Elaboration on Blessed Sisturn & Cure All reworks.

[Koomin]

21 minutes ago, YuRinshue said:

Thank you for your generosity, and I hope you can give me an evaluation of my ideas. I am not afraid of others pointing out the problems in my ideas

 

I think the reason this post and steorras post are getting so much positive engagement is because they are proposing updates that reduce the power of things that many people think are too strong (Shadow Abigail combined with player tag), while still supporting things that many players don't want removed (the player tag).  Their posts are a combination of buffs and nerfs that try to find a middle ground that all people are happy with, which is why you see a lot of people that normally disagree reacting positively together.  I think your ideas are really cool, especially the pipspook one, but I struggle to support them because they do not correct anything that is too strong in the current skill tree, and propose buffs without any nerfs to balance them out (such as proposing allowing multiple potions at once, which is a huge buff, with nothing made weaker to compensate).  I would more fully support your ideas if you added power reductions to balance out the power increases you are proposing.  Again, a lot of these ideas are interesting and promising.

[WenericMember]

31 minutes ago, YuRinshue said:

I find it difficult to understand the meaning of these contents and how they bring about corresponding effects

Thank you for your recognition.
Regarding the length of the article. This may be a matter of personal writing habits. I am concerned that overly short text may lead to unnecessary misunderstandings and repetitive explanations, but too long paragraphs can also reduce the desire to read, which makes me feel conflicted.

 

And... Well, what does ypur mean?

Ypur is a mistake my bad.

The explanations:

Currently, the there are only two super potions - the shadow and lunar ones, pretty much only available after rifts are activated. Making cure-all a super potion would allow people to use super potions prior to opening rifts.

Synergy is an interaction creating additional value. Any character moving a grave would have value, but wendy has additional synergy as it controls pipspook spawns.

MG is mourning glory, the flower used in potions.

As ghastly experience can now instantly restore Abigail to level 3, the sisturns ability to speed up the process has less value.

Alignment perks are gesalt and shadow abigail lines. The ones that are mutually exclusive. 

Alignnebt potions are the ones that deal planar damage and increase vex effectiveness.

Stockpiling and swapping is the act of crafting shadow potions, then changing your skills so you can no longer craft them, then using them with other skill sets. Think Winona before her tree.

Sisturn is aligned is what type of flowers are in the sisturn, and timer QOL is allowing animals like bunnies provide more than 8 seconds to shadow abigail.

Sorry if these explanations arent good enough. Theres a lot and im on mobile

As per the shorter text, thats fair enough, I've encountered the same issue. I think a clear title and opening statement may still be helpful. 

Something like "please add more variety to pipspook quests"

 

[YuRinshue]

34 minutes ago, Koomin said:

我认为这篇文章和 steorras 帖子获得如此多积极参与的原因是，他们提出的更新降低了许多人认为太强大的东西的力量（Shadow Abigail 与 player 标签相结合），同时仍然支持许多玩家不想删除的东西（player 标签）。他们的帖子是 buff 和 nerfs 的组合，试图找到一个所有人都满意的中间立场，这就是为什么你会看到很多通常不同意的人一起做出积极反应。我觉得你的想法真的很酷，尤其是 pipspook 那个，但我很难支持它们，因为它们没有纠正当前技能树中任何太强的东西，并提出了没有任何削弱的增益来平衡它们（例如提议允许一次使用多个药水，这是一个巨大的增益，没有变得更弱来补偿）。如果您添加功率降低以平衡您提议的功率增加，我会更完全地支持您的想法。同样，这些想法中有很多是有趣和有前途的。

My ideas mostly come from Wendy's experience without a skill tree, so some of the content is often generated without considering existing controversial things (because no one knows if they will disappear the next day).
As for the balance issue you are considering in my article, I actually think there are two logical problems here.

1.Should there be a causal relationship between "other parts of the skill tree are controversial" and "this part is unreasonable"?
2. "Dual existence potions (or other) certainly have strength, but is the magnitude of this strength too much for Wendy“

In my opinion, the first point should not have any correlation because the former is the part that needs to be addressed, and the feasibility of the latter should not be denied just because the former has not been resolved yet.

The second point is a question that needs to be understood, which involves the positioning level of all characters and Wendy's own functional level qualification.
Just like double potions, everyone knows that there is a lot of improvement, but the core question should be "Is a single potion a qualified functional level?", "Is double potions a qualified functional level or a supermodel functional level? In my opinion, a single potion is a poorly performing feature that makes the already unbalanced potion system more monotonous and mediocre, while a dual potion would be a necessary improvement to change the current state of this system. Even with dual potions, other characters would not lose any advantages because it is Wendy's unique special help in addressing Abigail's issues.

This is my consideration of why I don't care about balance in some of the content in my article. I hope you can understand and give your own opinion.

I will post the original text here because there may be many translation issues with the content

 

我的想法大多来源于温蒂没有技能树时的体验，所以部分内容的产生往往不考虑现有的具备争议性的东西（因为谁也不知道它们会不会在第二天消失）。

 

至于我文章中你所考虑平衡性问题，嗯，其实这里我觉得存在两个逻辑问题。

1.”技能树里其他部分有争议“和“这个部分不合理“两者应该有因果关系吗？

2.“双存在药水（或其他）当然是有强度的，但这份强度的幅度对温蒂来说过分吗？“

 

第一条在我看来，其实应该不存在关联性，因为前者才是需要被解决的部分，而不应该因为前者还未解决，所以就去否定后者的可行性。

 

第二条则是一个需要理解的问题，这涉及到全部角色的定位水平，以及温蒂自己的功能水平合格程度。

就好比双药水，大家都知道这个提升很多，但核心的问题应该是“单药水是一个合格的功能水平吗？“，”双药水是合格的功能水平还是超模的功能水平？“，就以我的想法来说，单药水是表现很糟糕的功能，这导致了本来就不平衡的药水系统变得更单调且平庸，而双药水对于改变这个系统的现状，会是一个必要的提升。即便拥有了双药水，也没有让其他角色失去任何优点，因为这是温蒂特有的未补足阿比盖尔问题的特殊帮助。

 

这是我对我文章里一些内容为什么不在意平衡的考量，希望你能理解并给出自己的看法。

[CremeLover]

I have a question with your design, Blessed Sisturn III requires you to fill the Sisturn with Mourning Glory to get the player tag on default Abigail, shadow flowers to turn Abigail into shadow Abigail, and Lunar for Gestalt. So..

-Mourning Glory: Player Tag on default Abigail (Blessed Sisturn III)
-Shadow Petals: Shadow Abigail (Shadow align)
-Moon Petals: Gestald Abigail+Player Tag (Lunar Align)

If I undestood it correctly.

In this is the scenario you suggest, it would make one skill from the base tree mutually exclusive with both alignments branches, making it a waste skill pick once you pick one of the alignments. If this is the case, I can't really support the actual implementation of it.

2 hours ago, WenericMember said:

2) Blessed sisturn 3 is incompatible with shadow abigail.

I don't understand why everyone is so opposed to add any form of survivability to shadow Abigail. She is pretty strong, but I really don't like how in Wendy's case, the alignments have turned from Lunar=Low Risk/Low Reward, Shadow=High Risk/High Reward. I find both Lunar and Shadow alignment on other characters interesting, but in Wendy's case I feel like is just "turn brain off" choice and "tryhard choice".

[RussoDaFederal]

I said it in the other post and I'll say it again. Don't hurt Wendy's base kit to try and force a skill that should be patched out. This is not a compromise. This has gone too far, it's time Klei reverts some changes and try to balance the game in a way that doesn't feel artificial. There are so many problems with this approach. I'll name a few:

1. Farming is not hard, it's just tedious. By increasing the cost of something you don't attack the problem directly. People can still spam cure alls, it'll just be more expensive.

2. This will hurt absolutely everyone, especially people outside the forums. Imagine if this change goes live and some people open the game to find out their favorite character now has BASE changes (and directly a nerf, at that) along with the skill tree, without reading the forums to know the logic behind it. I know I'd be extremely disappointed.

3. Shadow Abigail is not too strong, I thought we agreed on that on the last update. It's gestalt Abi that was unnecessarily nerfed to the ground. They switched her from "invincible" to "will non ironically wait to be killed". There are better options to balance her out.

4. If you go by the suggestion that sisturn 3 should only affect gestalt Abi, then the whole positioning of the skills in the tree is bogus. If this skill only affects gestalt Abi, it should be placed after the whole lunar branch. And to keep everything symmetrical, Klei would have to think of a new skill for shadow Abi as well. And then you'd have 4 skills on each shadow/lunar branch, which is not the ideal. 3 is fine, let's leave it at that.

I don't know when it became this relevant to discuss how the game should work for casual and hardcore players. It's like it's either one or the other, I consider myself somewhere in between. Not related to this post or anyone I've seen commenting here, but some people can't even be bothered to press F on their keyboard. There are limits to how bad someone can be at the game before they die. The skill tree shouldn't cover a player's own weakness, it should add interesting gameplay options. Please revert player tag. It was not a good idea from the start, if I agreed to it back then (I honestly don't remember) then I admit I was wrong. Remove it and replace it to what it was before, just the extra health thing. Buff gestalt Abi to compensate, I don't care, but remove Abi's player tag. It is objectively unbalanced, the spectral cure all healing is way too strong if she's taking half the damage. Just don't hurt Wendy's base kit to make room for convoluted and overcomplicated changes on her skill tree.

[WenericMember]

17 minutes ago, CremeLover said:

I have a question with your design, Blessed Sisturn III requires you to fill the Sisturn with Mourning Glory to get the player tag on default Abigail, shadow flowers to turn Abigail into shadow Abigail, and Lunar for Gestalt. So..

-Mourning Glory: Player Tag on default Abigail (Blessed Sisturn III)
-Shadow Petals: Shadow Abigail (Shadow align)
-Moon Petals: Gestald Abigail+Player Tag (Lunar Align)

If I undestood it correctly.

In this is the scenario you suggest, it would make one skill from the base tree mutually exclusive with both alignments branches, making it a waste skill pick once you pick one of the alignments. If this is the case, I can't really support the actual implementation of it.

I don't understand why everyone is so opposed to add any form of survivability to shadow Abigail. She is pretty strong, but I really don't like how in Wendy's case, the alignments have turned from Lunar=Low Risk/Low Reward, Shadow=High Risk/High Reward. I find both Lunar and Shadow alignment on other characters interesting, but in Wendy's case I feel like is just "turn brain off" choice and "tryhard choice".

Your interpetation is correct.  They arent technically redundant, as they have different applications. The default path is good for extended trips, as sisturn will always be active, along woth giving abigail bulk+AOE, something the alignmebts don't have.

As for your opinion on the alignment, that is kind of the point. Wendy is simultaneously a beginner friendly character and the highest skill expression in the game. The alignment allows klei to buff those two aspects individually, without running into the present problem.

16 minutes ago, RussoDaFederal said:

I said it in the other post and I'll say it again. Don't hurt Wendy's base kit to try and force a skill that should be patched out. This is not a compromise. This has gone too far, it's time Klei reverts some changes and try to balance the game in a way that doesn't feel artificial. There are so many problems with this approach. I'll name a few:

1. Farming is not hard, it's just tedious. By increasing the cost of something you don't attack the problem directly. People can still spam cure alls, it'll just be more expensive.

2. This will hurt absolutely everyone, especially people outside the forums. Imagine if this change goes live and some people open the game to find out their favorite character now has BASE changes (and directly a nerf, at that) along with the skill tree, without reading the forums to know the logic behind it. I know I'd be extremely disappointed.

3. Shadow Abigail is not too strong, I thought we agreed on that on the last update. It's gestalt Abi that was unnecessarily nerfed to the ground. They switched her from "invincible" to "will non ironically wait to be killed". There are better options to balance her out.

4. If you go by the suggestion that sisturn 3 should only affect gestalt Abi, then the whole positioning of the skills in the tree is bogus. If this skill only affects gestalt Abi, it should be placed after the whole lunar branch. And to keep everything symmetrical, Klei would have to think of a new skill for shadow Abi as well. And then you'd have 4 skills on each shadow/lunar branch, which is not the ideal. 3 is fine, let's leave it at that.

I don't know when it became this relevant to discuss how the game should work for casual and hardcore players. It's like it's either one or the other, I consider myself somewhere in between. Not related to this post or anyone I've seen commenting here, but some people can't even be bothered to press F on their keyboard. There are limits to how bad someone can be at the game before they die. The skill tree shouldn't cover a player's own weakness, it should add interesting gameplay options. Please revert player tag. It was not a good idea from the start, if I agreed to it back then (I honestly don't remember) then I admit I was wrong. Remove it and replace it to what it was before, just the extra health thing. Buff gestalt Abi to compensate, I don't care, but remove Abi's player tag. It is objectively unbalanced, the spectral cure all healing is way too strong if she's taking half the damage. Just don't hurt Wendy's base kit to make room for convoluted and overcomplicated changes on her skill tree.

Some people wanted to keep Cure-Alls cheese strat. Making it more expensive is jsut vribging it in line with things like treeguard cheese.

Its not a direct nerf though? Its turning cure all into a super potion, meaning it can ve activated at the same time as nostrum and mortis. Its more of a rework than nerf.

Shadow Abby wasnt too strong, then got buffed with planar damage. I don't know why you think it was a nerf.

I never said sisturn 3 should only affect gesalt Abby, not sure where you got that.

The whole casual v hardcore debate started as soon as alignments got split afaik.

[Steorra]

9 minutes ago, RussoDaFederal said:

I said it in the other post and I'll say it again. Don't hurt Wendy's base kit to try and force a skill that should be patched out. This is not a compromise. This has gone too far, it's time Klei reverts some changes and try to balance the game in a way that doesn't feel artificial. There are so many problems with this approach. I'll name a few:

1. Farming is not hard, it's just tedious. By increasing the cost of something you don't attack the problem directly. People can still spam cure alls, it'll just be more expensive.

2. This will hurt absolutely everyone, especially people outside the forums. Imagine if this change goes live and some people open the game to find out their favorite character now has BASE changes (and directly a nerf, at that) along with the skill tree, without reading the forums to know the logic behind it. I know I'd be extremely disappointed.

3. Shadow Abigail is not too strong, I thought we agreed on that on the last update. It's gestalt Abi that was unnecessarily nerfed to the ground. They switched her from "invincible" to "will non ironically wait to be killed". There are better options to balance her out.

4. If you go by the suggestion that sisturn 3 should only affect gestalt Abi, then the whole positioning of the skills in the tree is bogus. If this skill only affects gestalt Abi, it should be placed after the whole lunar branch. And to keep everything symmetrical, Klei would have to think of a new skill for shadow Abi as well. And then you'd have 4 skills on each shadow/lunar branch, which is not the ideal. 3 is fine, let's leave it at that.

I don't know when it became this relevant to discuss how the game should work for casual and hardcore players. It's like it's either one or the other, I consider myself somewhere in between. Not related to this post or anyone I've seen commenting here, but some people can't even be bothered to press F on their keyboard. There are limits to how bad someone can be at the game before they die. The skill tree shouldn't cover a player's own weakness, it should add interesting gameplay options. Please revert player tag. It was not a good idea from the start, if I agreed to it back then (I honestly don't remember) then I admit I was wrong. Remove it and replace it to what it was before, just the extra health thing. Buff gestalt Abi to compensate, I don't care, but remove Abi's player tag. It is objectively unbalanced, the spectral cure all healing is way too strong if she's taking half the damage. Just don't hurt Wendy's base kit to make room for convoluted and overcomplicated changes on her skill tree.

regular Abi should be an valuable option even after skill tree.

Gestalt Abi deserve something far better than Player Tag.

If you think Shadow Abi is not imbalance, then same for current blessed sisturn III

and I agree that change the base kit for a skill tree update goes a bit far, but it should be not a taboo. also here's alternative balance method - to nerf current pipspook line. It leads to a same result which makes Cure-All become more expensive.

Last, for your first point, I repeat: go ask to nerf dumplings first.

[NINA1917]

12 minutes ago, RussoDaFederal said:

I said it in the other post and I'll say it again. Don't hurt Wendy's base kit to try and force a skill that should be patched out. This is not a compromise. This has gone too far, it's time Klei reverts some changes and try to balance the game in a way that doesn't feel artificial. There are so many problems with this approach. I'll name a few:

1. Farming is not hard, it's just tedious. By increasing the cost of something you don't attack the problem directly. People can still spam cure alls, it'll just be more expensive.

2. This will hurt absolutely everyone, especially people outside the forums. Imagine if this change goes live and some people open the game to find out their favorite character now has BASE changes (and directly a nerf, at that) along with the skill tree, without reading the forums to know the logic behind it. I know I'd be extremely disappointed.

3. Shadow Abigail is not too strong, I thought we agreed on that on the last update. It's gestalt Abi that was unnecessarily nerfed to the ground. They switched her from "invincible" to "will non ironically wait to be killed". There are better options to balance her out.

4. If you go by the suggestion that sisturn 3 should only affect gestalt Abi, then the whole positioning of the skills in the tree is bogus. If this skill only affects gestalt Abi, it should be placed after the whole lunar branch. And to keep everything symmetrical, Klei would have to think of a new skill for shadow Abi as well. And then you'd have 4 skills on each shadow/lunar branch, which is not the ideal. 3 is fine, let's leave it at that.

I don't know when it became this relevant to discuss how the game should work for casual and hardcore players. It's like it's either one or the other, I consider myself somewhere in between. Not related to this post or anyone I've seen commenting here, but some people can't even be bothered to press F on their keyboard. There are limits to how bad someone can be at the game before they die. The skill tree shouldn't cover a player's own weakness, it should add interesting gameplay options. Please revert player tag. It was not a good idea from the start, if I agreed to it back then (I honestly don't remember) then I admit I was wrong. Remove it and replace it to what it was before, just the extra health thing. Buff gestalt Abi to compensate, I don't care, but remove Abi's player tag. It is objectively unbalanced, the spectral cure all healing is way too strong if she's taking half the damage. Just don't hurt Wendy's base kit to make room for convoluted and overcomplicated changes on her skill tree.

I don’t think it is necessary to delete the player tag. You only need to use the potion to bring changes while acquiring the player tag skill (as the price of the soul being close to humans, the potion is not so effective), and let the potion bring Abigail every second. Your life recovery<boss dps

[RussoDaFederal]

2 minutes ago, Steorra said:

Last, for your first point, I repeat: go ask to nerf dumplings first.

What do pierogis have to do with any of that??

12 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

Shadow Abby wasnt too strong, then got buffed with planar damage. I don't know why you think it was a nerf.

Her extra damage was replaced with planar damage. She's doing the same damage as base Abi on regular (pre rift) mobs. It's a nerf if you consider pre rift content. I like this change, I was even among the first players to suggest it (as far as I know), but compared to her double damage on the previous update, the numbers are smaller. That's all I'm saying

[WenericMember]

7 minutes ago, RussoDaFederal said:

What do pierogis have to do with any of that??

Her extra damage was replaced with planar damage. She's doing the same damage as base Abi on regular (pre rift) mobs. It's a nerf if you consider pre rift content. I like this change, I was even among the first players to suggest it (as far as I know), but compared to her double damage on the previous update, the numbers are smaller. That's all I'm saying

No she's not. Planar damage still applies to regular mobs. Jason made it clear im the update post.

[YuRinshue]

1 hour ago, WenericMember said:

Ypur is a mistake my bad.

The explanations:

Currently, the there are only two super potions - the shadow and lunar ones, pretty much only available after rifts are activated. Making cure-all a super potion would allow people to use super potions prior to opening rifts.

Synergy is an interaction creating additional value. Any character moving a grave would have value, but wendy has additional synergy as it controls pipspook spawns.

MG is mourning glory, the flower used in potions.

As ghastly experience can now instantly restore Abigail to level 3, the sisturns ability to speed up the process has less value.

Alignment perks are gesalt and shadow abigail lines. The ones that are mutually exclusive. 

Alignnebt potions are the ones that deal planar damage and increase vex effectiveness.

Stockpiling and swapping is the act of crafting shadow potions, then changing your skills so you can no longer craft them, then using them with other skill sets. Think Winona before her tree.

Sisturn is aligned is what type of flowers are in the sisturn, and timer QOL is allowing animals like bunnies provide more than 8 seconds to shadow abigail.

Sorry if these explanations arent good enough. Theres a lot and im on mobile

As per the shorter text, thats fair enough, I've encountered the same issue. I think a clear title and opening statement may still be helpful. 

Something like "please add more variety to pipspook quests"

 

Thank you, I think I have roughly understood this content.
However, I still don't understand how to solve the difficulty of switching between Moon Abyss and Moon Abyss here, and whether some of the content refers to player tags only acting on regular Abyss and Moon Abyss?
Also, I feel that increasing the duration of shadows is not a change that can be used to benchmark player tags, and it requires better optimization. However, if the formula of the panacea is modified, is it reasonable to specifically distinguish the scope of application of player tags? I think it needs further discussion.
Finally, regarding the issue of Moon Abigail, her AI level and invincible attack status actually have a greater impact than the player's tag. The transition from an excellent boss special attack to a clumsy AI without any strengths is really an excessive span, which is likely to be a more important issue than the allocation of player tags in the methods used to distinguish between moon and shadow.
By the way, there's a personal anecdote for me. In my testing, the most common enemy in the later stages, Deadly Brightshade, used to have a strategy range of invincible frame Moon Abigail, but now it's not, and even performs worse than Shadow.
But in fact, neither the moon nor the shadow of Abigail can create a stable and effective response. Personally, I think it is necessary to propose corresponding countermeasures to this problem, because Deadly Brightshade is too routine, and this type of enemy is prone to more variants.

[layangan putus]

This is amazing suggestion, dev team should really consider this.

[RussoDaFederal]

30 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

No she's not. Planar damage still applies to regular mobs. Jason made it clear im the update post.

Yes, I know. And she only converts her damage to planar without adding any extra value now, which only affects post rift mobs since they have "armor" (forgot the specific name). Jason said so himself that we'd only be able to see the difference on planar mobs. I'm not complaining, I like this change. But her damage numbers are lower for pre rift mobs compared to the previous update, that is a fact

[WenericMember]

Just now, RussoDaFederal said:

Yes, I know. And she only converts her damage to planar without adding any extra value now, which only affects post rift mobs since they have "armor" (forgot the specific name). Jason said so himself that we'd only be able to see the difference on planar mobs. I'm not complaining, I like this change. But her damage numbers are lower for pre rift mobs compared to the previous update, that is a fact

Thays not what he meant. He said there was no difference between updates for pre rift mobs. If there is its probably a bug. Hopefully someone can test for sure because I cannot.

[Dingle]

Weird suggestion vs just making the player tag also reduce healing elixir power. But whatever. I assume the real point is that she keeps the powerful tankiness, but it's more expensive.

The devs would also have to make Cure All take a perk point in this case. Is that ok? They would have to do it so that they can explain to players not in the beta forum that:

1. Cure All changed a lot, and became a Super Potion

2. What a Super Potion is, so that the new mechanic is explained before you can craft it (like with the alignment potions)

[RussoDaFederal]

30 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

Thays not what he meant. He said there was no difference between updates for pre rift mobs. If there is its probably a bug. Hopefully someone can test for sure because I cannot.

I already said I tested it. So either my interpretation of what Jason said was correct, or my game is bugged. I didn't see an increment in damage when I murdered a bee from my inventory. Tested on beefalo and pigmen

[WenericMember]

7 hours ago, RussoDaFederal said:

I already said I tested it. So either my interpretation of what Jason said was correct, or my game is bugged. I didn't see an increment in damage when I murdered a bee from my inventory. Tested on beefalo and pigmen

Hm weird. Maybe throw it on the bug tracker, if its intended then nothing will happen.

[RussoDaFederal]

Just now, WenericMember said:

Hm weird. Maybe throw it on the bug tracker, if its intended then nothing will happen.

Turns out it was a bug. Sorry for the confusion. I won't throw it on the bug tracker because I can't reproduce it tho

[WenericMember]

12 minutes ago, RussoDaFederal said:

Turns out it was a bug. Sorry for the confusion. I won't throw it on the bug tracker because I can't reproduce it tho

Fair enough, just glad it got sorted out bc I was getting very confused about game mechanics lol

[SilverSpoon]

Spectral cure-all is also needed by beginners to emergency heal Abigail, so requiring a life-giving amulet as a material is too expensive and too hard to get(need Prestihatitator). And It is possible that beginners may find themselves competing for the life-giving amulet that others need (because the life-giving amulet are very useful in themselves).

My idea: take the middle, I think red gem would be good. 

10 hours ago, WenericMember said:

To compensate, I propose making spectral cure-all a super potion. This introduces the mechanic pre-rifts, and stops it overshadowing  Wendy's other basic potions. 

Personally I against this too. The weakness of spectral cure-all is that it overwrites the effects of other elixirs, and I think that should remain as a unique drawback, and if the effects of other elixirs start to stack, it will encourage spectral cure-all spamming attack even more. I think the purpose of spectral cure-all should be "emergency recovery, not something to use during battle."

 

[Lee lol]

I really like the idea of turning SCA into a super potion, although it is indeed a little expensive, and it may be a little troublesome in the early stage of the game...

Indeed, Wendy can now obtain the rebirth amulet by digging graves and haunting. But the number of graves is limited, and the hounds can't come at any time, which is much more limited than before. For long-term players (more than 1k days), it is relatively easy to obtain resources, but for speedrun and those who finish game after defeating CC, the change in the SCA formula is a major change, and I don't think they will like it.

[WenericMember]

On 12/17/2024 at 12:21 PM, Lee lol said:

I really like the idea of turning SCA into a super potion, although it is indeed a little expensive, and it may be a little troublesome in the early stage of the game...

Indeed, Wendy can now obtain the rebirth amulet by digging graves and haunting. But the number of graves is limited, and the hounds can't come at any time, which is much more limited than before. For long-term players (more than 1k days), it is relatively easy to obtain resources, but for speedrun and those who finish game after defeating CC, the change in the SCA formula is a major change, and I don't think they will like it.

Maybe make it a new tier 3 potion as a compromise, and make the old sca only slightly more expensive. It would still wouldnt solve the problem with Blessed sisturn tho.

[Lee lol]

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