Skill Not-So Spotlight: Wilson

[Mortalbane]

I'm all for Wilson to get the equal share of the usefulness/uniqueness/skilltree pie.
He was "default" in the singleplayer game, now he has to be unique and fun just like others.
I like that Klei added some alchemy for him, but torch branch... ouch.

Those who would like to expand Wilson's kit, check out my ideas for him:

 

[glooomy]

Interview with Kevin Forbes by Jenesee Grey: (5:58)

"Wilson is a gentleman scientist, which was an actual thing back when. He's a person of independent means who has decided to apply his intellect, such as it is, to science. He's not actually a very good scientist. He's overconfident, a little brash. He's got a can-do attitude, but he can't actually follow up on a lot of things." 

[Creatorofswamps]

10 minutes ago, Antynomity said:

Gem transmutation helps with skipping deconstructing a moon caller staff because you can just craft an opal to socket into the 3rd altar in The Archive biome.

His Icky Transmutation helps spread food more thin meaning you don't have to set up nearly as much meat production or even get as much meat as you can split 1 big meat into 2 morsels to cook more dishes that don't need big meat worth of meat value (or if you need just a bit more meat value so you don't have to waste any).

Beard storage comes with the advantage of 3 more slots strictly for food which is good and they also don't get detected by bunnymen (amazing for those who use them as they don't need to keep their meat dishes in chester or a bundle to keep on them.

when they talk about changing his skill tree, no one asks to change alchemy (maybe change the crafting gems a little) and wearing food in the beard, these are certainly good skills, when it comes to his skill tree, they say that the branches of the beard and torch take 6 points to get a reward in the form of a perk of food in the beard and 6 for throwing a torch, you know, 12 points to get a "reward" from wormwood, for example, for 3 points we get 2 awards, and Woodie gets 1 award for 3 points (but we spend these 3 points on something interesting like a xp moose and not just increased statistics), so people pig changes. for example, to impoverish the branches of torches, so that out of 6 points and 1 reward, we get 1 reward for 3 points (or 2 like wormwood) I wrote about it here:

 

(the translator may be a little stupid, I hope you understand what I mean)

[Ulisesvolador]

5 minutes ago, glooomy said:

Also I think people have forgotten that Wilson is a wanna-be scientist. He is ironically and comedically horrible at it.

Except, he's not. He created the Think Tank and other things, and there's quotes and descriptions that say Wilson is actually doing science stuff and not failing at it.

 

7 minutes ago, glooomy said:

There is a massive community out there, outside of the forums, and a lot of us (especially veteran players) were not expecting him to get any buffs for his rework.

We can argue there wasn't even a rework as every character will have a Skill Tree.

 

8 minutes ago, glooomy said:

As I was saying though, perks outside of the Skill Tree do not make sense for a character who is suppose to be the baseline character. 

Baseline for what, just stats?, What I mean with that is that Wilson is only the baseline for balancing the stats of other characters following the 150, 150, 150 as the "default stats".

 

13 minutes ago, glooomy said:

Any real pro will have to come with a real con and if they did this there would be absolutely no character left to choose for those who want (as close to a vanilla experience) as possible. 

DST is a game about multiplayer cooperation, the true vanilla experience of DST is playing with people and using different characters. Before the skill tree Wilson had nothing that could help the team (maybe beard hair) and it was a boring character, like there's no many Wilson mains, most of the people that play Wilson are new people and people that wants a """vanilla""" experience. 

[Creatorofswamps]

26 minutes ago, Antynomity said:

Though, I do wish he actually got a rework, there is no need for a 'vanilla character' in DST as you're not forced to play as him when you start unlike in DS. But I guess we'll see if he ever gets something... grand.

good words

7 minutes ago, glooomy said:

Interview with Kevin Forbes by Jenesee Grey: (5:58)

"Wilson is a gentleman scientist, which was an actual thing back when. He's a person of independent means who has decided to apply his intellect, such as it is, to science. He's not actually a very good scientist. He's overconfident, a little brash. He's got a can-do attitude, but he can't actually follow up on a lot of things." 

this does not negate the words that he invented a lot of interesting things in the constant and that he received knowledge from Maxwell and if he were so incompetent he would not be able to engage in alchemy

[Ulisesvolador]

6 minutes ago, glooomy said:

Interview with Kevin Forbes by Jenesee Grey: (5:58)

"Wilson is a gentleman scientist, which was an actual thing back when. He's a person of independent means who has decided to apply his intellect, such as it is, to science. He's not actually a very good scientist. He's overconfident, a little brash. He's got a can-do attitude, but he can't actually follow up on a lot of things." 

This interview is 10 years old, many opinions and views have changed since then (like no multiplayer DS).

[Antynomity]

6 minutes ago, Creatorofswamps said:

snip

Forgot to mention beard, yeah, I did say that the skill tree fails in the torch tree (it's way too shallow for it to be useful through out the game like alchemy, beard storage or affinities) the torch tree should be changed into a tree that encompasses all light and temperature sources, making them have more range when wilson adds fuel to them, and making them more intense with heat / cold when he also adds fuel to them, wilson could fuel light sources for teammates and as long as the campfires dont run out of fuel or in case of portable sources, until it doesnt get fueled by a non-wilson with those skills (so he doesnt have more swappability like he does with some transmutations) which would make him save fuel for himself and his teammates in the short and long run.

Beard skills deserve to be more interesting and useful, an assortment of crafts related to different seasons and weathers tied to an entry skill and then ones that empower those crafts to make them more potent should replace the flat winter insulation skills that you get right now.

As examples, you'd get crafts that increase insulation til death or next shave for winter, crafts that do the same for summer, crafts that add some water proofness to your beard, for more interesting ones we could get ones that add some normal or planar defense respectively to your beard (I just like the idea of your beard protecting you from damage, let's say 5% normal armour defense per stage and for the planar one you'd get 1, 3 and 5 planar defense respectively each stage.

Those are all the ideas I could come up with on a whim for the beard and the torch replacement I believe I have suggested something similar back in the wilson refresh beta in the forums.

Oh yeah, also, please bring back the old idle animation for the non-bearded wilson at least! It was so good!

[Ardcrumb]

33 minutes ago, glooomy said:

Interview with Kevin Forbes by Jenesee Grey: (5:58)

"Wilson is a gentleman scientist, which was an actual thing back when. He's a person of independent means who has decided to apply his intellect, such as it is, to science. He's not actually a very good scientist. He's overconfident, a little brash. He's got a can-do attitude, but he can't actually follow up on a lot of things." 

nope, here's only two examples and there are more.

[glooomy]

-sigh-

I never called Wilson incompetent. If you aren’t understanding what I am saying, it is alright to ask for reiteration but please do not twist my words into something else. I am not arguing or attacking anyone, if that is what you came here to do— I ask you to please leave. 

I can see that Wilson has clearly evolved through his time in the constant, like the others, and is the reason/explanation we are given as to how we are able to have these items in game. The reason none of Wilson’s inventions in the constant are character exclusive is obvious; because it would lock literally everyone out of content, making him the only character people would be able to play to actually use. 

Thank you to those who gave constructive feedback with no angst. My original post here was driven by how upsetting it is to me— what this community has turned into. I feel like nothing can be civilly discussed anymore and I see/understand why a lot of complaints get ignored by Klei. 

It is not what this post was originally about but I am very opened to hearing what other’s ideas on what should be “fixed” or added to Wilson and his Skill Tree, but “he needs more reee!” is not helpful. I think it would be productive to discuss and finding a happy medium is important. 

[mkemal23]

12 minutes ago, Ardcrumb said:

nope, here's only two examples and there are more.

He's also the creator of Gardeneer Hat!

Spoiler

"I've finally perfected my design for an ingenious (if I do say so myself) device that stores important garden-based knowledge. Certain naysayers might point out that it looks like nothing more than an overturned flowerpot worn on the head... some people simply don't have an eye for science.\" -W"

Not only that but it's confirmed that Wilson is taking inspiration from Wagstaff's creations!

Spoiler

 

[Creatorofswamps]

39 minutes ago, Antynomity said:

Forgot to mention beard, yeah, I did say that the skill tree fails in the torch tree (it's way too shallow for it to be useful through out the game like alchemy, beard storage or affinities) the torch tree should be changed into a tree that encompasses all light and temperature sources, making them have more range when wilson adds fuel to them, and making them more intense with heat / cold when he also adds fuel to them, wilson could fuel light sources for teammates and as long as the campfires dont run out of fuel or in case of portable sources, until it doesnt get fueled by a non-wilson with those skills (so he doesnt have more swappability like he does with some transmutations) which would make him save fuel for himself and his teammates in the short and long run.

Beard skills deserve to be more interesting and useful, an assortment of crafts related to different seasons and weathers tied to an entry skill and then ones that empower those crafts to make them more potent should replace the flat winter insulation skills that you get right now.

As examples, you'd get crafts that increase insulation til death or next shave for winter, crafts that do the same for summer, crafts that add some water proofness to your beard, for more interesting ones we could get ones that add some normal or planar defense respectively to your beard (I just like the idea of your beard protecting you from damage, let's say 5% normal armour defense per stage and for the planar one you'd get 1, 3 and 5 planar defense respectively each stage.

Those are all the ideas I could come up with on a whim for the beard and the torch replacement I believe I have suggested something similar back in the wilson refresh beta in the forums.

Oh yeah, also, please bring back the old idle animation for the non-bearded wilson at least! It was so good!

in fact, the community has already come up with so many interesting ideas to improve the Wilson tree. and most importantly, it does not break the balance and does not make wolfgang out of him, just interesting mechanics and things that emphasize the character

[Ridepod]

19 minutes ago, glooomy said:

I never called Wilson incompetent. If you aren’t understanding what I am saying, it is alright to ask for reiteration but please do not twist my words into something else.

Your Kevin Forbes quote basically calls Wilson incompetent. I don't really think people are twisting your words.

incompetent: not having or showing the necessary skills to do something successfully (pulled from google)

1 hour ago, glooomy said:

He's got a can-do attitude, but he can't actually follow up on a lot of things." 

 

What are you saying, then?

[mkemal23]

33 minutes ago, glooomy said:

Thank you to those who gave constructive feedback with no angst. My original post here was driven by how upsetting it is to me— what this community has turned into. I feel like nothing can be civilly discussed anymore and I see/understand why a lot of complaints get ignored by Klei. 

This community was always like this. When Wolfgang rework happened it was the same. When Rwys update happened it was the same. When Walter was announced, it was the same. Nothing changed. It's actually funny because Wilson is probably the only character that you can discuss without turning whole forums into a Warfare. One thread is nothing compared to what happened with other characters.

33 minutes ago, glooomy said:

It is not what this post was originally about but I am very opened to hearing what other’s ideas on what should be “fixed” or added to Wilson and his Skill Tree, but “he needs more reee!” is not helpful. I think it would be productive to discuss and finding a happy medium is important. 

Again, show me one time that Wilson players went “he needs more reee!” mode. If anything, Wilson players are trying their best to show klei that his torch skill tree is a missed opportunity and can be better.

Also, If you want to have a productive and helpful discussion, Maybe don't start your thread with words like this:

Spoiler

Spoiler

I play Wormwood for farming, so He's perfect for me! Please klei, don't change his skill tree. If anyone want's a bramble armor perk, They can go play Wx78 with Electrification Circuit!

Please leave our beloved Farmer alone !

Haha.

 

[glooomy]

16 minutes ago, Ridepod said:

Your Kevin Forbes quote basically calls Wilson incompetent

incompetent: not having or showing the necessary skills to do something successfully (pulled from google)

 

What are you saying, then?

That is Kevin Forbe’s quote about his OC Wilson. Canon Wilson wasn’t suppose to be a good scientist and our given lore on the reason he ends up in the Constant in the first place is because he needed help and desired knowledge— Which Maxwell tempts him with and tricks him into creating the portal. 

Each character ends up in the constant because they desire something they cannot have in the real world, and upon entering having skills they might not have ever had. If Wilson’s skills in the constant are now successful inventions, then arguably a huge chunk of, if not every single craftable item from the crafting stations are Wilson’s inventions. Should they all be  exclusive to him…? I don’t think so.

My point was, again. I do not think Skill Trees should be exclusive to Wilson, which I see people complaining about. And that he should not have any other perks outside of what he gets from his Skill Tree.

 

6 minutes ago, mkemal23 said:

Again, show me one time that Wilson players went “he needs more reee!” mode.

I play DST every single day. These are the things I hear. I am not specifically talking about only people on the forums nor was I specifically talking about you, I am not sure why you are coming off as getting defensive and I am sorry if I some how offended you? I hope you realize there is a massive community out there that doesn’t even bother with this website.  

[Ardcrumb]

1 hour ago, mkemal23 said:

 

  Hide contents

I play Wormwood for farming, so He's perfect for me! Please klei, don't change his skill tree. If anyone want's a bramble armor perk, They can go play Wx78 with Electrification Circuit!

Please leave our beloved Farmer alone !

Haha.

 

Unironically my friend, he was actually quite happy with the base skill tree and he still likes it

1 hour ago, glooomy said:

 

I play DST every single day. These are the things I hear. I am not specifically talking about only people on the forums nor was I specifically talking about you, I am not sure why you are coming off as getting defensive and I am sorry if I some how offended you? I hope you realize there is a massive community out there that doesn’t even bother with this website.  

Burden of proof lies on you, show us examples.

[Creatorofswamps]

10 minutes ago, glooomy said:

Thank you to those who gave constructive feedback with no angst. My original post here was driven by how upsetting it is to me— what this community has turned into. I feel like nothing can be civilly discussed anymore and I see/understand why a lot of complaints get ignored by Klei. 

It is not what this post was originally about but I am very opened to hearing what other’s ideas on what should be “fixed” or added to Wilson and his Skill Tree, but “he needs more reee!” is not helpful. I think it would be productive to discuss and finding a happy medium is important. 

I want to say right away if my messages seem aggressive to you, then I apologize. the construction of speech is different in my native language, +the translator can change words to similar ones. I always try to treat people with respect.

look, the problem is that your post sounds something like this: "leave Wilson as he is with his unprocessed skill tree, and everyone who wants Wilson to have a good tree that stands on an equal footing with others, you are wrong" this will naturally cause a big discussion among his fans. the whole situation is made acute by the fact that when they say that the Wilson tree can be made much better, no attention is paid to it, and when they say that the Wormwood tree needs to be changed, then it is almost immediately changed.I'm not saying that someone is to blame for this situation, but you can see for yourself how it looksIf you just want to discuss it , then I understand. Everyone wants good things for their characters.

Я просто хочу немного справедливости для Уилсона.

With respect Creatorofswamps

[Popian]

Honestly the Fire Pump is a kind of a dud, and what makes his inventions work is game logic magic.

4 hours ago, glooomy said:

I think he should get something along the lines of the Mad Scientist Lab but with a comedic twist.

If people would want it, would it be too much to give him the Mad Scientist Lab and give him better brew speed/success rate? Only the courage one doesn't apply outside of Hallowed Nights, but that can be buffed to work on other kinds of sanity loss effects.

[glooomy]

2 hours ago, Creatorofswamps said:

I want to say right away if my messages seem aggressive to you, then I apologize. the construction of speech is different in my native language, +the translator can change words to similar ones. I always try to treat people with respect.

look, the problem is that your post sounds something like this: "leave Wilson as he is with his unprocessed skill tree, and everyone who wants Wilson to have a good tree that stands on an equal footing with others, you are wrong" this will naturally cause a big discussion among his fans. the whole situation is made acute by the fact that when they say that the Wilson tree can be made much better, no attention is paid to it, and when they say that the Wormwood tree needs to be changed, then it is almost immediately changed.I'm not saying that someone is to blame for this situation, but you can see for yourself how it looksIf you just want to discuss it , then I understand. Everyone wants good things for their characters.

Я просто хочу немного справедливости для Уилсона.

With respect Creatorofswamps

I am a Wilson fan too and the way you are saying "my post sounds" is nottt what I was saying at all. I had said multiple times what I was saying and it is still getting twisted even though I was being blatant. Again again again-- I was saying everyone should have a Skill Tree. Not just Wilson. As for whether or not Skill Trees need to be tweak, surely they do and surely they will. Я понимаю, друг. Hе волнуйся. Thank you for clearing this up. I will try to think of some alternatives/additions for Wilson's Skill Tree. With enough backing and agreement on well thought out / balanced ideas; it would be hard to ignore.

[Kofeman27]

Oh poor Wilson! While the rest of characters received interesting mechanics and items after their reworks, Wilson received in his rework... nothing. You say no, they added a skill tree to Wilson... so skill tree will be added to all characters.

Needless to say, Wilson's uniqueness lies in his non-uniqueness. This is not uniqueness. Wilson is unique as a scientist. Why couldn't this side of the character be revealed?

As for his skill tree, it's terrible! You will no longer use torches when you make yourself a helmet and a lantern. Beard... are you serious? You can spend the whole winter with one thermal stone. Go with only a beard and a hat, you'll still freeze. Store food in the beard... didn't you feel disgusting yourself after that? What kind of pervert would you have to be to come to this? It seems that Klei wants to show Wilson not as a SCIENTIST, but as a savage of some kind.

Наш Уилсон заслуживает лучшего!

[Bee PichiL]

46 minutes ago, Kofeman27 said:

Oh poor Wilson! While the rest of characters received interesting mechanics and items after their reworks, Wilson received in his rework... nothing. You say no, they added a skill tree to Wilson... so skill tree will be added to all characters.

Needless to say, Wilson's uniqueness lies in his non-uniqueness. This is not uniqueness. Wilson is unique as a scientist. Why couldn't this side of the character be revealed?

As for his skill tree, it's terrible! You will no longer use torches when you make yourself a helmet and a lantern. Beard... are you serious? You can spend the whole winter with one thermal stone. Go with only a beard and a hat, you'll still freeze. Store food in the beard... didn't you feel disgusting yourself after that? What kind of pervert would you have to be to come to this? It seems that Klei wants to show Wilson not as a SCIENTIST, but as a savage of some kind.

Наш Уилсон заслуживает лучшего!

Спасибо за поддержку <3

[Creatorofswamps]

On 7/29/2023 at 10:48 PM, glooomy said:

I am a Wilson fan too and the way you are saying "my post sounds" is nottt what I was saying at all. I had said multiple times what I was saying and it is still getting twisted even though I was being blatant. Again again again-- I was saying everyone should have a Skill Tree. Not just Wilson. As for whether or not Skill Trees need to be tweak, surely they do and surely they will. Я понимаю, друг. Hе волнуйся. Thank you for clearing this up. I will try to think of some alternatives/additions for Wilson's Skill Tree. With enough backing and agreement on well thought out / balanced ideas; it would be hard to ignore.