wendy Wendy Long Playtesting + Feedback (12-12 Build)

[Giovirtual79]

10 minutes ago, Dingle said:

Did not get to play much this week. I did start a second playthrough, and get to about Day 13.

Things are going a little slow with it, but I think I'm going to shoot for Ancient Fuelweaver. Maybe I'll even play a little bit longer than that.

PLAYTHROUGH 2 - PART 1

First off, the build:

I don't know about Picnic Casket, and I get bundling wraps after killing Bee Queen as the first boss. But, I figured I'd try to keep it, for convenience.

Sisturn 3 again, because it's the most powerful thing she has. However, this time I'm not going to rush it. I just want to get Lune Blossoms before Nightmare Werepig.

I'm also trying out the Attack Here command, unlike last playthrough.

The Run

Spider Quarry on Day 1. Good sign. I also find two Knight heads right next to each other. The spider quarry lets me get a bunch of glands right away. Last game, I had trouble finding spiders.

First Sinkhole I open leads right to the blue mushroom forest. This later ends up being close to my base.

Base set up on day 5. I don't find a very good spot, so I just put it near the Postern, which ended up being very central. Wormholes and general layout in this world are not great.

I also ended up getting a Beefalo. It was Juicy Berry world, so I took that as a sign. I kind of regretted it later. I personally feel like Juicy Berries aren't as good as grass gekko or twiggy tree worlds, for beefing it.

I get beefalo on most of my characters. I really like them for the speed, and letting me use a piggyback. I'm a little out of practice on them, though, because I was playing Wortox beforehand. I figure the developers do NOT want you to train a beefalo as Wortox, as they avoid adding in a teleport while on a beefalo. I'm not sure why, but I assume it's really intentional at this point.

Chester on Day 6. I am saved.

Easy message in a bottle on day 7, just off the coast. I don't even need an oar, just a grass raft. Crabby Hermit Island is not in a great spot this time, but it doesn't really matter, as I have a beefalo.

I carry a firefly around with me and a straw hat, so I can make a Miner's Hat ASAP. It's great for carrying the marble pieces around. But then I just find one lying on the ground, guarded by a bunch of treeguards. This also lets me get 6 living logs very easily.

I also find this:

IF ONLY...
IF ONLY I HAD HAUNT

I end up spending a bit too much time clumsily collecting resources. I fight Bee Queen Day 11. My strategy:

Make 7 graves. Space them a little bit apart. I guessed that because the bigspooks are limited by distance to each other, placing the decorated graves in clumps of 4 would make lots more of them spawn, consistently. I was right.

Start the fight on the Beefalo. Switch to on-foot with marble armor, when the beefalo gets too hurt.

Use Scotch Eggs for healing. Mosaic is near by Postern Base, so I can grab a few tallbird eggs easy.

It goes pretty well, but actually a bit worse than my first playthrough.

I was thinking too much about the beefalo for no reason, so I wasn't aggressive enough. Abigail ended up taking more damage than she should have, because I wasn't being aggressive enough. I ended up having to use a Cure All that I didn't need to. I also forget, yet again, to collect some bees for the Murder buff.

I used lune blossoms to kill Bee Queen last playthrough, too. It actually helped a lot, as I still haven't practiced the fight much.

However, I just use 93% of a marble suit, and about half a beekeeper hat, otherwise. I didn't even need to heal during the fight.

Right after this, I use the graves to do another Pipspook quest. I time it this time.

I'm not very good at the pipspook chore, but it only takes me 2 minutes. This doesn't seem bad to me. I used to really, really hate it. Now it's much shorter, you can start it whenever you want, and it gives 20 mourning glory.

After that, I return to base. I make twig meals for the beefalo, make the jellybeans, and get all my supplies together for going underground. I also precraft a Sisturn.

I have 3 bundling wraps. In one, I put my Nightmare Werepig boss fight supplies. In another, I have a bundle of 34 butterflies and other supplies. The moment I get a construction amulet, I am going to make a Glossamer Saddle.

Note to self: Precraft an Alchemy Engine next time I play. I think I forgot to.

When I play again, my rough plans:

- Probably go to Crabby Hermit Island to get Lune Blossoms and catch Lune Moths with a net for replanting the trees in my base. Due to being able to bundling wrap the blossoms, I think it will be very easy to just keep the Sisturn 3 buff up whenever I need it.

- Ruins rush as fast as I can. I'm going to try out the Mourning Glory garland and drinking Nightshade Nostrum for night vision. Kill Ancient Guardian, who I hear the player tag doesn't help with, anyway.

- If it looks like I have time, kill Nightmare Werepig after building a Sisturn near him and putting Lune Blossoms in it. It would be great to get his pure horror, as it only takes ONE pure horror to make each Vex elixir as Shadow attuned Wendy. Otherwise, I'll kill him right before AFW, so I have vex potions and the dreadstone to open rifts.

- Get out so I can find the missing Shadow Piece. I found the setpiece already, the rook piece, and knight head. I need to find the Bishop head.

- Kill the Shadow Pieces for the Heart.

- Start gathering supplies for Ancient Fuelweaver. Fight him after my Beefalo tames (just so I don't have to care about the beef shaking the saddle off) .

- Maybe kill Dragonfly before heading down. It barely matters when you kill her when playing solo, though. Usually I just make dwarf stars with a starcaller as much as I need, instead of making a furnace.

No rollbacks or anything so far! Hopefully I can play again next week, but it may be a couple of weeks before I get to, again.

Quick Notes for now:

1. Attack Here ended up being AMAZING. I will get it every time, from now on. Will write details on it next time. It plus the Pipspook Quest perks really change the character for the better, for me.

2. The mourning glory hat seems really expensive, at 6 mourning glory. I haven't been able to test it out yet, but I assume I probably won't get it again. However, I'd be tempted to get it in multiplayer. Being able to give other people very early night vision (especially Wortox) sounds great.

These were extremely good reads. Honestly, I forgot that Pearl has Lune trees on her island, so I've been going for Lunar itself. I love bringing a bug net with me to collect the lunar moths when doing so, just so I can have a bigger supply of Lune blossoms on the main land. Your second run skill tree is actually the exact same one I use, minus the picnic casket, which I have the revive skill instead. I thought you could use the garland to help you mass produce tell tale hearts via the shield, but that doesn't work. Because of that and what you told me about homeless bees, I might just put those skills into the potion tree. Otherwise, this was a really good run analysis and I can't wait for your next attempt

11 minutes ago, Giovirtual79 said:

These were extremely good reads. Honestly, I forgot that Pearl has Lune trees on her island, so I've been going for Lunar itself. I love bringing a bug net with me to collect the lunar moths when doing so, just so I can have a bigger supply of Lune blossoms on the main land. Your second run skill tree is actually the exact same one I use, minus the picnic casket, which I have the revive skill instead. I thought you could use the garland to help you mass produce tell tale hearts via the shield, but that doesn't work. Because of that and what you told me about homeless bees, I might just put those skills into the potion tree. Otherwise, this was a really good run analysis and I can't wait for your next attempt

Here's the skill tree I might try out in the future. 

[Dingle]

19 minutes ago, Giovirtual79 said:

These were extremely good reads. Honestly, I forgot that Pearl has Lune trees on her island, so I've been going for Lunar itself. I love bringing a bug net with me to collect the lunar moths when doing so, just so I can have a bigger supply of Lune blossoms on the main land. Your second run skill tree is actually the exact same one I use, minus the picnic casket, which I have the revive skill instead. I thought you could use the garland to help you mass produce tell tale hearts via the shield, but that doesn't work. Because of that and what you told me about homeless bees, I might just put those skills into the potion tree. Otherwise, this was a really good run analysis and I can't wait for your next attempt

Here's the skill tree I might try out in the future. 

Thanks!

Yeah Pearl Island is great because you can keep an eye out for bottles near the shore, and grab one with a grass raft. This puts her right on the map. And her island has enough trees to always get lune blossoms + enough moths to get your own lunar orchard going in your base.

I was going to do the exact build you posted in my third playthrough, haha.

If they never nerf Sisturn 3, I could also see a build where I lose team spirit 3, and lose the grave relocation perk, but get all 4 points in the potion line.

If you're getting that many potions and mourning glories, you probably don't NEED the grave relocation for pipspooks. But it is really, really nice.

The added benefit of relocating the graves: before that, I usually found myself hunting pipspooks in a forest. And the trees make finding toys more annoying.

[Dingle]

On 12/20/2024 at 4:41 PM, Giovirtual79 said:

Here's the skill tree I might try out in the future. 

Thought more on this build, which I was going to use for my third "rifts open" playthrough. I'm not going to use it.

Instead, my build for that will simply just get all the top row, then Team Spirit II, and Shadow affinity.

Reasons:

1. Sisturn 3 should be the overwhelmingly powerful strategy for any hard boss it applies to. And it works on all the lunar rift bosses. So the rest of my choices should just focus on supporting Sisturn 3.

2. Potions 4 lets me make even more Cure Alls. That simple.

3. Graves 1 is fun, but realistically I don't need it due to Pipspook 3. Even for the pipspook relocation, I don't think I really need it. I could just do the pipspook quest twice early game, when I first visit mosaic graveyard and one of the two forests. That's already worth 13 cure alls from Pipspook 3. Potions 4 boosts this even higher.

4. Haunt seems like it would be fun, but really Team Spirit 3 is just filler. It's two filler for the price of one, but still filler. Much worse: it's filler with no capstone above it.

I wish there was a Team Spirit 4 that made it so Team Spirit commands were instant. This would make it so Wendy didn't need to play an animation when using the commands. This would make going past Team Spirit 2 more tempting for me.

[Dingle]

Had more time to play. I'm on Day 23! Things didn't go great, but I am still on track for Fuelweaver.

PLAYTHROUGH 2 - Part 2
From my last playthrough post, I changed my plans a little. I did not know where the Bishop head was, so I thought the best plan would be to go to the ruins day 13, get the Glossamer Saddle, kill AG, get a Pick/Axe and then just get out. If I found the Bishop head in time and had all the shadow pieces arranged, I could hop back underground to kill Nightmare Werepig.

I took the Mourning Glory hat for night vision. This actually messed me up. It made me put my guard down, and I had a strange ruins entry generation. It was stuck between two non-ruins biomes, and at a weird right angle past another Monkey biome. So I missed it and spent a lot of time running around empty monkey biomes. That probably ate 2 days. The only good thing: I spot the Atrium over a cave gap. It's close enough to just telepoof over when I'm ready to fight Fuelweaver.

Once I got to Ancient Guardian, I thought I'd fight him with just using the Team Spirit commands. Usually, if I'm doing a Wendy ruins rush, I use a single Vigor Mortis to kill AG. Works great. I thought I'd try the Team Spirit commands, though. The problem: Both Escape AND Attack Here seem to mess up AG's charge. If I used Attack Here to have Abby dodge the charge early, a lot of the time he would just stop charging. This really messed me up in the fight a lot, and it went longer than I remember it going.

I'm also carrying too much stuff, so I leave the orange gems in the AG chest. This was also a mistake in hindsight, I need those for a Lazy Explorer.

With AG dead, I run out and drop the Pick/Axe near Werepig on the way. I get out on Day 18, morning.

Now I'm panicking to find the Bishop head. But then I see it: It was just next to my base the whole time, right near the Postern. I must have noticed this when I first entered the world, and then just forgot about it.

I use the extra time to get another 20 mourning glory from the Pipspook quest, and kill Mactusk for 2 tam o shanters and 2 tusks. Then I fight the Shadow Pieces.

I completely and totally forgot how to fight the Shadow Pieces as Wendy. I thought you could use Vigor Mortis for them. She keeps getting bit. I finally have some luck by setting her to Riled Up and kiting away from her when the Rook is trying to bite, and that works well. But at that point she's almost dead. I could have used a Cure All, because I had tons, but I was being stubborn.

Near the end of the fight, I also realize I forgot to remount my beefalo. That is really bad. I end up using Attack Here on the level 3 rook so Abby attacks it from a big range, and then running. This kills abby in one bite, but then the Rook isn't aggroed on me. I am able to remount my beefalo after feeding it 7 twigs. And then I finish the last 20% of the fight.

Very sloppy, but I'm alive. I grab some flowers to put in the Sisturn, so Abby gets to level 3 fast.

Next up, I'm mostly just waiting a day or two for my Ornery to finish taming. I will be getting a Nightmare Amulet ready in the meantime, and probably finally going to Crabby Hermit Island for lune blossoms.

After that, Nightmare Werepig, fossil mining, ruins again for some thulecite armor and Lazy Explorers, and then straight to Fuelweaver. After that, probably Dragonfly. I'll be using Lune Blossoms/Sisturn 3 on all 3 of them. So far, I haven't used it a single time this run.

In my bundling wrap: 9 cactus, the beekeeper helmet, a thulecite helmet, and 2 tall scotch eggs.

[Grove]

3 minutes ago, Dingle said:

The problem: Both Escape AND Attack Here seem to mess up AG's charge. If I used Attack Here to have Abby dodge the charge early, a lot of the time he would just stop charging. This really messed me up in the fight a lot, and it went longer than I remember it going

I'm assuming that the way to do this would be to either make Abby attack at to behind pillars, or use escape whe guardian is getting up so he doesn't aggro on Abby, then use the attack at? Idk, sadly can't test stuff now.

 

8 minutes ago, Dingle said:

totally forgot how to fight the Shadow Pieces as Wendy. I thought you could use Vigor Mortis for them

Dingle probably remembers by now, but fot anyone who doesn't know. Revenant Restorative and prayers for first and second part. Last part against the shadow rook, detailed above.

Although, I wondet if now with escape, bishop works best.

5 minutes ago, Dingle said:

I'm also carrying too much stuff

Me everytime I go to the ruins, sometimes going to the ruins is the only thing I have done, still somehow too much items at Ag :/

[Dingle]

4 minutes ago, Debruh said:

I'm assuming that the way to do this would be to either make Abby attack at to behind pillars, or use escape whe guardian is getting up so he doesn't aggro on Abby, then use the attack at? Idk, sadly can't test stuff now.

I was doing attack here to move her behind pillars at first. Like I said though, doing this seems to make AG completely lose aggro to either of us. He just hops away back to the center of the arena. It was really annoying.

Next time, I'll just use a single vigor mortis like normal.

4 minutes ago, Debruh said:

Dingle probably remembers by now, but fot anyone who doesn't know. Revenant Restorative and prayers for first and second part. Last part against the shadow rook, detailed above.

Although, I wondet if now with escape, bishop works best.

I actually did really well during the first and second parts due to attack here and escape. Way better than I remember.

She just got nuked on the third part because I forgot how to handle the Rook until she was one hit away from death. So by then I just sacrificed her to save my beefalo/myself.

4 minutes ago, Debruh said:

Me everytime I go to the ruins, sometimes going to the ruins is the only thing I have done, still somehow too much items at Ag :/

In hindsight I could have just dropped the mourning glory hat at that point.

[Grove]

Ok, so, as I said, can't test stuff right now.

But theoretically, since escape works with riled up, it should do great on a bishop. Especially if revenant restorative or cure-all back it up. Attack at might even work as well, and might be better in case of two bishops (wanting an atrium for fuelweaver and the nightmare saddle for example). Might work on knight too, but it has more health than the bishop, so why bother?

Tier 3 versions of Bishop/Knight/Rook have healths of 7500/8100/10000

Differences: Rook-Bishop: 2500. Knight-Bishop: 600

So, if fighting two. Then there's a difference of 5000 hp between two rooks and two bishops, and 1200 hp between two knights and two bishops.

 

 

[Dingle]

3 minutes ago, Debruh said:

Ok, so, as I said, can't test stuff right now.

But theoretically, since escape works with riled up, it should do great on a bishop. Especially if revenant restorative or cure-all back it up. Attack at might even work as well, and might be better in case of two bishops (wanting an atrium for fuelweaver and the nightmare saddle for example). Might work on knight too, but it has more health than the bishop, so why bother?

Tier 3 versions of Bishop/Knight/Rook have healths of 7500/8100/10000

Differences: Rook-Bishop: 2500. Knight-Bishop: 600

So, if fighting two. Then there's a difference of 5000 hp between two rooks and two bishops, and 1200 hp between two knights and two bishops.

 

 

Oh yeah, it should unless the enemy AI does something weird. I did not want to test it during a real run, so I did the Rook instead. That way if Abby died for me, I could finish the fight normally on a beefalo.

Escape seemed to work well on the level 2 Bishop, so it probably should on a level 3.

[Grove]

3 minutes ago, Dingle said:

I was doing attack here to move her behind pillars at first. Like I said though, doing this seems to make AG completely lose aggro to either of us. He just hops away back to the center of the arena. It was really annoying.

Yea, attack at seems to block aggro for some reason. You would probably have to hit him before running while Abby's in escape mode, or after making her dash.

 

4 minutes ago, Dingle said:

So by then I just sacrificed her to save my beefalo/myself.

Always love it when Abby sacrifices herself to keep Wendy safe. Reminds me of when I was still learning bosses , and my first time doing shadow pieces, I didn't know how to make Abby survive shadow rook, but did use her as a sacrifice to swap between war saddle and glossamer saddle. Also multiple times in phase 2 and 3 in order to heal the beef. 

[Dingle]

Oh, forgot to mention:

Abby really stomps ruins bishops, splumonkeys, and Mactusk. Like always.

Mactusk is especially fun now with Attack Here.

[Giovirtual79]

3 hours ago, Dingle said:

I completely and totally forgot how to fight the Shadow Pieces as Wendy. I thought you could use Vigor Mortis for them. She keeps getting bit. I finally have some luck by setting her to Riled Up and kiting away from her when the Rook is trying to bite, and that works well. But at that point she's almost dead. I could have used a Cure All, because I had tons, but I was being stubborn.

Near the end of the fight, I also realize I forgot to remount my beefalo. That is really bad. I end up using Attack Here on the level 3 rook so Abby attacks it from a big range, and then running. This kills abby in one bite, but then the Rook isn't aggroed on me. I am able to remount my beefalo after feeding it 7 twigs. And then I finish the last 20% of the fight.

Very sloppy, but I'm alive. I grab some flowers to put in the Sisturn, so Abby gets to level 3 fast.

Next up, I'm mostly just waiting a day or two for my Ornery to finish taming. I will be getting a Nightmare Amulet ready in the meantime, and probably finally going to Crabby Hermit Island for lune blossoms.

After that, Nightmare Werepig, fossil mining, ruins again for some thulecite armor and Lazy Explorers, and then straight to Fuelweaver. After that, probably Dragonfly. I'll be using Lune Blossoms/Sisturn 3 on all 3 of them. So far, I haven't used it a single time this run.

In my bundling wrap: 9 cactus, the beekeeper helmet, a thulecite helmet, and 2 tall scotch eggs.

I actually decided to try a run where I rushed the shadow pieces (spoilers: I died). Despite that, I wanted to test and see a run where I did a successful full fight. I remember seeing someone used an ice staff method with Abby when fighting the tier 3 bishop and I wanted to try that exact same method with Escape. I never fought the shadow pieces before, so I had to fight without Abby when it came to killing the rook, but the fight against the bishop didn't go that badly thanks to escape allowing Abigail to get away from the bishop and, by running further away, Abby is forced to stay away from the bishop until it finishes attacking. I did mess up the timing a few times, which caused me to take a lot of damage, so definitely on the riskier side. I might try another run facing the shadow pieces in the future in a legit run. Nevertheless, great job on fighting the tier 3 rook. I look forward to seeing you eventually try Fuelweaver.

Just now, Giovirtual79 said:

I actually decided to try a run where I rushed the shadow pieces (spoilers: I died). Despite that, I wanted to test and see a run where I did a successful full fight. I remember seeing someone used an ice staff method with Abby when fighting the tier 3 bishop and I wanted to try that exact same method with Escape. I never fought the shadow pieces before, so I had to fight without Abby when it came to killing the rook, but the fight against the bishop didn't go that badly thanks to escape allowing Abigail to get away from the bishop and, by running further away, Abby is forced to stay away from the bishop until it finishes attacking. I did mess up the timing a few times, which caused me to take a lot of damage, so definitely on the riskier side. I might try another run facing the shadow pieces in the future in a legit run. Nevertheless, great job on fighting the tier 3 rook. I look forward to seeing you eventually try Fuelweaver.

Edit: The reason U had to fight without her against the rook was because she took too much damage

*I

 

On 12/22/2024 at 10:26 AM, Dingle said:

Thought more on this build, which I was going to use for my third "rifts open" playthrough. I'm not going to use it.

Instead, my build for that will simply just get all the top row, then Team Spirit II, and Shadow affinity.

Reasons:

1. Sisturn 3 should be the overwhelmingly powerful strategy for any hard boss it applies to. And it works on all the lunar rift bosses. So the rest of my choices should just focus on supporting Sisturn 3.

2. Potions 4 lets me make even more Cure Alls. That simple.

3. Graves 1 is fun, but realistically I don't need it due to Pipspook 3. Even for the pipspook relocation, I don't think I really need it. I could just do the pipspook quest twice early game, when I first visit mosaic graveyard and one of the two forests. That's already worth 13 cure alls from Pipspook 3. Potions 4 boosts this even higher.

4. Haunt seems like it would be fun, but really Team Spirit 3 is just filler. It's two filler for the price of one, but still filler. Much worse: it's filler with no capstone above it.

I wish there was a Team Spirit 4 that made it so Team Spirit commands were instant. This would make it so Wendy didn't need to play an animation when using the commands. This would make going past Team Spirit 2 more tempting for me.

Honestly, that's fair. I prefer the convenience of graves and dark petals being close by, but I don't think it's a priority over the other skills

[Dingle]

9 minutes ago, Giovirtual79 said:

I actually decided to try a run where I rushed the shadow pieces (spoilers: I died). Despite that, I wanted to test and see a run where I did a successful full fight. I remember seeing someone used an ice staff method with Abby when fighting the tier 3 bishop and I wanted to try that exact same method with Escape. I never fought the shadow pieces before, so I had to fight without Abby when it came to killing the rook, but the fight against the bishop didn't go that badly thanks to escape allowing Abigail to get away from the bishop and, by running further away, Abby is forced to stay away from the bishop until it finishes attacking. I did mess up the timing a few times, which caused me to take a lot of damage, so definitely on the riskier side. I might try another run facing the shadow pieces in the future in a legit run. Nevertheless, great job on fighting the tier 3 rook. I look forward to seeing you eventually try Fuelweaver.

Great to hear, it is nice to be able to have the Bishop as an option. For the reasons Debruh said. In my last Wortox playthrough, I was also able to do Bishop last due to soul hop.

My next run will probably be next week, and I'll do both werepig and fuelweaver with lune blossoms in the Sisturn.

[Dingle]

Got to play again for a bit! Will be able to again some time next week.

I was planning on doing a "start with Rifts open" playthrough, but currently don't really see the point. I've seen other posts that show that Sisturn 3 Abigail stomps the lunar bosses really hard. I think what I'll do is continue this playthrough, and see how I do against things like the Ink Blight Trio.

This time I fought Nightmare Werepig, Fuelweaver, and Winter's Feast Deerclops.

PLAYTHROUGH 2 - Part 3

I first mess around a bit, waiting for my Beef to finish taming. As I do so, I both get a magic machine and nightmare amulet, and I go to Pearl's Island to get Lune Blossoms and Lune Moths.

I leave with a great amount of moths and lune blossoms. It's really easy to do this early and get everything you need. The trees grow very fast, considering you only really need to wait until they're medium sized trees for them to be self-perpetuating forever with bug nets.

I plant them near the base, then take off for underground. I have a Sisturn pre-crafted, and my lune blossoms are wrapped for travel. I place the Sisturn between Nightmare Werepig, and the Lichen Biome. I also drop stuff there I'm not going to use right away, as a mini-base.

4 lune blossoms in, 8 in reserve! I wrap up the remaining 8, and go fight the nearby Nightmare Werepig.

The fight goes great, at first. With a walking cane and Magi, it is easy to dodge. It's also easy to have Abby dodge the attacks, too, NWMP tends to whiff the space between us if I dodge correctly. I at first only use a Reventant Restorative, for safety.

He gets in some hits when he gets into phase 2 on Abby. It doesn't kill her, but it does deplete her a lot, even with Sisturn 3. But then we wail on him some more, no problem.

And then the fight goes HORRIBLY WRONG when a single Slurtle shows up. I am reminded why I completely hate this fight. I forget to just make a torch to burn the Slurtle, and this leads to both me and Abby taking damage as I get impatient.

After this, a Depths Worm interferes with the fight.

After this, a Bunnyman wanders in and then kites WP far, far away.

After that, a second Slurtle starts eating flint out of my backpack.

At this point I'm so pissed that I make mistakes, and end up using a Cure All on Abby. Then I get flustered enough to just desummon her to continue the fight.

After I desummon her, I hit Werepig 4 more times and he dies. I am not happy at this point.

I take a break by getting fossils and lightbugs real quick, and I make Vex Elixirs with the Pure Horror I got from Werepig. He dropped 4, more than I brought Mourning Glory for. Then I go to a chest I set up in the ruins before. I had to get an orange gem, but otherwise I had all the materials I needed already for armor for Fuelweaver.

The Atrium is visible only a small run from my crafting station, so I had there and use the Lazy Explorer to hop over. The Atrium itself has a really easy layout, so I find the Fuelweaver Arena fast.


Above are my resources at the start of the Fuelweaver fight. I expect to have to roll back a few times, as I haven't done a solo Fuelweaver in a very long time. I also try not to pause during the Fuelweaver fight, as I consider solo practice for multiplayer.

I roll back zero times, FW dies first attempt. I mess up the fight in every way I can think of. Here's a small list:

- You can see above that I left my only Lazy Explorer in my piggyback. I start the fight by dropping the Piggyback, and don't realize I have no Lazy Explorer until he's already rooted me. When I run to the backpack, he roots me again, knocking the backpack away. When I do get the backpack, I mess up somehow and drop it again with no Lazy Explorer, as I'm already in a panic that the fight is ruined. I finally get the Lazy Explorer in my inventory, I ditch the Magi amulet for the space.

During this, Abigail tanks for me pretty well. I use Escape every once in awhile, to let her regenerate. She can't tank Fuelweaver forever with Cure All and Sisturn 3, but she can for quite awhile. I have her do this a lot throughout the fight.

- I somehow misplace or lose my extra sanity food. I have no idea where it went. I haven't been able to check yet. Maybe I just ate it during the Werepig fight? I rely a lot on keeping the Bee Queen Crown on as much as I can. Through most of the fight, I think I'm hovering around 45 sanity, maybe.

- I often mess up Abigail commands during the fight, from already fumbling around during the fight. I still get to use Attack Here a reasonable amount, to either position her to kill the crawling healers or position her behind Fuelweaver. I forget to do this about half the time, and I also use Escape less than I should have.

- Sometimes I really mess Abigail positioning up, and have her accidentally prevent Fuelweaver from reaching me as I get rooted, in which case she gets wailed on by FW a bit as I stumble to teleport out of the cage. I could use Escape to fix this, I think, but I forget to.

- I often miss one shadow hand, and then can't find it.

- I often miss some shadow hands, due to placing Abby wrong, so FW heals a lot.

Despite all this, it doesn't seem to matter. When FW gets to about half health, I murder the 16 lightbugs in my inventory so Abby does more DPS. Here's my resources at the end of the fight:

Abigail really carried me, hard. I would have died playing that sloppy as any other character, except I guess Wurt with her army.

16 lightbugs worth of murder also seems to last a pretty long time, she's still in shadow form a bit after the fight ends. My sanity was completely gone by this point, but Abigail was near full health.

This took me 5 cure alls, and 1 vex potion. But only about 1.5 thulecite suits, 2/3 of a bee queen crown, 98% of a marble suit, and about 1 thulecite crown. Also a jellybean and 2 tall scotch eggs for healing, and half a Lazy Explorer.

I get my loot and leave. I forget my lune blossoms on the way up, so I'll have to go back and get them.

Right when I hit the surface, Laser Deerclops spawns. I forget I don't have the Sisturn buff going, so I ignore Abby during the fight. This actually leads Abigail to the cloest to death she ever got this playthrough. I have to desummon her at 8 health.

That's all for now! I'll post more overall thoughts/feedback next time I continue the playthrough.

[WenericMember]

27 minutes ago, Dingle said:

 

Aww that's sweet dialogue

Aside from that yeah blessed sisturn is way too good in its current state.

[Dingle]

9 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

Aww that's sweet dialogue

Aside from that yeah blessed sisturn is way too good in its current state.

Player tag is oddly a failure both ways.

People that want Wendy buffed as much as possible also don't like it, because it only works on some bosses and not things like Rooks.

It's a no brainer to get it (unless you avoid bosses entirely), but I also didn't get the lune blossoms until fairly late in my playthrough so far. It's because it does nothing vs AG or the Shadow Pieces.

I'm not even sure if it works on the Ink Blight enemies. The distinction seems so arbitrary.

[WenericMember]

39 minutes ago, Dingle said:

Player tag is oddly a failure both ways.

People that want Wendy buffed as much as possible also don't like it, because it only works on some bosses and not things like Rooks.

It's a no brainer to get it (unless you avoid bosses entirely), but I also didn't get the lune blossoms until fairly late in my playthrough so far. It's because it does nothing vs AG or the Shadow Pieces.

I'm not even sure if it works on the Ink Blight enemies. The distinction seems so arbitrary.

Blessed sisturn 3 is obviously meant to be a measure of per-alignment survivability for abigail, specifically against bosses. It is interesting how hard they're struggling with managing that though. Temp HP was unfun and was too easy to bleed when it wasn't needed, and then they accidentally made the player tag broken.

I honestly think the way forward should be to just let Abigail have stupid HP against mobs (bc she REALLY never struggles with them) and let a sisturn filled with lunar blossoms let abigail upgrade to level 4, with 1200 hp.

• Doesn't make cure-all broken
• Gives sisturn regen a benefit over Ghastly experience, which only restores to level 3
• Global effectiveness against bosses.
• It doesn't make Shadow Abby immortal

Yes it makes Abigail even better against hordes, but there was really no amount of hordes cure all + Abby couldn't fix.

[Dingle]

10 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

Blessed sisturn 3 is obviously meant to be a measure of per-alignment survivability for abigail, specifically against bosses. It is interesting how hard they're struggling with managing that though. Temp HP was unfun and was too easy to bleed when it wasn't needed, and then they accidentally made the player tag broken.

I honestly think the way forward should be to just let Abigail have stupid HP against mobs (bc she REALLY never struggles with them) and let a sisturn filled with lunar blossoms let abigail upgrade to level 4, with 1200 hp.

• Doesn't make cure-all broken
• Gives sisturn regen a benefit over Ghastly experience, which only restores to level 3
• Global effectiveness against bosses.
• It doesn't make Shadow Abby immortal

Yes it makes Abigail even better against hordes, but there was really no amount of hordes cure all + Abby couldn't fix.

Yeah, I like this and have seen it suggested before. Maybe not 1200 as at that amount, I'd still always take it.

At 900 I'd probably still get it, but I'd at least sometimes go for skill tree builds that don't have it.

[WenericMember]

1 minute ago, Dingle said:

Yeah, I like this and have seen it suggested before. Maybe not 1200 as at that amount, I'd still always take it.

At 900 I'd probably still get it, but I'd at least sometimes go for skill tree builds that don't have it.

It'd probably require more playtesting to decide on a value imo. It does cost a lot of insight to obtain, and the bigger issue is how Cure-All outstrips damage taken for the player tag, rather than the doubled durability.

[Dingle]

9 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

It'd probably require more playtesting to decide on a value imo. It does cost a lot of insight to obtain, and the bigger issue is how Cure-All outstrips damage taken for the player tag, rather than the doubled durability.

That's just my gut feeling: "3 insight for double abby health seems like a pretty brainless choice". Especially given how open and freeform her skill tree is, both after the perk merges and just her general lack of locks in the tree.

In any case, the general idea of more abby health seems better than the player tag.

[WenericMember]

10 minutes ago, Dingle said:

That's just my gut feeling: "3 insight for double abby health seems like a pretty brainless choice". Especially given how open and freeform her skill tree is, both after the perk merges and just her general lack of locks in the tree.

In any case, the general idea of more abby health seems better than the player tag.

Not really, the main reason player tag is so broken is that each point of HP is worth double against bosses, so Spectral cure all effectively has doubled healing. That's what makes present Blessed Sisturn so broken.

As long as the bonus HP doesn't change the ratio between amount healed and damage taken, it'll only give an increased buffer - any situation where Abigail takes meaningfully more damage than she heals will still result in her death.

That's just my perspective though.

Also my insight tree (Don't have full insight because I was away for 3 weeks of the Beta :P):

• I'm avoiding Blessed sisturn 3 till it gets rewroked to a more healthy state, as I don't want to rely on it.
• I'll probably trade pipspook I for  MG III if that skill gets the buffs it needs
• I generally like giving Wendy more utility, so flower crown, haunt and donating Sanity drain reduction are musts.

Says something about the quality of the tree that I still want vengeful ghost for fun, pipspooks II and III for QOL and Potions III to combo with flower crown. I'd also waant MG III  and BS III if they were better balanced.

[Dingle]

23 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

Not really, the main reason player tag is so broken is that each point of HP is worth double against bosses, so Spectral cure all effectively has doubled healing. That's what makes present Blessed Sisturn so broken.

As long as the bonus HP doesn't change the ratio between amount healed and damage taken, it'll only give an increased buffer - any situation where Abigail takes meaningfully more damage than she heals will still result in her death.

That's just my perspective though.

Also my insight tree (Don't have full insight because I was away for 3 weeks of the Beta :P):

• I'm avoiding Blessed sisturn 3 till it gets rewroked to a more healthy state, as I don't want to rely on it.
• I'll probably trade pipspook I for  MG III if that skill gets the buffs it needs
• I generally like giving Wendy more utility, so flower crown, haunt and donating Sanity drain reduction are musts.

Says something about the quality of the tree that I still want vengeful ghost for fun, pipspooks II and III for QOL and Potions III to combo with flower crown. I'd also waant MG III  and BS III if they were better balanced.

Scare and Haunt actually sound really fun, after seeing that thread about haunt and scare details.

I'll check them out when/if Sisturn 3 is no longer the overwhelmingly dominant strategy.

[WenericMember]

7 minutes ago, Dingle said:

Scare and Haunt actually sound really fun, after seeing that thread about haunt and scare details.

I'll check them out when/if Sisturn 3 is no longer the overwhelmingly dominant strategy.

Yeah, it really is tragic how centralizing Blessed Sisturn 3 is. It's single handedly kneecapping Lunar Abby's viability, makes any need to fine tune Abby's control obsolete, and has enough skills to easily facilitate Cure-All production that it kills build diversity.

ATP the "meta" build is basically BS, SS, PQ, Gravestones and Potions to max mg output, with almost no room for variety.

[Giovirtual79]

4 hours ago, Dingle said:

That's just my gut feeling: "3 insight for double abby health seems like a pretty brainless choice". Especially given how open and freeform her skill tree is, both after the perk merges and just her general lack of locks in the tree.

In any case, the general idea of more abby health seems better than the player tag.

I think near the end of the double hp's run, it was in it's perfect stage. it only took about 5 minutes to go from 600 hp to 1200 hp AND they finally changed it to where you didn't need to be near Abigail in order for her hp to increase. You could be across the map and Abigail would still generate hp. I feel if that version were to return, it would still be a good trade for the player tag because it immediately got replaced by the player tag soon after.

[WenericMember]

12 minutes ago, Giovirtual79 said:

I think near the end of the double hp's run, it was in it's perfect stage. it only took about 5 minutes to go from 600 hp to 1200 hp AND they finally changed it to where you didn't need to be near Abigail in order for her hp to increase. You could be across the map and Abigail would still generate hp. I feel if that version were to return, it would still be a good trade for the player tag because it immediately got replaced by the player tag soon after.

I think I'd make one change though, where the bonus hp would only trigger after abigail's regular HP was expended. That way it wouldn't be used when Abigail was fighting regular hordes, which resulted in her losing the hp needlessly.

[Picklesaurus]

35 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

I think I'd make one change though, where the bonus hp would only trigger after abigail's regular HP was expended. That way it wouldn't be used when Abigail was fighting regular hordes, which resulted in her losing the hp needlessly.

It is the first time I see a suggestion related to sisturn III and Abi survivability that I genuinily like, I hate the idea of doubling Abigail max HP with one skill point that some people talked about in the past. If they did like you are suggesting I would be really happy because it would be like a resource Abi would tap in when you messed up and allowed her HP to become too low, instead of dying she would stay  at 1hp and become protected by the sisturn extra hp shield and you could go above 1hp again by healing to stop using the rest of the extra temporary hp from the sisturn, I find this suggestion really interesting.