[Game Update] - 725134

[Ugur01]

There is an oversight regarding Shadow Affinity that hasn't been discussed yet. When an Atrium or Possessed Atrium is inserted into the chassis, loot is generated in a manner similar to Boulderboughs. However, teleporting to these locations causes the branches on the chassis to break, resulting in the loss of the loot. If teleportation is utilized to reach these specific locations, the generated loot cannot be collected because the branches shatter upon arrival. The only current workaround is to travel on foot, which fundamentally negates the purpose of having a teleportation mechanic in the first place.

[Tired_Awaii]

1 hour ago, V2C said:

Fixed Auto-Grabber not using the increased range from circuits and Signal Booster when staying with a Backup Chassis.

This was a bug? I thought this was just how it worked, unfortunate as it was, considering that Rangebooster effecting Drones is locked behind Beta Tinkering I, and the Backup Chassis don't seem to really inherit skill effects besides like Warm Standby and Off By One. The change is appreciated either way. It would be neat to see warm standby make use of the Beta Tinkering effects though. Maybe even giving some more tangible effects to the beta circuits that currently don't get use out of Warm Standby like the Acceleration, Electrification, and Optoelectronic circuits, but it's understandable if that doesn't happen.

[Schneid_101]

These are some good changes for the drones. It's still not as powerful as the previous iteration of the skill though, since you don't have to target the enemy to vex them. My proposal is to add a small planar damage buff to the possesed atrium drones, even as small as 2.5 planar would suffice.

[Baark0]

1 hour ago, V2C said:

• Auto-Grabbers will continue to do work for a Backup Chassis off-screen.

 

I really hope this works with spatializer circuit slots, as being able to have backup drones clean up something like a grass gekko or grass tor pen without having to collect the grass/twigs manually sounds really nice.

Glad to see exploiter drones no longer breaking, and the damage buffs seem solid. 18% dmg with a regular heart is pretty good, though 24% with a infused heart is kinda meh since it completely lacks planar damage buffs. If it gave planar damage/increased max drone count to 5/increased how much damage your drones gave you I imagine it'd be a lot better.

I'll give give them a test run later today when I get around to fighting toadstool, the mutated bosses, and maybe warbot and I'll see how good the range increases are. I wonder if it'd be worth giving them increased priority to boss monsters, as in during fights like bee queen, fuelweaver, and the twins, they'll deaggro the boss very frequently when you go to clean up the minions. This is especially prevalent when using any spin-cycle based item.

Backup chassis not being targeted by space is also a really nice QoL change. It usually wasn't devastating when it did happen, however it was a little inconvenient trying to pick up an item and accidentally swapping bodies instead.

[Cosmic_Eternus]

I just saw this post after I had made a post addressing my thoughts. While it does seem better (Drones not dying for one), I still prefer the original shadow affinity since having to insert something before you can craft the Drones feels like extra redundant steps.

If you do keep the current way the affinity functions, I would suggest making the Drones spawn immediately upon inserting Nightmare Fuel, Pure Horror, or either Atrium.

[NotGabriel]

22 minutes ago, Cosmic_Eternus said:

I just saw this post after I had made a post addressing my thoughts. While it does seem better (Drones not dying for one), I still prefer the original shadow affinity since having to insert something before you can craft the Drones feels like extra redundant steps.

If you do keep the current way the affinity functions, I would suggest making the Drones spawn immediately upon inserting Nightmare Fuel, Pure Horror, or either Atrium.

I’m still not a fan of the redundancy either, I think it would be way cooler if the drones manifested as soon as you insert the part. It would also make hot swapping more practical! Plus there’s room for cool animations beyond “craft and place”

[Swish3rTwist3r]

I feel very strongly that the original vex implementation was far more fun to interact with, particularly in offering a simple solution for moderate power gains over the much more complicated lunar alignment that can potentially offer more. I dislike that we are making more drones instead of empowering ourselves as almost all iterations of WXs more potent skills are now relegated to some form of minion gameplay and/or feel, and I really don't care for minions and never have. I appreciate your work, am overall relatively pleased with the WX skill tree, and don't want to be overly negative, but with no option for non-minion play it is not an understatement that I this is really going to put a damper on the enjoyment of my favorite character and as someone who has spent a great deal of time both in this game and with this character that does sting. I hope you reconsider these changes and allow for a shadow alignment skill that does not need things following you around, exactly like or in the vein of what previously existed in the 1.0 version of this skill.

Edited yesterday at 01:56 AM by Swish3rTwist3r

[Ugur01]

I’m removing the image of the poll results I shared earlier. I think it doesn't provide enough feedback on its own. Maybe we should start a new poll that examines each topic separately.

[NotGabriel]

6 minutes ago, Ugur01 said:

I’m removing the image of the poll results I shared earlier. I think it doesn't provide enough feedback on its own. Maybe we should start a new poll that examines each topic separately.

If I would’ve known my poll would start so much discourse I would’ve made it more thoughtfully 😭 

2 minutes ago, NotGabriel said:

If I would’ve known my poll would start so much discourse I would’ve made it more thoughtfully 😭 

I just removed the poll, if I don’t see a revised poll in a couple hours I’ll make it myself ✌️ 

[doritosdamafia]

2 minutes ago, NotGabriel said:

If I would’ve known my poll would start so much discourse I would’ve made it more thoughtfully 😭 

the consequences of your actions 😎

[LavenderLillie]

2 hours ago, -Nick- said:

Maybe could bring back the ability to use mimicked items if under the effects of eating fuel? 

Mimicked items still work with the possessed atrium, just not deconstruction staves or construction amulets.

[Popian]

1 hour ago, OrangeNibble said:

Why was the design changed? What is the rational / advantage / thought process behind the changes? Etc...

It's easy to extrapolate.

All other skilltrees have a kind of dichotomy:

• Wilson: survival vs. crafting
• Willow: fire vs. bear
• Wolfgang: work vs. damage
• Wendy: potions vs. Abigail
• Woodie: wereform vs. human
• Wigfrid: combat vs. support
• Winona: effectiveness vs. efficiency
• Wortox: support vs. combat
• Wormwood: support vs. combat
• Wurt: support vs. Merms
• Walter: Walter vs. Woby

For WX-78, there may be an attempt to shoehorn chassis vs. drones, while giving Rangebooster more utility. This is apparent with changing Field Survey II into the generic Signal Booster. If they want to go this direction there could be one for effectiveness locked behind taking x drone skills.

The original effects could also have been placeholders, even though there could have been more focus on stationary benefits compared to Lunar. (e.g automatically uses Sonic-Invoker when enemies that can be scared targeting a player/the owner get in range)

[OrangeNibble]

4 minutes ago, Popian said:

It's easy to extrapolate.

All other skilltrees have a kind of dichotomy:

• Wilson: survival vs. crafting
• Willow: fire vs. bear
• Wolfgang: work vs. damage
• Wendy: potions vs. Abigail
• Woodie: wereform vs. human
• Wigfrid: combat vs. support
• Winona: effectiveness vs. efficiency
• Wortox: support vs. combat
• Wormwood: support vs. combat
• Wurt: support vs. Merms
• Walter: Walter vs. Woby

For WX-78, there may be an attempt to shoehorn chassis vs. drones, while giving Rangebooster more utility. This is apparent with changing Field Survey II into the generic Signal Booster. If they want to go this direction there could be one for effectiveness locked behind taking x drone skills.

The original effects could also have been placeholders, even though there could have been more focus on stationary benefits compared to Lunar. (e.g automatically uses Sonic-Invoker when enemies that can be scared targeting a player/the owner get in range)

The original design had a great dichotomy! The lunar affinity makes you want to use your chassises as minions (rather than teleports), while the shadow affinity makes you want to use your chassises for passive farming (rather than teleports) alongside giving your active body some buffs. The original design was really elegant. Everything is pulling / conflicting on how you are using your chassis, and both lunar and shadow affinities achieved that conflict in different ways.

The drone things is way worse in my opinion.

Edited yesterday at 02:41 AM by OrangeNibble

[Tired_Awaii]

Just now, OrangeNibble said:

The original design had a great dichotomy! The lunar affinity makes you want to use your chassises as minions (rather than teleports), while the shadow affinity makes you want to use your chassises for passive farming (rather than teleports). The original design was really elegant.

I mean the ability to have passive farming with the shadow affinity is still there, that part of it wasn't really touched by the change to drones besides the speed and ability to break which was fixed this update.

[OrangeNibble]

7 minutes ago, Tired_Awaii said:

I mean the ability to have passive farming with the shadow affinity is still there, that part of it wasn't really touched by the change to drones besides the speed and ability to break which was fixed this update.

Yeah, I'm just saying the original had a really nice dichotomy already. I don't think it needed changing at all. It just maybe needed some better visuals and it would have been perfect. Anyway, I think I have made my preference clear. Most people seem to prefer the old affinity. We shall see what Klei cooks up! Maybe they will revert, maybe they won't revert and it will end up being better for it 😄

[Jussatoon]

Honestly, the shadow affinity bums me out further the more I think about how it was disturbed by theming complaints that were too divisive to make a drastic decision without at least informing the community about it. While I'm not super stingy on the overall theme (after all, I enjoy Willow even if I don't agree with the direction they went with to display her abilities), it's clear it negatively affected the shadow affinity's capabilities compared to its initial version. 

If Shadow Servitor's drone direction stays, but its power ends up being the same as its 1.0 counterpart, I'd call that a win, though realistically it should be more powerful. It wasn't as powerful as Lunar Vessel's full potential, but it was simple with minimal effort; now that there's more effort, it should provide more power.

If Shadow Servitor reverts back to 1.0 and received further tweaks, I'd call that a win.

If Shadow Servitor changed to my suggestion below, I'd call that a big win:

Otherwise, if none of the above happens, this is a loss in my book, which would be a shame since I prefer the shadow side in general. 

 

Edited yesterday at 03:12 AM by Jussatoon

[Terra_cat]

5 minutes ago, Jussatoon said:

Honestly, the shadow affinity bums me out further the more I think about how it was disturbed by theming complaints that were too decisive to make a drastic decision without at least informing the community about it. While I'm not super stingy on the overall theme (after all, I enjoy Willow even if I don't agree with the direction they went with to display her abilities), it's clear it negatively affected the shadow affinity's capabilities compared to its initial version. 

If Shadow Servitor's drone direction stays, but its power ends up being the same as its 1.0 counterpart, I'd call that a win, though realistically it should be more powerful. It wasn't as powerful as Lunar Vessel's full potential, but it was simple with minimal effort; now that there's more effort, it should provide more power.

If Shadow Servitor reverts back to 1.0 and received further tweaks, I'd call that a win.

If Shadow Servitor changed to my suggestion below, I'd call that a big win:

Otherwise, if none of the above happens, this is a loss in my book, which would be a shame since I prefer the shadow side in general. 

 

Yea i was really hopeful for the shadow affinity being like 1.0's but with some extra tweaks, but if this continues down the route its going im just gonna use lunar affinity or right to modify. We were so close to a great balance of easy to use/obtain VS hard to get but extremely high ceiling.

[Mysterious box]

3 hours ago, Danath said:

Yeah I would like that mechanic as well.  I feel like I would never consume nightmare fuel right now, but if this was implemented or some additional effect that would make the mechanic way better.

It could definitely use more ways to use it but I think the primary intention is an alternative way to get your charges back up and running when you revive via a backup chassis which to be fair would probably be more convenient than carrying materials for light but it does feel lacking as is.

 

3 hours ago, Coski25 said:

It just doesn’t fit thematically why does implanting a nightmare fuel or shadow atrium in Wx-78’s chassis allow him to craft drones when before it showed the shadows coming out of them.

It's been said but I just don't see it using shadow powered drones feels more fitting and neatly balances with the lunar side using the extra bodies instead. It just looks strange having one side just have Wx wielding magic while the other actually uses his robotics knowledge and what he learned from Wagstaff.

[Lord-King-Bear]

Really want when you in overcharge state the drones to do a little planar shadow micro missles or something that would be cool and keep it not too op 

[Jussatoon]

4 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

It could definitely use more ways to use it but I think the primary intention is an alternative way to get your charges back up and running when you revive via a backup chassis which to be fair would probably be more convenient than carrying materials for light but it does feel lacking as is.

 

It's been said but I just don't see it using shadow powered drones feels more fitting and neatly balances with the lunar side using the extra bodies instead. It just looks strange having one side just have Wx wielding magic while the other actually uses his robotics knowledge and what he learned from Wagstaff.

Since you're so keen on your viewpoint, have you seen the suggestion I made? It's unlikely to be implemented at this point, but I'm curious to see if you'd approve of it, so I can know the extent of what you consider robotic enough. 

[Mysterious box]

10 minutes ago, Jussatoon said:

Since you're so keen on your viewpoint, have you seen the suggestion I made? It's unlikely to be implemented at this point, but I'm curious to see if you'd approve of it, so I can know the extent of what you consider robotic enough. 

I'd actually mentioned that it could have similar functions way back when they made the change so pretty much yes however.

 

28 minutes ago, Jussatoon said:

If Shadow Servitor's drone direction stays, but its power ends up being the same as its 1.0 counterpart, I'd call that a win, though realistically it should be more powerful. It wasn't as powerful as Lunar Vessel's full potential, but it was simple with minimal effort; now that there's more effort, it should provide more power.

This however I can't really agree with I know the idea of making things more powerful is met by mass approval by most of the community but it being weaker than the lunar path is fair because the lunar path has a maintenance cost and a high one at that. Sure they could also give the shadow side a maintenance cost to balance it out I think it being more chill gives it a nice niche. It definitely needs improvements but it shouldn't become too much stronger than the 1.0 version.

Edited yesterday at 03:37 AM by Mysterious box

[hdfha123]

During the planar era, consuming a Possessed Shadow Atrium only granted a 24% increase in single-target physical damage. This is almost equivalent to nothing.
Recommendation: Drones can be retained, but please increase the area-of-effect damage of Shadow Atrium/Possessed Shadow Atrium. Additionally, as a item of planar era, Possessed Shadow Atrium should receive a planar damage bonus.
(Google Translate）

[Jussatoon]

4 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

This however I can't really agree with I know the idea of making things more powerful is met by mass approval by most of the community but it being weaker than the lunar path is fair because the lunar path has a maintenance cost and a high one at that. Sure they could also give the shadow side a maintenance cost to balance it out I think it being more chill gives it a nice niche. It definitely needs improvements but it shouldn't become too much stronger than the 1.0 version.

And of course you're thinking of the worst case scenario above all else. 

Obviously it wouldn't be "too much" stronger, as it's not lunar affinity levels of effort. However, for example, 24% more damage at the drones' max potential, assuming they behave properly, keeping in mind they falter when more than one mob is thrown in the mix, and needing to craft the drones again if wanting to unplug the atrium at any point? The affinity needs to do better than that.

[tHe_silent_H]

wonder if they ever do anything to make transport drones 2 worthwhile, skill has been unpicked(except for testing purposes) since the start of the beta

 

Maybe give it teleportation, like it the drones had at the start of the beta, would be a start at least

Edited yesterday at 04:06 AM by tHe_silent_H

[Kvetevk]

25 minutes ago, tHe_silent_H said:

wonder if they ever do anything to make transport drones 2 worthwhile, skill has been unpicked(except for testing purposes) since the start of the beta

 

Maybe give it teleportation, like it the drones had at the start of the beta, would be a start at least

The upgraded one only have 3 more slots, which can be ignored, because tier 1 you can craft more of them and they stack.

Maybe giving it recall option would make it better, because then you won't need to make more of them and be able to use the same one anytime.