of Multiplayer sessions.

(Aka Pigman dies, becomes ghost, Wendy gets to use the vengeful perk.. Ghost disappears into the ground after the time is up never to be seen again.)

[DegenerateFurry]

1 minute ago, Mike23Ua said:

I know this is intended as a joke, but Wendy’s skill tree revolves almost if not entirely around playing the game a very specific way…

if the player is playing on “Wilderness Mode” or “Delete my world if I die” then Wendy misses out on ALOT of what her skill tree is intended to do for her.

She can’t make her own GMBW tombstones without a skeleton, she can’t create skeletons without dying… (so yes Wendy does in fact need a SKULL tree Lmao.)

The perk so dead players ghosts can temporarily deal damage on the land of the living- that perk doesn’t work anymore either (though I consider this one just for fun flavor or maybe to help noobs with Varg hound waves) 

There are ways to make these things more viable for Solo players though-

Such as allowing Wendy to craft her own skeleton decor (the chicks literally wearing a dead birds skull as a hai bow so don’t tell me it’s unfitting for her to do so.)

And to also allow hired followers that are killed (probably a maximum limit for balance purposes) to temporarily turn into a ghost & make use of the “vengeful spirit” perk outside of Multiplayer sessions.

(Aka Pigman dies, becomes ghost, Wendy gets to use the vengeful perk.. Ghost disappears into the ground after the time is up never to be seen again.)

Y'know what? Those are all really good points, and I'm definitely in favor of anything that adds more spooky decoration options. Now I genuinely do want a Skull Tree.

[Mike23Ua]

Actually I just came up with a much better idea, mobs in the world (when a Wendy player is in the session and near them) when they “Die” (Pigman, Bunnyman) maybe not Merms cause Wendy can’t hire those without Wurts help (and she has own dead Merm gimmick going)...? Pigmen & Bunnymen ANYWAY they drop a Skeleton, this lasts for as long as they’re a ghost (30 seconds or so I think?) and when they're ghost disappears their skeleton will fall apart and fade away.

Spoiler

This gives Wendy roughly 30 seconds or so to reach a dead followers skeleton corpse (sounds morbid but that’s the type of game DST is) and make use of her GMBW skill to turn the temporary corpse into a Tombstone.

This would allow even solo players who play the game on “delete my world instantly” settings to use the GMBW and vengeful ghost perks.

[Ridepod]

4 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

I dont know. I just wish there was  a clearer consensus. Under 30% I woud call their opinions an obvious minority, and over 55% enough that it should be remade, but ~40% is a weird midle ground where its too much to ignore, but too little to justify the drastic action being proposed.

Maybe its just a few outspoken voices, but I feel like every demand that I read to redo Wendy is never provided with context or a solution. However, there are currently several front page writeup posts from different users that do provide criticism 

 

I really just think she needs balance changes, and maybe some skill points merged or expanded upon. This is what I'm running right now in my current world:

Going with gestalt atm so I can form a more solid opinion after killing more bosses, but I think shadow would probably benefit my skill allocation more. But I don't want to carry around mourning glory and butterfly wings right now so I might just stick with it. Current opinion is that gestalt should keep her damage but get her attack behavior last patch except for avoiding agro entirely

She has enough skills now compared to the start of beta (especially with the 3 strong brews) that points actually matter. I never touch the sisturn so I'm ignoring all the Blessed Sisturn skills. Just built a forget-me-lot farm to stock up my picnic casket with the ghastly experience potions instead -- I figure its a choice between the two, if you want to go with the sisturn skills and keeping it full of flowers or just making the potion to get her back to 600 HP whenever she dies. However I think Blessed Sisturn 1 and 2 should be merged at this point

Went all in on gravestones mostly for being able to build something other characters can't. When evil flowers were more useful for her crafts I could see it being worth 3 points but I think Final Resting Place? and Gravestones By Wendy should be merged. The dark flowers are only useful for making more gravestones, and the gravestones are only useful for spawning pipspooks and ghosts. However the few gravestones I have so far I just got from making Abby haunt wild flowers.

Got most of the Team Spirits simply for utility. Team Spirit II (dash attack) has AoE currently for gestalt Abby (possible bug? idk) so you can just use her like moose woodie's charge and is useful for when she's lagging behind. I don't use Team Spirit I (escape) like ever. Didn't bother with Team Spirit III (scare) after having it previous update, the times I tried to use it I didn't notice much of a difference. Originally I thought it would be a streamlined way to lose agro from enemies, but if I want to lose something neutral's agro, it is easier to make Abby attack then unsummon her. Team Spirit IV (haunt) is good for the evil flowers but super tedious to keep haunting the same flower half a dozen times.

 

 

 

[WenericMember]

3 minutes ago, Ridepod said:

Maybe its just a few outspoken voices, but I feel like every demand that I read to redo Wendy is never provided with context or a solution. However, there are currently several front page writeup posts from different users that do provide criticism 

 

I really just think she needs balance changes, and maybe some skill points merged or expanded upon. This is what I'm running right now in my current world:

Going with gestalt atm so I can form a more solid opinion after killing more bosses, but I think shadow would probably benefit my skill allocation more. But I don't want to carry around mourning glory and butterfly wings right now so I might just stick with it. Current opinion is that gestalt should keep her damage but get her attack behavior last patch except for avoiding agro entirely

She has enough skills now compared to the start of beta (especially with the 3 strong brews) that points actually matter. I never touch the sisturn so I'm ignoring all the Blessed Sisturn skills. Just built a forget-me-lot farm to stock up my picnic casket with the ghastly experience potions instead -- I figure its a choice between the two, if you want to go with the sisturn skills and keeping it full of flowers or just making the potion to get her back to 600 HP whenever she dies. However I think Blessed Sisturn 1 and 2 should be merged at this point

Went all in on gravestones mostly for being able to build something other characters can't. When evil flowers were more useful for her crafts I could see it being worth 3 points but I think Final Resting Place? and Gravestones By Wendy should be merged. The dark flowers are only useful for making more gravestones, and the gravestones are only useful for spawning pipspooks and ghosts. However the few gravestones I have so far I just got from making Abby haunt wild flowers.

Got most of the Team Spirits simply for utility. Team Spirit II (dash attack) has AoE currently for gestalt Abby (possible bug? idk) so you can just use her like moose woodie's charge and is useful for when she's lagging behind. I don't use Team Spirit I (escape) like ever. Didn't bother with Team Spirit III (scare) after having it previous update, the times I tried to use it I didn't notice much of a difference. Originally I thought it would be a streamlined way to lose agro from enemies, but if I want to lose something neutral's agro, it is easier to make Abby attack then unsummon her. Team Spirit IV (haunt) is good for the evil flowers but super tedious to keep haunting the same flower half a dozen times.

 

 

 

I imagine ts 1 and 2 each compensate f0r an alignments weakness. 1 gives shadow evasion, while 2 gives lunar aoe.

I suspect the lack of ideas is because building a well rounded skill tree is, unsurprisingly, a difficult task.

I think your critiques are well rounded, esp about team spirit. That said I think gravestones 3 provides minimal value for a tier 3 skill, when it could buils on the good, but underdeveloped concept pf a safe apace they mentioned on stream.

[WenericMember]

Whats annoying is team spirit 1 is pretty much supposed to make Abigail able to kote like a player, but its just not viable in its current state. Its the answer to the bulk problem, but its just being ignored.