Wendy actually a bad glass cannon in boss combat and how to fix this

[YouKnowWho142]

1 minute ago, DVGMedia said:

Well that is just one yeah what was it you did? Did you make the preparations to ensure she doesn't? Would make sense right? But without wouldn't she struggle? 

Why are people so convinced that Abigail shouldn't require any level of micromanagement? She stayed alive since i swapped her elixirs frequently, used commands, and positioned her behind bosses. I'm really confused what you're trying to get at here, of course she would struggle if you didn't interact with her at all, and that's how it should be. She isn't just free damage, and the sisters should work together to be the strongest in a way that's interactive and engaging.

[DVGMedia]

3 minutes ago, YouKnowWho142 said:

Why are people so convinced that Abigail shouldn't require any level of micromanagement? She stayed alive since i swapped her elixirs frequently, used commands, and positioned her behind bosses. I'm really confused what you're trying to get at here, of course she would struggle if you didn't interact with her at all, and that's how it should be. She isn't just free damage, and the sisters should work together to be the strongest in a way that's interactive and engaging.

So you did things to make her stay alive like how any glass cannon should if a mistake is made she died and had to reset 

[YouKnowWho142]

Just now, DVGMedia said:

So you did things to make her stay alive like how any glass cannon should 

?????
Then every character is a glass cannon since every character needs to do things to stay alive in a fight. This is a nothing point

[DVGMedia]

Just now, YouKnowWho142 said:

?????
Then every character is a glass cannon since every character needs to do things to stay alive in a fight. This is a nothing point

Well no it's based on equipment some fare better with the type of equipment. 

[YouKnowWho142]

Just now, DVGMedia said:

Well no it's based on equipment some fare better with the type of equipment. 

I have no idea what you're trying to say. I feel like this point only works if you're tanking every boss with every character. Most characters nonetheless don't want to be hit, and if we are applying that logic where involvement in a fight makes you a glass cannon then kiting is inherently something that only a glass cannon does

[Crimson Hollow]

3 minutes ago, DVGMedia said:

Well no it's based on equipment some fare better with the type of equipment. 

What? Are you trying to say that Abigail is actually the glass cannon here?

[DVGMedia]

1 minute ago, Crimson Hollow said:

What? Are you trying to say that Abigail is actually the glass cannon here?

Yes that's what I've been saying 

[YouKnowWho142]

Just now, Crimson Hollow said:

What? Are you trying to say that Abigail is actually the glass cannon here?

that has been the claim, but Abigail is inherently tankier than other characters (More hp than maxwell with a football helmet, and way more hp than Wanda with most armor) who are much closer to glass cannons, and has much better healing potential to boot

[DVGMedia]

2 minutes ago, YouKnowWho142 said:

I have no idea what you're trying to say. I feel like this point only works if you're tanking every boss with every character. Most characters nonetheless don't want to be hit, and if we are applying that logic where involvement in a fight makes you a glass cannon then kiting is inherently something that only a glass cannon does

Well it's more that anyone can be a tank with the right equipment. 

 

Just now, YouKnowWho142 said:

that has been the claim, but Abigail is inherently tankier than other characters (More hp than maxwell with a football helmet, and way more hp than Wanda with most armor) who are much closer to glass cannons, and has much better healing potential to boot

Abby is more of a heal than conventional. Since her max HP would effectively be 300 on some bosses  but sisturn changes that  which honestly shouldn't really be that way 

[YouKnowWho142]

1 minute ago, DVGMedia said:

Abby is more of a heal than conventional. Since her max HP would effectively be 300 on some bosses  but sisturn changes that  which honestly shouldn't really be that way 

Trust me, I still really agree that Sisturn 3 should've been an elixir, but the player tag lets her tank double the damage which makes her uptime way longer against more problematic bosses. I have found some really strong applications for it in my boss run. I really don't want to argue this any longer, and I kinda might be in the middle of a     college lecture rn, but I really do think the most fair way to say it is that Abigail can be frail and has good attack, but is not a glass cannon outright as she does not fully lean into that aspect.

[DVGMedia]

2 minutes ago, YouKnowWho142 said:

Trust me, I still really agree that Sisturn 3 should've been an elixir, but the player tag lets her tank double the damage which makes her uptime way longer against more problematic bosses. I have found some really strong applications for it in my boss run. I really don't want to argue this any longer, and I kinda might be in the middle of a     college lecture rn, but I really do think the most fair way to say it is that Abigail can be frail and has good attack, but is not a glass cannon outright as she does not fully lean into that aspect.

It's important to take into account the metrics used because yes Abby has 600 hp but against majority of things she takes double damage so without the cistern she doesn't have that much shr only receives 600 hp when she gets the cistern so by all definitions she is a glass Cannon because even the lowest HP characters have at least 1500 or 750 HP using the right equipment while Abby only has at max 600 with okay Regen 

[reddocc]

glass cannon just like beefalo are glass cannon.

wake up Abigail wasn't supposed to take bosses on her own

[DVGMedia]

25 minutes ago, Pedro cc said:

glass cannon just like beefalo are glass cannon.

wake up Abigail wasn't supposed to take bosses on her own

Exactly 

 

Something funny actually was doing healing calculations. Cure all on default Abby heals the same as a player with marble armor which sounds good but this is only against normal damage  against bosses players do better since Abby gets nerfed healing 

[Echsrick]

if anyones a glass cannon it sould be more so be maxwell...given he actualy has less health but can do many damage with his shadows

[DVGMedia]

1 minute ago, Echsrick said:

if anyones a glass cannon it sould be more so be maxwell...given he actualy has less health but can do many damage with his shadows

That's the conventional idea of glass cannon but Abby and Wendy are on a new level of understanding 

[Echsrick]

24 minutes ago, DVGMedia said:

That's the conventional idea of glass cannon but Abby and Wendy are on a new level of understanding 

tell me, do you even know what a glass cannon even is?

[DVGMedia]

4 minutes ago, Echsrick said:

tell me, do you even know what a glass cannon even is?

Yeah and I've explained it on different posts above Wendy and Abby are a glass cannon to bosses specifically 

[Echsrick]

36 minutes ago, DVGMedia said:

Yeah and I've explained it on different posts above Wendy and Abby are a glass cannon to bosses specifically 

by that logic, if wendy is glass cannon, so is wilson, as both have the same health and durability

[DVGMedia]

12 minutes ago, Echsrick said:

by that logic, if wendy is glass cannon, so is wilson, as both have the same health and durability

Wendy isn't the glass cannon it's Abby that enables it and at then it's only against bosses

You are constantly relating back to most basic form of a glass cannon. That's why it's not making sense to you. 

 

They are two sides of a coin

Abby can tank a nearly infinite amount of damage from alot of attacks but is weak against strong single attacks 

 

Wendy is weak to lots of small hits just like any survivor thanks to hitstun.  But she fares much better against stronger hits. You see how this dynamic works only for Abby and Wendy and no other character? 

Not even willow because Bernie has more protection against stronger blows so Bernie on all levels is consistent as a tanky follower while Abby isn't 

[DVGMedia]

Imagine instead of Wendy being the playable character it was Abby. She had 600 hp and had a shield that protects her from multiple attacks but she couldn't wear armor  so instead she needed to use her follower to tank stronger damage for her even though she has 600 hp sh is still very fragile in Certain places making her be  a fragile character despite high HP.

[Bumber64]

2 hours ago, DVGMedia said:

That's the conventional idea of glass cannon but Abby and Wendy are on a new level of understanding 

Webber and his spiders are a glass cannon because he needs to prepare with nurse spiders.

Making up new definitions just obfuscates whatever point is being made.

[DVGMedia]

5 minutes ago, Bumber64 said:

Webber and his spiders are a glass cannon because he needs to prepare with nurse spiders.

Making up new definitions just obfuscates whatever point is being made.

I'm not creating a new definition of a glass cannon though andWebber is a heal tank

 

Even if you have low HP thanks to the mechanics in this game the player can be a tank. Both Wanda and Maxwell can achieve higher  tank than Abby can  do in turn that makes Abby glass 

[SilverSpoon]

3 minutes ago, Bumber64 said:

Webber and his spiders are a glass cannon because he needs to prepare with nurse spiders.

Isn't that actually the case? To cover that there is the "number of minions", "heal tank" in Webber's case.

[Bumber64]

10 minutes ago, DVGMedia said:

Webber is a heal tank 

If healing is armor, he's glass under the new understanding because he doesn't have it without bringing nurses.

[DVGMedia]

1 minute ago, Bumber64 said:

If healing is armor, he's glass under the new understanding because he doesn't have it without bringing nurses.

Okay then what is this new understanding of glass  because I feel you don't get it

Abbys healing with cure all is equal to a player with marble eating a jellybean and that's the base healing equivalency that's literally the best Abby can get 

Abby is equal to a player with 30 HP wearing marble  that gets bumped up to 60hp with sisturn