wanda skilltree concept (more alternatives 'n crap included)

[fabin]

hello, i've decided to make a skill tree concept for wanda, since people don't seem too interested in makin' one for her as much as other characters (probably for a good reason, too)

my goal here was to make wanda have more options than just being a good damage dealer and occasional reviver. as you'll see down below, i opted to give her more variety on the things she can do, while also giving her a bit more leeway in certain things she already does. and also a subsersive lunar path, because she quite literally has a quote implying she'd be fine with making a deal with the moonlets :)

Watch Branch

Spoiler

A1 - Shaving Seconds I

All Watches refresh faster while being carried, the amount depending on Wanda's Age. (-15% Cooldown when Young, -5% while Middle-Aged and -3.33% while Old)

A2 - Shaving Seconds II

Backtrek and Second Chance Watches refresh a lot faster while being carried, when Young. (-33% Cooldown time for Backtrek and -25% cooldown for Second Chance)

A3 - Shaving Seconds III

Backstep Watch gives a small speed boost shortly after hopping back in time.

Speed amount decreases depending on Wanda's Age. (+70% Speed for 0.4 seconds while Young, +30% for 1 second while Middle-Aged and +15% for 1.2 seconds while Old)

L1 - Lock

Locked: Only one of these skills can be learned.

A4 - Duplex Tempus

Activate all Watches faster and get a stronger grip on them. (New animations like Wormwood's Compost Care skill, all animations cannot be cancelled by being attacked)

 

B1 - Slow Flow I

Shortly after using an Ageless Watch slow Age flow by a little. (After rejuvenating, Age will tick 25% slower for 4 seconds afterwards)

B2 - Slow Flow II

Shortly after using an Ageless Watch slow Age flow by a lot. (After rejuvenating, Age will tick 40% slower for 8 seconds afterwards)

B3 - Slow Flow III

Use a Second Chance Watch to stop the Age flow completely, until hit. (The Second Chance Watch in question becomes unusable and cannot be dropped. Being hit and cancelling the effect puts it on a 10 Minute Cooldown. E.G.: I use it at Age 50, i will stay at Age 50 until A: I start starving, freezing or overheating; or B: I get hit by something)

L2 - Lock

Locked: Only one of these skills can be learned.

B4 - Vita Tempus

Second Chance Watches will take the blow when about to die, if in your inventory. They become haywire afterwards, needing a repair. (When about to hit 80 Years you'll instead rejuvenate 4 Years and the Second Chance Watch in question will become completely unusable, until you repair it with your Clockmaker's Tools. Repairing it will put it on a 16 Minute Cooldown. Watches on a cooldown will not function for this, and after being revived this way every other Second Chance Watch will be put on it's cooldown state)

 

C1 - Night Time I

Night Armors protect every 3rd hit you've taken, making you more vulnerable for a short time afterwards. (Night Armors will have a Shield that activates every 3rd hit, with a cooldown of 15 seconds. When on cooldown, every Night Armor in your inventory will have their Protection reduced to 85%, from 95%)

C2 - Night Time II

Shadow Equipment will degrade slower the Older you are. (+27.6% Durability when Old and +12.3% Durability when Middle-Aged)

L3 - Lock

Locked: Learn 9 Watch skills to unlock.

D - Umbra Horologium

Fueling the Alarming Clock with Pure Horror will Horrify it, creating Nightmare Boils on hit.

Damaging it enough will pop it, creating a big planar burst. Also affects something else...

(Nightmare Boils pop after a Damage Treshold has been met, it being 475.5. Other players can contribute to it by damaging the target with Shadow Weapons. After popping, it will deal 81.6 Damage + 80 Planar Damage in a 1.5 Tile Radius, while also fearing enemies. A Horrified Alarming Clock stays Horrified until emptied, at which point you'll need to Horrify it again. Refueling it normally while Horrified still keeps it in that state.

The Alarming Clock will enter a "Cooldown" state for 10 seconds, where you can only form a Nightmare Boil after it has refreshed.

The Winding Moondial will have an alternate effect if a certain skill is learned.)

E - Paradoxum Obscurum

Using the Backstep Watch while wearing any Shadow Armor will create a Dark Paradox on your previous location.

Dark Paradoxes try to garner the enemies' attention and will damage them along with the original Wanda.

(Only one Shadow Decoy can exist per Wanda. They last 12 seconds, have 75 Health and can completely block damage 2 times.

While active they draw enemy aggro and attack what Wanda is currently attacking, it has a range of 1.5 Tiles and deals 40 Planar Damage. Shadow Decoys have a very strong Aggro and for most mobs, attacking them while they are distracted will not draw aggro to Wanda, but being hit at any moment instantly destroys it.

Creating a Shadow Decoy will add 27 seconds to the Backstep Watch cooldown, if the decoy dies or is destroyed, 11 seconds get removed from the cooldown immediately)

Clocksmithy Branch

Spoiler

L1 - Lock

Locked: Use any Backtrek or Rift Watches 2 times in the span of 30 seconds to unlock.

A - Clock Crafting

Use your Tools to make the Grandfather Clock, a useful storage solution and handy time teller. (Made with 3 Living Logs, 1 Time Piece, 7 Nightmare Fuel and the Clockmaker's Tools (Not consumed). 2 Storage Slots. Is a placeable structure like Wickerbottom's Bookshelf and gives Shadow Manipulator Knowledge)

Watches stored in it refresh a lot faster, and it will play a warning bell when something is about to happen. (Watches stored in it refresh 66% faster while no combat is happening around it. It will play it's bells half a day before a Hound Wave/Worm Wave | Hail/Acid Rain | Boss Spawn/Antlion Sinkhole happens)

L2 - Lock

Locked: Have 5 different Watches in your inventory to unlock.

B1 - Storage Hairdo I

Store a Watch in your messy hair. (Beard Hair Storage but Wanda :) )

B2 - Storage Hairdo II

Store 2 Watches in your messy hair. (Same thing but 2)

L3 - Lock

Locked: Hammer 12 Giant Crops and complete the Moon Stone Event to unlock.

C1 - Wand Crafting

Use your Tools to make the Aging Staff for speeding things up.

(Made with 4 Time Pieces, a Walking Cane, 12 Moon Glass and the Clockmaker's Tools (Not consumed) at an Upgraded Celestial Orb or the Lunar Altars. 6 Durability, Cannot Break. Only refuelable at a Moon Stone during either a New Moon or a Full Moon)

 Outsmart your captors by using Lunar Magic to make things in a radius age almost instantly, by using your precious sanity and time.

(Using it with right click while holding it in hand will drain 12 Years and 33 Sanity to instantly advance things by one stage in a 1.2 Tile Radius around where you clicked. Be it farm crops, trees, crock pots or food. +25% Speed Boost while holding it)

C2 - Wand Durability

Aging Staff durability increased twofold.

Aging effect gets stronger with the Moon Cycle.

(Aging Staff now has 12 Durability, and it's radius gets increased by 0.1 Tiles each day closer to a Full Moon, and decreases by 0.125 each day further away, until a New Moon, at which point it starts increasing again the day after)

Ancients Branch

Spoiler

L1 - Lock

Locked: Find and explore the Ancient Ruins.

A - Technica Umbrae

...A vision forms in your thoughts. Craft Thulecite more efficiently. (Thulecite recipe changed to 5 Thulecite Fragments from 6)

B1 - Technologia Antiqua

...A voice echoes in your thoughts. Use your Tools to dissasemble Thulecite. (Using the Clockmaker's Tools on Thulecite will result in 4 Thulecite Fragments)

B2 - Obedientia Obscurum

...Shadows consume your thoughts. Nightmares that crawl out of Fissures or Night Lights are no longer aggressive, if at a high enough Sanity. Just keep your distance. (Nightmarebeaks and Crawling Nightmares no longer attack Wandas with this skill learned, if they are above 80% Sanity. Being too close to them for over 5 seconds will turn them aggressive)

L2 - Lock

Locked: Learn 1 Clocksmithy skill to unlock.

C - Antiquorum Umbrae

...Your thoughts are intercepted by something. Learn another way to craft Thulecite, at a heavy cost.

(Craft 1 Thulecite with 6 Nightmare Fuel, 66 Temporary Max Sanity and 6 Years. Temporary Max Sanity will go away at half the rate of your current Sanity Aura value. E.G.: You're hugging a Dwarf Star, that has +25 Sanity/Min. That means you'll recover +12.5 Max Sanity/Min)

Affinity Branch

Spoiler

L - Affinity Skill Lock

Learn at least 10 skills to unlock.

Shadow Mediator I

The Queen will reward your loyalty by strenghtening your elderly years.

Add a flat +1.5 Planar Defense to Shadow Armor. When Elderly, add a flat +2 Planar Defense instead. (Each piece of Shadow Armors gain an innate +2.5 Planar Defense Bonus, +3 is Old)

Shadow Mediator II

The Queen will reward your loyalty by strenghtening your elderly years.

Add a flat +10 Planar Damage to Planar Shadow Weapons. When Eldery, add a flat +25 Planar Damage instead. (Shadow Weapons gain an innate +10 Planar Damage Bonus)

Shadow Mediator III

The Queen will reward your loyalty by strenghtening your elderly years.

The Age Treshold to being Elderly is decreased, and it's penalties are lessened. The Alarming Clock will deal Planar Damage to Planar Entities.

(Weapon Damage Reduction is 10% instead of 50%, Work Efficiency becomes normal instead of 0.75 and Crafting Speed reduced to 1.05 seconds from 1.2.

Old Age Treshold decreased to 63, from 65.

The Alarming Clock will deal 61.8 Base Damage + 20 Planar Damage to Planar Entities ONLY, otherwise it deal normal damage)

Lunar Two-Timer

The Cryptic Founder will reward your curiosity by empowering your youth. Just relegate your Shadow Powers, that's all.

The Age Treshold to being Youthful is decreased, and being Young will empower any Lunar Equipment at the cost of your well-being. Upgrade some previously Shadow Equipment to be Lunar through a Moon Stone. Being Middle-Aged or Elderly has decreased benefits.

(Being Young now makes you take a flat +1.1 Age from any direct damage taken, and you also gain an innate +5 Planar Defense from Lunar Armors. (E.G.: Don't get hit by multiple frogs if you value your youth)

Young Age Treshold decreased to 33, from 35

Being Middle-Aged or Old makes you take a flat +4.2 Age from any direct damage taken.

Middle-Aged Shadow Damage Multiplier converted to Lunar Damage Multiplier, and decreased to 10%, Old Shadow Damage Multipler reduced to 33.3%% from 75%. Being Old also gives a 10% Speed Penalty.

Lunar Weapons such as Glass Cutters and Brightshade Weapons get a +60% Base Damage Bonus. Planar Lunar Weapons such as the Brightshade Sword and the Winding Moondial gain a flat +25 Planar Damage.

Lunar Armors and W.A.R.B.I.S passively increase your Sanity by 3.66/min a piece.

Brightshade Staff Bounces increased by 1.

Alarming Clocks, when placed on a Moon Stone will now start the Moon Stone Event. When completed, the Alarming Clock will be upgraded into the Winding Moondial. Base Damage is 71.5, has 108 Durability and is considered a Planar Lunar Weapon, just without Planar Damage. Refuelable with Gems for 66% Durability and affected by the Brightshade Helm bonus. Unfueled Damage is 42.5, but is no longer a Lunar Weapon in that state.

If the Umbra Horologium skill has been learned, instead of a Nightmare Boil forming after hitting a target with the Winding Moondial, after every 4th consecutive hit an Enlightened Crystal will form on top of the target, slowing them down and giving a 15% Damage Vulnerability on it. Any source of damage will deal 15% more Damage while it is active. Lasts for 10 seconds.

Thulecite Clubs will start a weaker version of the Moon Stone Event. When completed, the Thulecite Club will turn into a Moonstone Mace. Base Damage is 42.5, has 220 Durability and is considired a Lunar Weapon. If above 66% Sanity this weapon has a 40% chance each hit to summon a Enlightened Crown Gestalt.

Dark Swords, Night Armors will be immediately converted into Glass Cutters and Night Armors will be deconstructed and converted into Lunar Materials.

Void Equipment when placed on a Moon Stone will be immediately deconstructed, and spawn 2 Greater Gestalts that are very angry at you)

so, what do you guys think? i'm open to any ideas or changes to it

[grm9]

14 minutes ago, fabin said:

 

  Hide contents

 

  Hide contents

 

  Hide contents

Thulecite recipe changed to 6 Thulecite Fragments from 8

  Hide contents

 

it already is 6 fragments per thule

[fabin]

1 minute ago, grm9 said:

it already is 6 fragments per thule

oops. thanks for that

[RainBO_OM]

interesting lunar affinity idea, especially like trading shadow stuff to moon! What would Winding Moondial probably be repaired with? Lightmare fuel?

[Dr.Webber]

I think Wanda should have an attack  where she used the shadow hand attached to her like a clock hand 

[Yuuko]

Dear god no.  This sounds horrible.  Its probably exactly what Klei will do.

 

Gonna tack on this edit to try and be constructive, both to respond to your idea with what I think is good / bad about it, and what I think the Wanda tree should look like.

Shaving Seconds - her watches already have very low cd.  These are completely unnecessary UNLESS you nerf her watches and this just restores current cd's.  If you do the nerf / restore method then the nerf and restore would match, no reason to change it based on age.  Just give her watches +20% current cds and back them off -10% each skill point.

Duplex Tempus - increasing the restore from the watch is actually bad b/c you need some cushion between when you are old and when you can restore time without losing old.  The current balance is a well thought out sweet spot.

Slow Flow - would be impossible.  Time cannot effect one player differently then another so the entire world would receive this slow pretty much constantly.  It would not take much to make this a permanent effect making everyone extremely OP.

Vita Tempus - this is about Wanda's only weakness and skill check.  We really cannot take this away.

Night Time - come on.  Night armor is already 95% protection, but now we make it into ghetto bone armor too?  And bone armor becomes SUPER bone armor?  Very OP.

Grandfather Clock - I'm getting really sick of these inventory perks.  We don't need them, at least not how they're done.  Wig should be able to just commit the scrolls to memory and use a wheel like Max / Willow rather than needing to sort through this thing...  Stop adding containers, its boring and only removes player choices b/c they can then choose everything.

Obedientia Obscurum - I already end up with stacks and stacks of unused nm fuel, and I use Magi as my primary light source.  She does not need more nm fuel, no one does.

Antiquorum Umbrae - Nah, too op for early game.  You would just craft clock maker tools and this and never need to actually adventure and obtain thul.  Your OP decon skill is plenty strong allowing thul to be easier to decon into crumbs for her clocks.

Shadow Mediator - again she has a great balance for her age, no reason to meddle with this.  She's already OP, we really don't need to make her moreso.

Lunar Two-Timer - come on, you really want to make her into a tank instead of glass cannon?  This is way too OP giving her power for being young.  If anything she needs nerfs to her young state like even lower damage from alarming clock and maybe a sanity tax on using watches.

 

The skill trees are really going to suck if we get to these OP characters and they just get more on top of their already loaded kit.  Wanda, Maxwell, Wicker, and some others need nerfs with their skill trees or we're just gonna get power crept even more...

tbh I'm not sure what a skill tree for her should look like, but she is so far from needing one that I think plenty would be fine if she just never got one lol

[_zwb]

Wanda doesn't need a skill tree, she's not underpowered or flawed.

[fabin]

56 minutes ago, Yuuko said:

Slow Flow - would be impossible.  Time cannot effect one player differently then another so the entire world would receive this slow pretty much constantly.  It would not take much to make this a permanent effect making everyone extremely OP.

no no, i meant the time thingy that happens when you get hit, or just the general aging that happens over time. probly shoulda worded that better

59 minutes ago, Yuuko said:

Night Time - come on.  Night armor is already 95% protection, but now we make it into ghetto bone armor too?  And bone armor becomes SUPER bone armor?  Very OP.

didn't think of that, oops

i really don't disagree with anything you said really. wanda's already a speeding truck in terms of power, but since she's getting a skill tree regardless of what happens might as well make them interesting. oh well

[Yuuko]

3 minutes ago, fabin said:

but since she's getting a skill tree regardless of what happens might as well make them interesting. oh well

Yeah, I really hope Klei is wiling to bring out that nerf bat or I don't think things will stay interesting :\ 

[grm9]

6 minutes ago, Yuuko said:

Yeah, I really hope Klei is wiling to bring out that nerf bat or I don't think things will stay interesting :\ 

there's no need to nerf wanda, just add a late-game item that works the same way her teleportation clocks do but can be used by everyone  

[Yuuko]

4 minutes ago, grm9 said:

there's no need to nerf wanda, just add a late-game item that works the same way her teleportation clocks do but can be used by everyone  

No, I think teleportation is a fine personal perk - especially because she can use it in groups for a purple gem.  I think this is fine, there are ways others can teleport around if they want.  They require more, but it is her personal perk.  I miss her teleport watches playing Willow, but it is not a serious down side to not have them lol.

Pre-planar she probably needed nerfs to make her more glass.  Post-planar she needs buffs, but in a way that only effect post-planar b/c that hit her toooooo hard.  She is in an awkward state right now.  She doesn't need new things to do, so she is more like Wolfgang than Willow or even Woodie.

[grm9]

2 minutes ago, Yuuko said:

No, I think teleportation is a fine personal perk - especially because she can use it in groups for a purple gem.  I think this is fine, there are ways others can teleport around if they want.  They require more, but it is her personal perk.  I miss her teleport watches playing Willow, but it is not a serious down side to not have them lol

the only way for solo is telelocation focuses which no one uses because they're too expensive and don't work in caves so there needs to be an alternative

2 minutes ago, Yuuko said:

Pre-planar she probably needed nerfs to make her more glass

probably only with buffs to compensate that tbh, since in that case she'd be wolfgang that can't tank and can't use ham bat and can't not make shadow manipulator and can't use glass cutters, with the only compensation being teleportation   

[Yuuko]

45 minutes ago, grm9 said:

the only way for solo is telelocation focuses which no one uses because they're too expensive and don't work in caves so there needs to be an alternative

probably only with buffs to compensate that tbh, since in that case she'd be wolfgang that can't tank and can't use ham bat and can't not make shadow manipulator and can't use glass cutters, with the only compensation being teleportation   

She is supposed to be Wolfgang that can't tank, and she has the whip which is just too good while young.  It should get like axe damage when young, and cane damage when unfueled.  She needs no buffs to her damage, but definitely needs a hit to being too tanky pre-planar.

No one needs teleporting so I don't care that it is expensive.  Its her niche.  Also if you set up varg farms then telelocating is not expensive.

[grm9]

5 minutes ago, Yuuko said:

No one needs teleporting so I don't care that it is expensive

there's no fun in having to spend a few minutes holding a movement key, considering there's nothing that can stop you after you get to late game, don't need to interact with nightmares because bone helm and don't need to interact with boating because docks and boat bridges

9 minutes ago, Yuuko said:

Also if you set up varg farms then telelocating is not expensive

that's much later than the start of late game and still doesn't work in caves and you can't choose which one to go to 

10 minutes ago, Yuuko said:

She is supposed to be Wolfgang that can't tank

what's the point then? Why not just play wolfgang instead if you think that no one needs teleportation?

[Jakepeng99]

Too Op. Alot of the upsides need to come at an actual price rather than be straight up buffs (like needing resources, or neing side grades. E.g buffing watches temporarly with nightmare fuel for their buffs, refueling the alarming clock with purehorror for the boils)

However, the ideas at the core are nice balance aside.

8 hours ago, fabin said:

A vision forms in your thoughts. Craft Thulecite more efficiently. (Thulecite recipe changed to 5 Thulecite Fragments from 6)

Also this is infinite dupe with thuli walls. Needs to be reworked.

[fabin]

2 hours ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Also this is infinite dupe with thuli walls. Needs to be reworked.

wouldn't it be a very, very, very slow and inefficient dupe though? iirc player built walls when hammered only return 1 fragment

[Kubicska]

14 hours ago, fabin said:

B1 - Storage Hairdo I

Store a Watch in your messy hair. (Beard Hair Storage but Wanda :) )

I love this, although I originally wanted her to get a little “waist of time” (get it? it’s “waste”) to store her watches on or something and maybe just straight up give her the ability to stop time (lol)

 

[Antynomity]

I really like the skill names you came up with, definitely better than what Klei comes up with in their skill trees, other than that this is really just... unnecessarily good, she already IS good.

[00petar00]

Storage for clocks that is like backpack but works from your inventory and is always open. This is impossible currently as we can see from bearger bin so it should either be like this or not be added at all.

She needs some damage buffs to alarming clock after rifts are activated, I want to use her clock as it is a big reason to play her and making it a bad weapon after rifts are activated takes away from her as a character.

It feels really tiresome to have to constantly manage her age when I want to be permanently old, I would love a perk that adds buttons like Willow/Maxwell have to turn on and off age lock to 65 so that no matter how many ageless watches I activate it won't go below that age.

What would be my favorite addition is a perk that stops her passively aging, this is the most annoying thing to have to deal with when playing her and it doesn't really make her much stronger except in the early game but it isn't difficult to make your second ageless watch.

[grm9]

38 minutes ago, 00petar00 said:

This is impossible currently

there's wilson's beard, although that's hardly a container but idk how would you have multiple containers always open if you have multiple watch storages 

[_zwb]

44 minutes ago, 00petar00 said:

This is impossible currently as we can see from bearger bin so it should either be like this or not be added at all.

It is actually possible if they change how opening container works, it could be changed that containers like bearger bin only drops when opened from a chest/scale chest, and closes other container of the same type.

[00petar00]

31 minutes ago, grm9 said:

there's wilson's beard, although that's hardly a container but idk how would you have multiple containers always open if you have multiple watch storages 

25 minutes ago, _zwb said:

It is actually possible if they change how opening container works, it could be changed that containers like bearger bin only drops when opened from a chest/scale chest, and closes other container of the same type.

That could work as long as it can have more slots (6?), also bearger bin should be changed to be like that too. In case someone has both bearger bin and this Wanda clock storage it is just the UI coordinates on screen that need to be changed? Doesn't sound too difficult but it may take too much of the screen in that case we might need UI inventory scaling options.

[Jakepeng99]

22 hours ago, fabin said:

wouldn't it be a very, very, very slow and inefficient dupe though? iirc player built walls when hammered only return 1 fragment

Only way to renew thulicite is defeating fuelweaver or using moths so people will definitely use it.

[grm9]

8 minutes ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Only way to renew thulicite is defeating fuelweaver or using moths so people will definitely use it.

one thulecite chunk per minute or so would definitely not be worth it and thulecite is inferior to rift stuff 

[fabin]

2 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

I would love a perk that adds buttons like Willow/Maxwell have to turn on and off age lock to 65 so that no matter how many ageless watches I activate it won't go below that age.

very nice idea, i reworked slow flow III into that, although i left out the complete age lock thing, it feels way too good being able to have so much control over your age