I want to share some ideas for my main characters [Wortox/Maxwell] skill trees

[Mr Giggio]

So I was bored in the bus and put on paper the ideas I feel like these two needs the most 
First my first, Wortox
I always find this character super fun but it lacks a lil bit of damage to match up the other ones. He has an rogue style more than a healer IMO and skill tree can also bring this up and add a lot for him:

<<<<<<<<<<<< .: Wortox :. >>>>>>>>>>

> Soul Path
Greed I - 1 extra soul
Greed II - 1 extra soul
Greed III - 2 extra souls
Greed IV - 2 extra souls
Greed V - 4 extra souls

> Life Path
Essence Vision - Wortox can see allies Hp

Soul Transfusion I - Wortox can heal eye of mask
Soul Transfusion II - Wortox can heal shield of terror 
Soul Transfusion III - Wortox can heal chester and tamed beefalo

> Sneak Path
Backstab  I -  The next hit dealt in the enemies back after soul hoping has a 50% damage bonus
Backstab II - The next hit dealt in the enemies back after soul hoping has a 100% damage bonus
Backstab III - The next hit dealt in the enemies back after soul hoping has a 150% damage bonus

> Krampus path:
Stealing from the stealer I - 2% extra chance of a Krampus sack after Killin Krampus
Stealing from the stealer II - 3% extra chance of a Krampus sack after Killin Krampus
Stealing from the stealer III - 5% extra chance of a Krampus sack after Killin Krampus

_________ Lunar alignment_________
I - Wortox can absorb souls from ghestalts using bug nets 
II - Wortox can absorb souls from ghestalts using torches 
III - Wortox can absorb souls from ghestalts using bare hands

___________Shadow alignment___________

Wortox now understands the nature of shadow creatures lost in the darkness and can absorb souls from them.

 

 

<<<<<<<<<<< .: Maxwell :. >>>>>>>>>

> Puppetmaster path:

A best caster I: Maxwell has a new icon in the middle of the spell wheel that can reagroup all the current spawned shadows by one click in a scout mode to aggro and reposition mobs withouth them interrupting similar to what /dance emote does
A best caster II: Maxwell can make the shadow servants dismiss clicking with right button of the mouse in the same icon that left click spawns them to a faster and effective despawn 
A best caster III: Maxwell can despawn shadow duelists using right click in the same icon left click spawns them

____________ Shadow alignment ____________

Pure power I:  codex umbra if refueled with pure horror the duelists can ignore planar defense darkness for 30 seconds. He can now prison and sneak infused shadelings.
Pure power II: it lasts 1 min
Pure power III: It lasts 1 min 30 s
Pure power IV: It lasts 2 mins
Pure power V: It lasts 3 min

____________Shadow alignment II__________

All of the bonus damage that Maxwell offers to the duelists from what's he's wearing is planar darkness instead of regular damage

And that's my thoughts it can improve a lot both of the characters and make the playstyle unicque. 

Edited October 25 by Mr Giggio

[Brago-sama]

42 minutes ago, Mr Giggio said:

Life Path
Essence Vision - Wortox can see allies Hp

Yes please, inject it into my veins

I also quite like Wortoxs sneak path. A powerup but earned via a new playstyle. Keeps things fresh. I can already feel the Dopamine rush you'd get after chaining 5+ backstabs no hit

Edited October 23 by Brago-sama

[skile]

I really like the idea of Wortox's backstab skill, though not a fan of terror shield and eye mask healing, especially as seperate skills(I don't have anything against the idea itself, but a whole skill dedicated to a single boss item is weird design imo). Also not the fan of Krampus sack skills for mostly the same reason. Would love to be able to heal beefs though, especially if I could do it while mounted, and being able to see people's hp would be nice. 

Personally, I would like to see a skill that would let Wortox overheal people for, idk, 125% of their max hp. 

[Mr Giggio]

5 minutes ago, skile said:

though not a fan of terror shield and eye mask healing

I get that, my point of view was 1 - those things are alive and 2 - Wortox himself was there in terraria world to bring these for constant, what should be the reasoning? This thing brings lore cuz it fits wortox more then the others, u know

 

Also I love when we got specific weapons for a character and make it shine, alarming clock for Wanda, codex for Maxwell, shield of terror having this type of interaction would make it the wortox weapon and it kinda fits the demonish style, I dunno

Edited October 23 by Mr Giggio

[Delta ONe]

Nice ideia:

''A best caster III: Maxwell can despawn shadow duelists using right click in the same icon left click spawns them''

[HowlVoid]

Gaining multiple souls from one source sounds like it would simply cause more overflow (on top of being too strong and most likely not something Klei would do/things don't have multiple souls). I suggest instead to increase the quality of the individual souls gained (higher stats gained).

I know bosses give multiple souls, but it really should give one giant soul with higher stats. Klei is inconsistent with this, but I think it's because they were too lazy to take it further (Wx-78 gives no souls, and Webber has two).

Soul stabber sounds too powerful, it would place him way higher than Wigfrid. Given his support role I think it would be great if he could revive allies at the cost of all his souls.

For the krampus tree, I'd rather recommend something that allows wortox to summon krampi like the hostile flare does (made with souls). An allure of innocence using his souls as part of the craft. The issue with anyone who isn't Wicker is that obtaining enough naughty points is more annoying than it's worth.

[Valase]

1 hour ago, HowlVoid said:

Gaining multiple souls from one source sounds like it would simply cause more overflow (on top of being too strong and most likely not something Klei would do/things don't have multiple souls). I suggest instead to increase the quality of the individual souls gained (higher stats gained).

I think that he meant the maximum amount (20-> 21/21/22/22/24)

1 hour ago, HowlVoid said:

Soul stabber sounds too powerful, it would place him way higher than Wigfrid. Given his support role I think it would be great if he could revive allies at the cost of all his souls.

I don't think that it would be as op as it sounds, because he takes time Teleporting and each teleport means one less soul to heal or one more critter to carry. On some fights it would be a straight buff(dfly), on others a sidegrade or even a "nerf" because the player would spend too much time teleporting when he does not need.

On 10/23/2023 at 12:22 PM, Mr Giggio said:

Also I love when we got specific weapons for a character and make it shine, alarming clock for Wanda, codex for Maxwell, shield of terror having this type of interaction would make it the wortox weapon and it kinda fits the demonish style, I dunno

I always thought that the reaper had a very wortox vibe. Especially when the body armor has those chains(like Klaus).

On 10/23/2023 at 10:41 AM, Mr Giggio said:

____________ Shadow alignment ____________

Pure power I:  codex umbra if refueled with pure horror the duelists can ignore planar defense darkness for 30 seconds. He can now prison and sneak infused shadelings.

I think that the shadelings should get targetable by more things, as Wormwood Lunar guardian 2 vines also can't target them (I'm quite sad that the moon boy can't wormwood them to death).

On 10/23/2023 at 10:41 AM, Mr Giggio said:

<<<<<<<<<<< .: Maxwell :. >>>>>>>>>

Regarding his maybe-soon-to-exist two shadow sides, I'll give my shot at them:

Shadow side (Survivors):

"Maxwell betrays Charlie and get extra powers"

Tier 1:

• Maxwell can now upgrade his codex at a shadow plinth usingh dark tatters+pure horror +codex and a random item that refers to his early years (maybe a rabbit);
• And as a main feature, when he casts a spell and would take damage, the damage is blocked (~2 minutes cool down).

Tier 2:

• enemies affected by his spells take 10% extra damage.

Tier 3:

• the new codex will give a (small) planar upgrade for his fighters and a chance to spawn an additional workers(not fighters).

Shadow side (Charlie):

"Maxwell moves his king. Charlie moves her pawn.":

Tier 1:

• Shadow hands cannot attack things near Maxwell.

Tier 2:

• While Maxwell is using the shadow reaper, he can use the reap action to mark enemies and make all of his puppets use their leap attack on said target.
• Or
• Every X seconds Maxwell next attack with a umbralla will be ranged and mark enemies to make all of his puppets use their leap attack on said target.

Tier 3:

• Void cowl bonus damage will also apply to Maxwell fighters at a reduced strength.

 

Edited November 12 by Valase
Some things that I forgot to add.

[Dr.Webber]

I think every time wortox hits an enemy with his bare hands there should be a certain percent that his curse activates and it’s an Insta kill

i think when Maxwell refuels the codex with pure horror the next certain number of Spells are infused and looks slightly different do to being infused you know either the red adding more detail to the design 

shadow sneak:  bigger range 

Shadow prison: last longer 

Shadow servants: more health and range

shadow duelist: more health and attack strength 

[grm9]

5 minutes ago, Dr.Webber said:

Shadow servants: more health

they only have 1 hp atm and always try to avoid danger, i doubt that more hp will be useful, could add increased efficiency to their tools instead or allow them to use shadow reaper and pick/axe 

[Dr.Webber]

9 hours ago, grm9 said:

they only have 1 hp atm and always try to avoid danger, i doubt that more hp will be useful, could add increased efficiency to their tools instead or allow them to use shadow reaper and pick/axe 

Maybe but don’t you think It’s annoying  when something doesn’t inevitably attacks and there insta killed

[Mr Giggio]

On 11/11/2023 at 10:33 PM, HowlVoid said:

Soul stabber sounds too powerfu

"sounding" is one thing, 4k hours playin wortox says otherwise

it doesnt go like that and if u give a chance to try u will not be surprised by big numbers. I would recomend it otherwise is the Walter dilema perk not stronger than a spear with regular kite. No one needs that if the goal is make the character more enjoyfull.

 

On 11/12/2023 at 12:22 AM, Valase said:

don't think that it would be as op as it sounds, because he takes time Teleporting and each teleport means one less soul to heal or one more critter to carry. On some fights it would be a straight buff(dfly), on others a sidegrade or even a "nerf" because the player would spend too much time teleporting when he does not need.

accurate. that barely touches wigfrid level of damage.

 

Edited November 15 by Mr Giggio

[HowlVoid]

1 hour ago, Mr Giggio said:

"sounding" is one thing, 4k hours playin wortox says otherwise

4k hours don't mean much when discussing a feature that doesn't exist.

You can't know how strong a 150% DMG increase is anymore than I do because it's currently not in the game, but we can make a accurate assessment based on how that 150% is distributed over time.

On 11/11/2023 at 8:22 PM, Valase said:

I think that he meant the maximum amount (20-> 21/21/22/22/24)

I don't think so, otherwise he would of corrected me on it.

On 11/11/2023 at 8:22 PM, Valase said:

I don't think that it would be as op as it sounds, because he takes time Teleporting and each teleport means one less soul to heal or one more critter to carry. On some fights it would be a straight buff(dfly), on others a sidegrade or even a "nerf" because the player would spend too much time teleporting when he does not need.

 

1 hour ago, Mr Giggio said:

it doesnt go like that and if u give a chance to try u will not be surprised by big numbers. I would recomend it otherwise is the Walter dilema perk not stronger than a spear with regular kite. No one needs that if the goal is make the character more enjoyfull.

Except it has already been proven that teleporting is a slight dmg increase over kiting. Its not a disadvantage.

I don't believe the dragonfly statement is accurate either. 

Assuming 6 hits on df with the first being 150% dmg increase, that would be a 25% dmg increase over 6 attacks (150/6=25). Not accounting for slightly higher dmg increase due to higher kite speed (but I think we can dismiss it because it negligible). 

On fewer hits, with bosses with smaller windows of opportunity the damage goes up, not down. 

1 hour ago, Mr Giggio said:

accurate. that barely touches wigfrid level of damage.

 

Take this video for reference how fast teleporting to dodge is. Again, it's not a disadvantage.

Perhaps if it was a flat dmg increase it would be a little more balanced. 

I'm not against Wortox getting a dmg increase because every character is getting them. But none fighter characters should be restricted to flat dmg increases like how Woodie and wormwood got (saladmanders/husk/third moose hit).

Edit: carrying souls isn't difficult either, bees can be farmed from base and stack to 20. 

I also won't consider sacrificing healing for damage a disadvantage or bad deal either. It's a tradeoff. 

Edited November 15 by HowlVoid

[Mr Giggio]

8 hours ago, HowlVoid said:

4 k hours don't mean much when discussing a feature that doesn't exist.

It does. Cuz It means I'm on touch with soul hop time to realize the actions and the nuances that u deciding to let go in order to do it while u watching situational videos 

almost nothing worths kitting in soul hop instead of regular dodge. Rare cases. Maybe just deerclops (one extra hit) and u gaining nothing from it once now its even easier to dodge and u have the same results. Deerclops is a weak boss anyway, shouldn't never be using as parameter in the first place, sounds like nitpicking. In general u don't kite hoping cuz u will lose a hit and u spending souls for no reward. So yes it does make difference more than ur theoric point of view, also.

Edited November 15 by Mr Giggio

[arubaro]

8 hours ago, HowlVoid said:

Except it has already been proven that teleporting is a slight dmg increase over kiting. Its not a disadvantage.

wasting all your souls for just hitting 20 times a little faster is a waste in most scenarios 

[Gearless]

On 10/23/2023 at 3:41 PM, Mr Giggio said:

<<<<<<<<<<<< .: Wortox :. >>>>>>>>>>

> Soul Path
Greed I - 1 extra soul
Greed II - 1 extra soul
Greed III - 2 extra souls
Greed IV - 2 extra souls
Greed V - 4 extra souls

I like this idea! It may not be the brightest or the most original but it is practical.

However the skill tree has a specific cap limit on how many skills insight you can use and get. Specifically 15 available : You shouldn't be spending 5 of them only for 5 extra souls.

On 10/23/2023 at 3:41 PM, Mr Giggio said:

> Life Path
Essence Vision - Wortox can see allies Hp

Wortox seeing allie's hp? Sure! What it could see EVERYTHING's hp? So that vanilla also have their vanilla version of health bar.

On 10/23/2023 at 3:41 PM, Mr Giggio said:

 

Soul Transfusion I - Wortox can heal eye of mask
Soul Transfusion II - Wortox can heal shield of terror 
Soul Transfusion III - Wortox can heal chester and tamed beefalo

That is way too specific and I don't think it will be very useful nor change the playstyle of Wortox.

On 10/23/2023 at 3:41 PM, Mr Giggio said:

> Sneak Path
Backstab  I -  The next hit dealt in the enemies back after soul hoping has a 50% damage bonus
Backstab II - The next hit dealt in the enemies back after soul hoping has a 100% damage bonus
Backstab III - The next hit dealt in the enemies back after soul hoping has a 150% damage bonus

A technical limitation is that only a few mobs are coded to have a "back". Most of the mobs have a sort of aimbot that lock where the player is and looks automatically at the right direction. 

 

On 10/23/2023 at 3:41 PM, Mr Giggio said:

> Krampus path:
Stealing from the stealer I - 2% extra chance of a Krampus sack after Killin Krampus
Stealing from the stealer II - 3% extra chance of a Krampus sack after Killin Krampus
Stealing from the stealer III - 5% extra chance of a Krampus sack after Killin Krampus

Idk, again, that's way too specific and 3 skill points used for 5 extra percentage isn't the best thing. What about a single Skill that just increase by 10% Krampus sack drop rate.

 

On 10/23/2023 at 3:41 PM, Mr Giggio said:

___________Shadow alignment___________

Wortox now understands the nature of shadow creatures lost in the darkness and can absorb souls from them.

Oh that would be lovely.

[Mr Giggio]

38 minutes ago, Gearless said:

However the skill tree has a specific cap limit on how many skills insight you can use and get. Specifically 15 available

ye buddy but the thing is Klei always does that intentionally right? Like more skills than points to spend cuz that encourages us to have different paths from other players and more souls means that it eases the game for begginers so it might be a good thing to have around for those players :3

38 minutes ago, Gearless said:

What it could see EVERYTHING's hp?

that falls in the same problem for me that epic health bar has that is poluting so much the screen in situations u dealing with multiple enemies

like spider crowd, hound waves, shadow swarm or splumonkeys.... its just too much x_x

38 minutes ago, Gearless said:

nor change the playstyle of Wortox

oh cmon u guys the amount of shield of terror yall broke till this day that could easily have a solution and u refuse to see .-.

Edited November 15 by Mr Giggio

[Gearless]

2 minutes ago, Mr Giggio said:

ye buddy but the thing is Klei always doest that intentionally right? Like more skills than points to spend cuz that encourages us to have different paths from other players and more souls means that it eases the game for begginers so it might be a good thing to have around for those players :3

No, I simply meant that it took too many spots that could be used for other skills, so split it to 3 and not 5 or something

[HowlVoid]

4 hours ago, arubaro said:

wasting all your souls for just hitting 20 times a little faster is a waste in most scenarios 

That's not the point I was making, I specifically mentioned that it was a negligible increase.

My point is that it's not a disadvantage to teleport to dodge, it's not slower. 

It's when combined with the 150% dmg increase that the 150% increase is very strong.

4 hours ago, Mr Giggio said:

It does. Cuz It means I'm on touch with soul hop time to realize the actions and the nuances that u deciding to let go in order to do it while u watching situational videos 

I'm not understanding what's situational about it... All fights in DST play out that way. With attacks followed by a window of opportunity. 

 

4 hours ago, Mr Giggio said:

almost nothing worths kitting in soul hop instead of regular dodge. Rare cases. Maybe just deerclops (one extra hit) and u gaining nothing from it once now its even easier to dodge and u have the same results. Deerclops is a weak boss anyway, shouldn't never be using as parameter in the first place, sounds like nitpicking. In general u don't kite hoping cuz u will lose a hit and u spending souls for no reward. So yes it does make difference more than ur theoric point of view, also.

It's not just about the soul hoping, its that plus a 150% bonus to damage.

And deerclops is only meant to provide a reference for dodging with soul hoping. This wasn't about killing anything with soul hoping alone, it's when it's used in tandem with the 150% boost. 

It was pointed out that soul hoping was slower, the video was only meant to point out that that isn't true. 

Edit: 

With bosses with only a 3 attack window the damage is higher than wigs for example (using dark sword)

170+68+68=306

85x3= 255

At 6 hits it balances out which I still think it's too strong if it matches wig's dmg output. Wortox isn't a damage character.

Edited November 15 by HowlVoid

[arubaro]

4 hours ago, HowlVoid said:

That's not the point I was making, I specifically mentioned that it was a negligible increase.

My point is that it's not a disadvantage to teleport to dodge, it's not slower. 

It's when combined with the 150% dmg increase that the 150% increase is very strong.

1st it doesnt need to be 150% if it trully is an op damage, it can be less or even flat damage

2nd you are sacrifice potential healing and hunger. Sure you can do the chore of wasting time to catch bees so now you have 1 less inventory slot to have more souls

3rd idk how possible it would be but these kind of skills are a bonus for hitting from behind which has more chances of failure than simply teleporting 0.5cm near your current position to keep pressing F. You might fail and dont be behind, you might teleport too far so you wasted dps or simply you scrub it for paying more attention to the position than the timing

btw wigfrid doesnt need anything to have her dps

[HowlVoid]

6 minutes ago, arubaro said:

1st it doesnt need to be 150% if it trully is an op damage, it can be less or even flat damage

That's what I said, lol

I 100% agree 

6 minutes ago, arubaro said:

2nd you are sacrifice potential healing and hunger. Sure you can do the chore of wasting time to catch bees so now you have 1 less inventory slot to have more souls

Yeah, I think it's a trade off, so I don't see this as bad but rather good balance. 

I'm not against him getting a dmg skill, I said this from the beginning. I mean he most likely will get one, every other character has.

Since he's a support character I think it would be cool if he could transform the souls into souls of wrath, and dropping them splits a dmg increase amongst all players. But maybe you can only hold one type of soul, and these souls heal less than the regular souls. 

6 minutes ago, arubaro said:

3rd idk how possible it would be but these kind of skills are a bonus for hitting from behind which has more chances of failure than simply teleporting 0.5cm near your current position to keep pressing F. You might fail and dont be behind, you might teleport too far so you wasted dps or simply you scrub it for paying more attention to the position than the timing

btw wigfrid doesnt need anything to have her dps

Honestly I forgot about the behind the monster part, my bad. I think that should be removed. There isn't a positional necessity for other DMG increases and I don't think it fits given the 2d models and how weirdly the model moves when you shift perspective.

So yeah, just lower the dmg and remove the condition.

Edited November 15 by HowlVoid

[Gashzer]

23 hours ago, arubaro said:

wasting all your souls for just hitting 20 times a little faster is a waste in most scenarios 

Nah i disagree. Soul hop kiting is alot easier to pull off over regular kiting and it saves armour over just tanking hits and using the same souls to heal.

I actually like soul hopping so much in combat, if im playing solo wortox i will make healing salves and save them for bosses like bee queen so i can soul hop more during the fight.

[Mr Giggio]

1 hour ago, Gashzer said:

Soul hop kiting is alot easier to pull off over regular kiting

That's false but I'm not arguing with you

[Gashzer]

46 minutes ago, Mr Giggio said:

That's false but I'm not arguing with you

Well regular kiting is different depending on what mob is attacking you and their attack delay.

Once you master soul hop kiting its the same for 99% of mobs. Just hop when u see a mob going to attack. 

That's true but I'm not arguing with you                                              

[grm9]

2 hours ago, Gashzer said:

Soul hop kiting saves armour over just tanking hits and using the same souls to heal

or you could walk away and do one less hit after kiting at worst and not spend any souls, probably wasting less time in comparison to killing one bee/butterfly/spider per one extra hit per dodged attack 

Edited November 16 by grm9

[Gashzer]

55 minutes ago, grm9 said:

or you could walk away and do one less hit after kiting at worst and not spend any souls, probably wasting less time in comparison to killing one bee/butterfly/spider per one extra hit per dodged attack 

Aye but soul hopping is easier than kiting, so less chance of getting hit in the first place. The glands dropped by spiders can be made into healing salves if you want to heal. 

Plus soul hopping allows you to kite wearing a marble suit for even more damage reduction incase you mess it up once or twice without sacrificing dps.

Soul hop kiting is awesome.

 

Edited November 16 by Gashzer