Klei needs to stop trying to turn Don’t Starve into Terraria

[Gashzer]

1 hour ago, SilverSpoon said:

Not true, certain players seems to hate spending more than 1 item during fights for some reason.

Switching between weapon and walking cane during fights is a basic technique and isn't annoying.

Spoken like a true pc player. Switching between weapon and cane is chunky on consoles. Now add weatherpain, healing, lazy Explorer, general aiming, nightmare amulet, armour. This is alot of switching to do on consoles and makes for a terrible experience during AFW fight for example.

PC gamers arnt the only people playing DST.

[arubaro]

9 hours ago, Evelo said:

Yeah that's understandable for things that actively hunt you. Not things that are passive. The seasonal bosses are really good because they distrupt the general flow and require the player to deal with it or suffer. All of the bosses since then are all ignorable and entirely optional. Additionally, since the shift seems to be moving more towards combat, can we please get a combat redo. Holding F is not engaging.

We are getting it in form of unbalanced spells while enemies are becoming easier because of that

[SilverSpoon]

39 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

Spoken like a true pc player. Switching between weapon and cane is chunky on consoles. Now add weatherpain, healing, lazy Explorer, general aiming, nightmare amulet, armour. This is alot of switching to do on consoles and makes for a terrible experience during AFW fight for example.

PC gamers arnt the only people playing DST.

I'm Sorry but I haven't taken consoles into consideration at all.
As for that, I don't know whether to improve console operability or to delete switching for console players. I think the former is better.

[dst_lover]

8 minutes ago, SilverSpoon said:

I'm Sorry but I haven't taken consoles into consideration at all.
As for that, I don't know whether to improve console operability or to delete switching for console players. I think the former is better.

I am a console player and it’s not even hard to do it

[Bumber64]

2 hours ago, arubaro said:

We are getting it in form of unbalanced spells while enemies are becoming easier because of that

Such as Wilson's torch toss.

Tossing tragic torch at AFW 1-shots him. no cap fr fr

[Gashzer]

51 minutes ago, Bumber64 said:

Such as Wilson's torch toss.

Tossing tragic torch at AFW 1-shots him. no cap fr fr

Torch toss is great. I don't care if everyone hates it, i love it!

Full torch tree, 4 skills in middle line of alchemist, 3 beard insulation skills and shadow affinity is the meta OP Wilson build. Lanterns/minerhat/moggles are for the noobies.

[dst_lover]

7 hours ago, grm9 said:

people could stop using spear because of realising that it's too good and invalidates a lot of stuff

it sucked before they fixed it because it required waiting for spring, most people also did the fight with out cheese either way because they wanted to get fun out of fighting, it was only useful for people that didn't like doing the fight

what advantage? getting lucky with atrium tentacle pillar or atrium getting connected to some other place that you can get to was still faster in comparison to using it and we got atrium tentacle pillar set piece now either way

1 if there is a spear that deals 50 damage and there is a spear deals 49 and they are literally the same weapon yes you can say that the spear that deals 50 people will not use it but that will not happen 99% of people will just use the batter spear 

yes I agreed that it’s not the best method but for people who is not that skilled and need things like the weather pain or gunpowder that method is why cheaper and easier to do then methods like fighting it with weather pain and it can save you time if u went to fight the AFW multiple times and if u are saying that it’s only used for people who doesn’t went to fight the boss then why don’t add it as an item that is actually balanced 

You said it yourself if u get  (lucky) in a normal world it’s just batter and can skip the whole atrium 

[W0l0l0]

On 10/9/2024 at 5:38 PM, DegenerateFurry said:

That's not what I said at all. I'm just saying that some bugs are so accepted that they even get implemented as features later on. It's to prove that bugs can be beneficial to a game, which means they aren't inherently bad, which means that patching them is not always the right move. Some should just be left in because they're not hurting anyone, and the Lure Plant cheese wasn't hurting anyone and should've been left in.

Disagree to an extent. When a bug bypasses elements of the game, it can become so normalised that people think Dragonfly is an easy boss because they've never once actually fought them the way they're intended to be. I think that sucks. It's a case by case basis, which brings me onto my second point.

You completely ommited the Ancient Guardian pillar strategy that was adapted into a game mechanic. Sure, bugs can certainly be good for the game, but it seems like you're presenting this argument as if Klei only squashes them, which is clearly not the case.

[Echsrick]

once this rift nonsense is over i hope for cooler things

[DegenerateFurry]

2 hours ago, W0l0l0 said:

Disagree to an extent. When a bug bypasses elements of the game, it can become so normalised that people think Dragonfly is an easy boss because they've never once actually fought them the way they're intended to be. I think that sucks. It's a case by case basis, which brings me onto my second point.

You completely ommited the Ancient Guardian pillar strategy that was adapted into a game mechanic. Sure, bugs can certainly be good for the game, but it seems like you're presenting this argument as if Klei only squashes them, which is clearly not the case.

Oh, I didn't omit it, I just forgot about it because that was so long ago and nobody complains about it. Thanks for reminding me, it'll help me further argue against people who say Klei should get rid of all bugs.

[Lardee]

I blame the youtubers who make it seem like the only thing that matters is how fast you can kill bosses.

[HellHeater]

I wonder what these megabase haters do when they go outside and see megabase.

[Evelo]

15 hours ago, grm9 said:

that's not what i meant, most people seem to think that balance means all things being roughly almost equally as good with some arbitrary criteria that might be irrelevant for a lot of other people

Oh. In that case, yeah balance isn't required. Totally agree. My apologies for misunderstanding.

15 hours ago, grm9 said:

mega basers probably don't want more annoyances that they need to deal with...

Mega basers have the option of disabling settings, just as I have options of enabling them. If they want their perfect little world, they can disable it if they desire.

 

15 hours ago, grm9 said:

i still don't see what's the issue with just forcing yourself to fight them before day X or regen the world after not doing that

Because that is still Me going to Them. I want Them to come to Me. It changes the feeling from Hunter to Hunted. I want to feel Hunted like you do with Deerclops, and Antlion, Bearger, Hound Waves, Worm Waves. Even if it is something small like an option to enable certain milestones at certain day break points. Maybe moonstorms automatically start with this option enabled at day 100 or something. Yea you can enable rifts on day 1. But that is just that. Day 1. There is no progression just jump into the meat of it. If you could auto start rifts on say day 200. I would be totally on board with that. The world can feel so alive when things happen with no player input. Just like real life. If you sit in your home all day the world still moves without your input.

[SOS-Ouroboros-K]

On 10/9/2024 at 8:53 PM, Gashzer said:

Its not about me, i have no power here, its clearly Klei that doesn't like having a buggy game hence the fixes 

And what freedom? The freedom to not fight bosses? The freedom to not play the game but use slightly different variations of the same old pathfinding exploit for different bosses? 

Aye klei reintroduce the lureplant exploit and make it work for all bosses, i want the freedom to not need to play your game anymore to gain all of the rewards.

I think of a commonly overlooked problem:

Q: If you were making a game, what would be the first and most important of all?
A: Set the rules of the game.

If I had to discuss the pseudo-thesis, I would say: If a player fails to ask a specific question about the idea of a game when he is not comfortable with it, and instead turns to the official idea of providing a reference answer as a "mistake," I would consider that a sign of "confidence" (ridicule).

If you want unlimited gameplay, you probably don't need finished games, but game development software.

Spoiler

On 10/10/2024 at 1:55 AM, Evelo said:

Minecraft focuses on the freedom to build whatever you want.

My horse: No boarding

Well, To be honest, I think, an update that goes in the direction like Minecraft would be a real disaster.

 

[Mr Giggio]

On 10/9/2024 at 8:23 AM, cameron8800 said:

Klei has an awful track record of punishing creativity. 

That's not true.

Fixing bugs ain't punishing creativity.

How u went from point A to B dictates a lot about ur perspective but not about Klei's 

On 10/9/2024 at 9:31 AM, cameron8800 said:

Because they aren’t bugs.

It just doesn't make sense u call stuff otherwise just cuz they r here it has 10 years. A bug is a bug. Klei took their time to find people that would will to fix, yes. But time has come. "Why now?" You guys can argue, but listen it might be hard as #$&@!/# to fix a code written ten years ago. It's about adapting yourself to old rules written by another person. Understandable that it took time.

[arubaro]

On 10/10/2024 at 10:43 AM, grm9 said:

mega basers probably don't want more annoyances that they need to deal with and i still don't see what's the issue with just forcing yourself to fight them before day X or regen the world after not doing that

I megabase but also i want survival content.

Megabasers are only against of brainless destruction that brings no challenge.

Hamlet had good survival mechanics in the weather, events and mobs without being destructive. Things like scorpions poisoning you when far away of base, mobs evolving and migrating, vines covering the map, fog, etc.

Sw also has cool survival mechanics like mosquitoes appearing in ponds, the ponds itself making slowing and making wet the player

There are room for a lot of fun survival mechanics that doesnt need to simply destroy non survival buildings... that is simply ridiculous since it only brings free resources for those who play with small bases.

We got stuff that could have been cool but hail is so easy to counter...they shouldnt be countered by the umbralla, makes no sense.

Miasma is a cool addition but is a waste of potential... it only appear near optional small areas

[Edible Coal]

the lure plant is a bug, since bosses destory things like statue or built structures, they just forget to make the lure plant destroyable

[grm9]

38 minutes ago, Mr Giggio said:

Klei took their time to find people that would will to fix, yes. But time has come. "Why now?" You guys can argue, but listen it might be hard as #$&@!/# to fix a code written ten years ago. It's about adapting yourself to old rules written by another person. Understandable that it took time

lure plant fix was literally 6 lines of code, they also explicitly said that they only removed it because of it working on junk yard werepig, 1 of the new bosses that were made for punishing you for attempting to kill them through any way except brainlessly simply fighting with a weapon and optionally armor

21 hours ago, W0l0l0 said:

Disagree to an extent. When a bug bypasses elements of the game, it can become so normalised that people think Dragonfly is an easy boss because they've never once actually fought them the way they're intended to be. I think that sucks. It's a case by case basis, which brings me onto my second point

that's an issue with people not wanting to get fun out of playing the game because of doing that requiring effort

21 hours ago, W0l0l0 said:

You completely ommited the Ancient Guardian pillar strategy that was adapted into a game mechanic. Sure, bugs can certainly be good for the game, but it seems like you're presenting this argument as if Klei only squashes them, which is clearly not the case

they're almost entirely unrelated, that's like saying that making a boss killable's an adaptation of a 1 shot glitch

13 hours ago, Evelo said:

It changes the feeling from Hunter to Hunted. I want to feel Hunted like you do with Deerclops, and Antlion, Bearger, Hound Waves, Worm Waves

no offence but that just sounds like some sort of weird kink

13 hours ago, Evelo said:

Yea you can enable rifts on day 1. But that is just that. Day 1. There is no progression just jump into the meat of it

you can change rift setting through world settings menu even after creating the world for enabling a rift on a specific day with out giving wagstaff a crown shard, using console or enabling a mod

[Bumber64]

5 hours ago, Mr Giggio said:

Fixing bugs ain't punishing creativity.

It's rewarding it by forcing people to innovate rather than rely on the easy exploit everyone's known about for years.

[Mr Giggio]

5 hours ago, grm9 said:

ure plant fix was literally 6 lines of code, they also explicitly said that they only removed it because of it working on junk yard werepig, 1 of the new bosses that were made for punishing you for attempting to kill them through any way except brainlessly simply fighting with a weapon and optionally armor

I thought u didnt want to relate to me anymore. Like, the way u made sure to let me know when said it.

[grm9]

50 minutes ago, Bumber64 said:

It's rewarding it by forcing people to innovate rather than rely on the easy exploit everyone's known about for years

unless you're talking about making people figure out more cheeses that doesn't make sense because people were figuring cheeseless strats out even back when cheese existed

[W0l0l0]

8 hours ago, grm9 said:

that's an issue with people not wanting to get fun out of playing the game because of doing that requiring effort

This is a nonsensical argument because you're attributing an unfair set of choices to the players making the choices. Players are generally going to follow the path of least resistance, and a game that punishes players for taking a more skillful road isn't the players fault for not taking that road.

I can tell people all day to try to fight Enraged Dragonfly like I do, but I'd be just telling them to do something harder for no reward.

8 hours ago, grm9 said:

they're almost entirely unrelated, that's like saying that making a boss killable's an adaptation of a 1 shot glitch

As I said in my reply, it sounds like the argument was originally presented with the narrative that Klei only squashes bugs, when that isn't the case. I can agree that some bugs can absolutely open up interesting ideas and strategies, and wanted to show an example of it in Don't Starve.

[grm9]

8 hours ago, W0l0l0 said:

This is a nonsensical argument because you're attributing an unfair set of choices to the players making the choices. Players are generally going to follow the path of least resistance, and a game that punishes players for taking a more skillful road isn't the players fault for not taking that road

killing dfly with no walls's literally faster in comparison to with them so where's the punishment and shouldn't people prioritize getting fun out of playing the game instead of using a boring strat for some reason?

8 hours ago, W0l0l0 said:

I can tell people all day to try to fight Enraged Dragonfly like I do, but I'd be just telling them to do something harder for no reward

doing dfly no walls rewards you through making the fight and preparation time shorter, cancelling enraged's fully intended i think so it's not like they'll patch that

8 hours ago, W0l0l0 said:

As I said in my reply, it sounds like the argument was originally presented with the narrative that Klei only squashes bugs, when that isn't the case. I can agree that some bugs can absolutely open up interesting ideas and strategies, and wanted to show an example of it in Don't Starve

did you read my message at all? i said that your comparison was nonsensical because the consequences of performing pillar cheese and making reworked AG get rammed into a pillar're almost entirely unrelated excluding both potentially allowing you to hit a boss for some time

[W0l0l0]

11 hours ago, grm9 said:

killing dfly with no walls's literally faster in comparison to with them so where's the punishment and shouldn't people prioritize getting fun out of playing the game instead of using a boring strat for some reason?

I don't think our opinions differ all that much with regards to the walling. Aside for the conditions where the map generation makes it extremely cheap to wall them off, I think its a decent risk/cost balance.

But I don't believe players always prioritise fun. As stated previously, I believe players follow the path of least resistance. Thats why cheeses are used to begin with. Dragonfly is so much more interesting with enraged form, and yet hardly anyone plays against it. The game must sometimes force us to deal with things that we might not like at first.

11 hours ago, grm9 said:

doing dfly no walls rewards you through making the fight and preparation time shorter, cancelling enraged's fully intended i think so it's not like they'll patch that

Agreed. Although personally I think allowing the enraged form to be bypassed was a mistake.

One thing to note is Klei did add sleep resistance to the Crab King mobs which kinda implies they may not be happy with its strength.

11 hours ago, grm9 said:

did you read my message at all? i said that your comparison was nonsensical because the consequences of performing pillar cheese and making reworked AG get rammed into a pillar're almost entirely unrelated excluding both potentially allowing you to hit a boss for some time

I did read it, but I'm struggling to understand what you mean and what your actual point is. Can you elaborate and be a little less passively aggressive please.

[Mysterious box]

On 10/10/2024 at 6:36 PM, HellHeater said:

I wonder what these megabase haters do when they go outside and see megabase.

Call the police that's illegal where I live!

Spoiler

This is a joke btw I just thought this was funny