some disapointmends with wortox skill tree

[Crimson Hollow]

I agree with the soul pierce aggro thing, sure the soul pierce damaging everything in their way is kinda lore accurate and suits the "greedy" and "reckless" aspect of naughty Wortox, but at least they should not draw aggro when the mobs hit by the pierce is already fighting something else.

And for the shadow reaper thing, really it would make far more sense if he gets some special quotes from it rather than being called a mortal like everyone else.... 

Link to prev discussion: 

 

[IDreamerI]

4 hours ago, aidankocherhans said:

Why did you think the skill tree would eliminate the need to kill small creatures? The naughty skills make building up souls much more efficient, if that's still not enough why have you been playing wortox?

Perhaps some of the meaning of my sentence was lost when I translated into English, or you are not attentive.I meant that the skill tree wasn't interesting, not that it was supposed to solve the problem of not killing creatures.I've been playing the game for a very long time, and I want new sensations and interesting solutions from developers, not stupid stub tricks.And I still love playing for Wortox, it's just that sometimes people need breaks in something.

 

[Crimson Hollow]

3 hours ago, IDreamerI said:

Perhaps some of the meaning of my sentence was lost when I translated into English, or you are not attentive.I meant that the skill tree wasn't interesting, not that it was supposed to solve the problem of not killing creatures.I've been playing the game for a very long time, and I want new sensations and interesting solutions from developers, not stupid stub tricks.And I still love playing for Wortox, it's just that sometimes people need breaks in something.

 

look buddy, ik you are frustrated and all, but I don't really get what kind of "stupid stub tricks" you're referring to. If you are talking about Twintailed heart I'd agree with you to a certain extent, but otherwise it looks to me like your just giving out blanket insults out of desperation. 

What are you expecting to see in his tree?

[IDreamerI]

47 minutes ago, Crimson Hollow said:

look buddy, ik you are frustrated and all, but I don't really get what kind of "stupid stub tricks" you're referring to. If you are talking about Twintailed heart I'd agree with you to a certain extent, but otherwise it looks to me like your just giving out blanket insults out of desperation. 

What are you expecting to see in his tree?

Magical abilities similar to Willow or Maxwell.He's a magical being, not just a MAN.perhaps because of the English translation, my words look rude, but I'm not insulting anyone and I believe that everyone can have their own opinion about something. I'm just giving them my opinion, it's up to you to decide whether to agree with them or not.

[Crimson Hollow]

37 minutes ago, IDreamerI said:

Magical abilities similar to Willow or Maxwell.He's a magical being, not just a MAN.perhaps because of the English translation, my words look rude, but I'm not insulting anyone and I believe that everyone can have their own opinion about something. I'm just giving them my opinion, it's up to you to decide whether to agree with them or not.

Wasnt trying to stop you from having your opinion.

The idea of magical ability sounds cool to me, I have seen suggestions on giving him the ability to make soul infused weapons that has piercing aoe or planar dmg, or release souls to give him a shield that grants aoe healing when expired

[Echsrick]

i just wish the skill tree had not so many problems and in some way makes wortox weaker and worse in some ways, realy sad that most if not all of these things probably will never get fixed, meaning wortox got one of the weaker skill trees, and his base is very basic in the first place

[PunkShark]

I don't get the issues with the knabsack. firstly, it's cheap. 2 silk, 4 souls, 200 uses on either attacking or knabbing, second, AOE bugnet, and third, makes collecting easier after chopping lots of trees, rocks, whatever you name it. And that's at its basic values, even if it isn't a great weapon at this stage it is still a very useful tool for soul collecting bees or other things you would otherwise waste a slot of a bugnet on and or just conventional for not wasting time picking up a bunch of things. You can make lots of these things just by having a handful of silk. And with Covetous Collector, with up to 2 filled soul jars and some souls it is a better darksword, 68 dmg which is nothing to sneeze at, by also making your other offensive soul attacks better and giving a bigger stack of souls. The best weapon you will have until rifts, i don't see how this is a bad thing at all. There are so many +'s with this whole branch that i just can't see any negatives with it, except for maybe the inv slots which is fair and comes down to preference.

The only personal issue i have with it is how stiff the anim are and the visuals of the thing. But this is noted by Klei and hopefully should be fixed soon. I agree mobs getting hurt by souls should not necesarilly agro onto you since there are instances where this can definitely become an annoyance.

[Dingle]

1 hour ago, PunkShark said:

I don't get the issues with the knabsack. firstly, it's cheap. 2 silk, 4 souls, 200 uses on either attacking or knabbing, second, AOE bugnet, and third, makes collecting easier after chopping lots of trees, rocks, whatever you name it. And that's at its basic values, even if it isn't a great weapon at this stage it is still a very useful tool for soul collecting bees or other things you would otherwise waste a slot of a bugnet on and or just conventional for not wasting time picking up a bunch of things. You can make lots of these things just by having a handful of silk. And with Covetous Collector, with up to 2 filled soul jars and some souls it is a better darksword, 68 dmg which is nothing to sneeze at, by also making your other offensive soul attacks better and giving a bigger stack of souls. The best weapon you will have until rifts, i don't see how this is a bad thing at all. There are so many +'s with this whole branch that i just can't see any negatives with it, except for maybe the inv slots which is fair and comes down to preference.

The only personal issue i have with it is how stiff the anim are and the visuals of the thing. But this is noted by Klei and hopefully should be fixed soon. I agree mobs getting hurt by souls should not necesarilly agro onto you since there are instances where this can definitely become an annoyance.

I actually really like the knabsack now that it's a 20 use AOE bugnet.

I mostly use it for early game before getting jars. Like old classic Wortox soul hoarding bees in a ruins rush, but way better.

However, it seems to remain handy all game. It's making me think of killer bee strategies on bosses a lot. Being able to grab butterflies easy for Pearl and the base bee boxes. Catching bees for more bee boxes super easy. Occasionally grabbing multiple moongleams.

I don't use it as a weapon though, I don't even get covetous on Naughty builds.

Oh and I'm pretty sure they straight up completely buffed the durability cost on multigrab. I'm now actually using that a lot, too.

[GrapeVruit]

2 hours ago, PunkShark said:

I don't get the issues with the knabsack. firstly, it's cheap. 2 silk, 4 souls, 200 uses on either attacking or knabbing, second, AOE bugnet, and third, makes collecting easier after chopping lots of trees, rocks, whatever you name it. And that's at its basic values, even if it isn't a great weapon at this stage it is still a very useful tool for soul collecting bees or other things you would otherwise waste a slot of a bugnet on and or just conventional for not wasting time picking up a bunch of things. You can make lots of these things just by having a handful of silk. And with Covetous Collector, with up to 2 filled soul jars and some souls it is a better darksword, 68 dmg which is nothing to sneeze at, by also making your other offensive soul attacks better and giving a bigger stack of souls. The best weapon you will have until rifts, i don't see how this is a bad thing at all. There are so many +'s with this whole branch that i just can't see any negatives with it, except for maybe the inv slots which is fair and comes down to preference.

The only personal issue i have with it is how stiff the anim are and the visuals of the thing. But this is noted by Klei and hopefully should be fixed soon. I agree mobs getting hurt by souls should not necesarilly agro onto you since there are instances where this can definitely become an annoyance.

I didn't use it much as a weapon early game, with my gem and bottle rng being pretty poor, but currently, it's my weapon of choice. It's also great for collecting dropped mob loot, especially after killing monsters like shadow monkeys and spiders. Not to mention that because it's classified as a tool, if one breaks while you're fighting, it'll auto equip the next one in your inventory. Pretty minor, but saves having to manually equip it in battle.

[asdsaax]

11 hours ago, PunkShark said:

Covetous Collector

As a tool knabsack is really good, but it would be even better if it had a keybind for item knabbing, bcs it's impossible to use for sapling farms unless IDK about something

and as a weapon I don't use it for the same reason people don't bother with glasscutters and darkswords:

You can get job done with hambat that's always there with marginal damage down instead of gambling away your time

Also Wortox as a character encourages progressing asap because he can teleport with suspicious marbles so Knabsack as a weapon can potentially lose it's value very soon

against common mobs you have powerful spells and if time isn't important then why not just use actual dark swords and glasscutters for bosses?

also if you want to bring 100% out of Covetous Collector you will need affinities and majority of naughty perks which makes point budget so tight that you will have to sacrifice pleasant pastorale

and me sacrificing free food and passive soul generation for tiny bit of damage and wasted time? I will pass

Stuff does sound good on paper but it's simply not in practice... also CC losing value as soon as you bump into Lunar Island is embarassing

[Echsrick]

11 minutes ago, asdsaax said:

As a tool knabsack is really good, but it would be even better if it had a keybind for item knabbing, bcs it's impossible to use for sapling farms unless IDK about something

and as a weapon I don't use it for the same reason people don't bother with glasscutters and darkswords:

You can get job done with hambat that's always there with marginal damage down instead of gambling away your time

Also Wortox as a character encourages progressing asap because he can teleport with suspicious marbles so Knabsack as a weapon can potentially lose it's value very soon

against common mobs you have powerful spells and if time isn't important then why not just use actual dark swords and glasscutters for bosses?

also if you want to bring 100% out of Covetous Collector you will need affinities and majority of naughty perks which makes point budget so tight that you will have to sacrifice pleasant pastorale

and me sacrificing free food and passive soul generation for tiny bit of damage and wasted time? I will pass

Stuff does sound good on paper but it's simply not in practice... also CC losing value as soon as you bump into Lunar Island is embarassing

yea, collector is just such a waste of a point, i think i sould show what my skill set up is if that might be of interest

i get the feeling most players are goin to go with somewhat like this with maybe a point difference

[asdsaax]

2 hours ago, Echsrick said:

yea, collector is just such a waste of a point, i think i sould show what my skill set up is if that might be of interest

i get the feeling most players are goin to go with somewhat like this with maybe a point difference

Personally I go with Soul Pierce II instead of teleport discounts, because I find the weather pain aspect really useful
but it only shows with how valuable perks you have to pay for to "maybe utilize" Covetous Collector 

I still have PTSD from all the times I didn't get the second red gem from every grave in the world

I would be much happier with the perk if it either:
Commited to boosting Knabsack OR Soul Scaling

either make Wortox a decent hitter if he earns it with upgrades and intentionally slowing down
or support his soul magic into post rift if I have to pay with very good perks for it

EDIT for context:
Yes, I'm willing to sacrifice one scaling so another can deliver on it's premise properly
Personally I don't want *more* for Wortox  I just wish certain stuff worked differently while maintaining the power budget that Klei allowed

Though even just the comeback of Pure Horror upgrade would be awesome

[Joey9Baka]

I think the knapsack should enable his affinity skills too. Would give it the last boost it needs to be a cool personal weapon.

 

[WilsonHiggs]

16 hours ago, PunkShark said:

The only personal issue i have with it is how stiff the anim are and the visuals of the thing. But this is noted by Klei and hopefully should be fixed soon. I agree mobs getting hurt by souls should not necesarilly agro onto you since there are instances where this can definitely become an annoyance

That is my problem with it. Doesnt look like a weapon and more like the prototype of the soul jars that were changed to be a weapon that looks like storage 

It even gets filled by filling your inventory and increase the damage by the souls you are storing. Seems like the OG idea was to be a storage that gets higher damage depending of how full it is or if is storing regular items or souls

[Echsrick]

11 hours ago, asdsaax said:

Personally I go with Soul Pierce II instead of teleport discounts

how does your set up look like?

[asdsaax]

4 minutes ago, Echsrick said:

how does your set up look like?

Same as yours but Soul Pierce II over Capricious Movement

[Echsrick]

4 minutes ago, asdsaax said:

Same as yours but Soul Pierce II over Capricious Movement

wow, so it was pretty much the same pretty much

[Echsrick]

wortox dit got....ahm....half unique i guess is the right word? shadow weapon talk...the thing is its just replacing mortal with imp with the all the exact same rest of text as the others...meanwhile woodie gets his own personalized shadow weapon talk

[Echsrick]

i bump this simply because first of all
the knap sack move animation being a bit....to fast and too much in the face, litteraly
second
someone belives i dit not do a listing of what is wrong with the skill tree but i have