Buff Pioneer's Panache to give planar defence to Pinecone hat

[Gashzer]

Walter's pinecone pioneer hat falls off hard in a post rift world because you have to choose between extra planar defence/head slots bonuses or reduced sanity loss of pinecone pioneer hat

But because you will take more planar damage when using pinecone hat the reduction of sanity is negated with this extra damage, making the pinecone hat outcompeted and a trap to use in a post-rift world.

Easy solution to this is to allow Pioneer's Panache to give a certain amount of only planar defence (for example a flat 8 defence). Brightshade helm gives flat 10 planar defence for reference.

This allows walter players to use body slot post-rift armours with his hat to control sanity loss in post-rift worlds.

[Cassielu]

I don't think it's appropriate, the Pinecone hat is not armor, it shouldn't have any kind of damage defense.

[Steorra]

Eh, wraith wreath need similar buff then I guess. I believe 10 planar defence is fair.

[kikia]

It sounds a bit odd.

[Jakepeng99]

Planar moment.

[Gashzer]

1 hour ago, Cassielu said:

I don't think it's appropriate, the Pinecone hat is not armor, it shouldn't have any kind of damage defense.

Its not armour but planar is a special mechanic which does mess with headgear balance and it needs addressed in someway, we see with wigfrids skilltree headgear being buffed with planar defence. 

Planar damage is more magical in origin not physical. A part of Walter "panache"ing his hat is to add material from the constant, some of that could be of lunar/shadow origin giving the magical planar defence while not providing physical defence.

This is my lore justification of adding planar defence to clothing. Think of it as adding magical inner lining.

50 minutes ago, Steorra said:

Eh, wraith wreath need similar buff then I guess. I believe 10 planar defence is fair.

If wendy's affinity potions are allowed to be used in the wraith wreath then planar defence should be added to the wraith wreath that way as a side buff. 

I dont think either Walter's hat or wendys wraith wreath should have a planar defence at the same level as brightshade helm/cowl. Somewhere between 5-8 flat planar defence is fair for them.

[SunnySunshine]

This makes no sense, Walter's hat is literally a hat, not a helmet :/

[Dyzrespect]

Yea his hat loses durability over time and does not have Armor "HP", so it cannot provide any kind of defense (without breaking the clothing/armor convention at least). I don't think there's a single thing they can do to make Walter's hat worth a skill point tbh.

[Gashzer]

8 hours ago, SunnySunshine said:

This makes no sense, Walter's hat is literally a hat, not a helmet :/

Planar damage is magical in nature. Shouldn't matter that it's a hat. I'm not asking for any normal damage reduction.

8 hours ago, Dyzrespect said:

Yea his hat loses durability over time and does not have Armor "HP", so it cannot provide any kind of defense (without breaking the clothing/armor convention at least). I don't think there's a single thing they can do to make Walter's hat worth a skill point tbh.

Let's break the clothing/armour convention. Walter and his hat are already in a unique balancing situation. His hat is sanity armour, but it doesn't work well with planar damage because you normally have to double up both headslot/bodyslot with post rift armours to negate planar damage to the max amount.

This also means a late game walter is going to take maximum sanity damage or needs to sacrifice planar defence to reduce sanity damage while wearing his hat but by doing so he is also taking more health damage which means he takes more sanity damage. It's not very well thought out.

[WilsonHiggs]

Makes no sense. First it isnt a helmet and second, the mechanic is arround sacrificing other head slot items to have a reduction on the sanity lost (which was buffed by a skill point). The hat having these kind of perks breaks the point

[Arcwell]

@Gashzer Do you think it would be better or worse if it negated the sanity loss from planar damage instead of giving planar defense? (Only to the planar portion of the damage. Physical would still go through and cause sanity loss).

[Gashzer]

10 minutes ago, Arcwell said:

@Gashzer Do you think it would be better or worse if it negated the sanity loss from planar damage instead of giving planar defense? (Only to the planar portion of the damage. Physical would still go through and cause sanity loss).

Yeah that works too. Walter players shouldn't be punished for wearing their hat at any point in the game.

18 minutes ago, WilsonHiggs said:

Makes no sense. First it isnt a helmet and second, the mechanic is arround sacrificing other head slot items to have a reduction on the sanity lost (which was buffed by a skill point). The hat having these kind of perks breaks the point

Planar damage requires you to double up on armour to negate fully. If you wear pinecone hat you lose protection and hence take more sanity damage anyway. Making pinecone panache and the pinecone hat in general not very useful in a post-rift world.

Planar is magical damage so giving clothing some magical panache would give it magical protection even if it has no physical protection.

It isn't a helmet is a pretty poor arguement against magic damage. Football helmet is a helmet that has no planar defence. Planar defence doesn't always have to equate to the stereotypical "armour". There is thematic room to give certain clothing Planar defence if klei wants to.

[WilsonHiggs]

5 hours ago, Gashzer said:

Yeah that works too. Walter players shouldn't be punished for wearing their hat at any point in the game.

Planar damage requires you to double up on armour to negate fully. If you wear pinecone hat you lose protection and hence take more sanity damage anyway. Making pinecone panache and the pinecone hat in general not very useful in a post-rift world.

Planar is magical damage so giving clothing some magical panache would give it magical protection even if it has no physical protection.

It isn't a helmet is a pretty poor arguement against magic damage. Football helmet is a helmet that has no planar defence. Planar defence doesn't always have to equate to the stereotypical "armour". There is thematic room to give certain clothing Planar defence if klei wants to.

If you want to wear the hat to reduce the sanity lose then pick the skill tree perk dedicated to buff the sanity lose protection. If no, deal with his unique downside 

[Debruh]

12 minutes ago, WilsonHiggs said:

If you want to wear the hat to reduce the sanity lose then pick the skill tree perk dedicated to buff the sanity lose protection. If no, deal with his unique downside 

That's not what op is saying (I think)

They're saying that late game, due to planar damage. It's better to wear head armor due to its planar defense rather than Walter's hat.

As opposed to pre rifts, where you can use body armor and the hat.

[Chewabacca]

6 hours ago, Gashzer said:

Yeah that works too. Walter players shouldn't be punished for wearing their hat at any point in the game.

Planar damage requires you to double up on armour to negate fully. If you wear pinecone hat you lose protection and hence take more sanity damage anyway. Making pinecone panache and the pinecone hat in general not very useful in a post-rift world.

Planar is magical damage so giving clothing some magical panache would give it magical protection even if it has no physical protection.

It isn't a helmet is a pretty poor arguement against magic damage. Football helmet is a helmet that has no planar defence. Planar defence doesn't always have to equate to the stereotypical "armour". There is thematic room to give certain clothing Planar defence if klei wants to.

In that case maybe the skill could let the hat's sanity reduction loss be upgraded with rift materials without giving it any armor.

[Mysterious box]

2 hours ago, WilsonHiggs said:

If you want to wear the hat to reduce the sanity lose then pick the skill tree perk dedicated to buff the sanity lose protection. If no, deal with his unique downside 

I feel like your missing the problem since the hat doesn't provide planar protection you actually lose more sanity wearing the hat than not wearing the hat completely bypassing the entire point of the perk post rift.

[Steorra]

8 hours ago, Arcwell said:

@Gashzer Do you think it would be better or worse if it negated the sanity loss from planar damage instead of giving planar defense? (Only to the planar portion of the damage. Physical would still go through and cause sanity loss).

Great idea. But it should being a skill which allows you to upgrade the hat, but not a base kit buffing. Since the original hat have no clue to show it have potential planar protection.

[WilsonHiggs]

3 hours ago, Debruh said:

That's not what op is saying (I think)

They're saying that late game, due to planar damage. It's better to wear head armor due to its planar defense rather than Walter's hat.

As opposed to pre rifts, where you can use body armor and the hat.

 

1 hour ago, Mysterious box said:

I feel like your missing the problem since the hat doesn't provide planar protection you actually lose more sanity wearing the hat than not wearing the hat completely bypassing the entire point of the perk post rift.

I didnt considered the math. Then the hat should protect the sanity from losing health by a planar source instead of asking for giving it planar defense