I don’t agree with the Sistern skills change

[WenericMember]

2 minutes ago, hyoton123 said:

 

And yeah, Wortox gets half food stat efficiency. All the characters who have dietary restrictions *should* have very good bonuses to make up for it. Wendy has a flaw which isn't even a flaw if abigail is dealing damage.

Anyway, I am kind of curious how much impact people are finding blessed sisturn 3 because aside from spectral cureall it seems like a noob trap. My understanding is that abigail would need bernie level HP and healing to stay alive which is, uh, not granted by that skill.

Theres post on the forum saying Abigail should be literally immortal. People actually want Wendy to be a character with  0 drawbacks.

I think the should reduce potion effectiveness and double the hp. Make it a mode for people who dont like using potions that still requires Abby to kite, but with sognificantly more margin for error.

[Xplan]

5 minutes ago, WenericMember said:

Make it a mode for people who dont like using potions that still requires Abby to kite, but with sognificantly more margin for error.

that would be a bad design.

[Steorra]

25 minutes ago, hyoton123 said:

-Okay, my solution to not deal with two lurking terrors and two terrorbeaks as any character is the same: Don't get in that situation. and for fighting them, you do the same thing as everyone else except willow: Kite and bop. But I can't say I have ever gotten in that problem because I am pretty cautious in the nightmare phase.

lol, If I were ask 1 lurking terror with 2 beak, you would say it's ez, if 2 with 2, you would say "that's your own business"

If I were ask a skill to help Wendy to deal with shadows, some of you would shout that "oh you want to compeletely remove Wendy's downside?"

If I'm not, but just mention this is a downside of her, you insist that "no it's not, you have no need to engage shadows"

flexible standard.

28 minutes ago, hyoton123 said:

-Spiders are not "almost permanent" (minus nurses), and panic. In contrast Abigail doesn't panic, doesn't eat up screen real estate, causes minimal lag, can be directed pretty easily, no resource cost if she dies, doesn't eat drops, is available day 1 with basically no change in functionality, moves between shards without eating your inventory room getting picked up, etc.

 

-Video shows only the fight, not the setup. Abigail doesn't require setup. The price is that she doesn't scale like webber does. That's intentional. 

韦伯的超级兵工厂-蜘蛛自动分类工厂-蜘蛛分类刷肉二合一，蜘蛛提纯工厂，一但建成用极少的成本永远白嫖战士和护士，饥荒工厂_饥荒_教学

"If you don't have nurses, that's your own business"

And I've already gave other spider type collecting step, they are cheap.

 

【饥荒】韦伯蜘蛛大军暗影三基佬打法_饥荒联机版

韦伯蜂后_哔哩哔哩_bilibili
Webber swarmed Beequeen and ShadowTri who has panic.

"If you can't dealt with panic, that's your own business, not equal to Webber has such a downside"

 

Lag is not a factor when we talking about balance. It is a bug.

Or if you want to talking about bug, then what about current Walter? He could easily kill AFW by pressing F.

 

[thesooz9000]

33 minutes ago, Steorra said:

lol, If I were ask 1 lurking terror with 2 beak, you would say it's ez, if 2 with 2, you would say "that's your own business"

If I were ask a skill to help Wendy to deal with shadows, some of you would shout that "oh you want to compeletely remove Wendy's downside?"

If I'm not, but just mention this is a downside of her, you insist that "no it's not, you have no need to engage shadows"

flexible standard.

 

Wendy only struggles against shadow creatures, that's the only mob that Abigail cannot help her against, and even then, Wendy has reduced sanity drain from monsters / structures, has a sisturn to increase her sanity, and it's not like that reduced damage changes the way you deal with the shadow creatures, you still fight them the same as any character, it just takes 2-3 more hits on average, for a character who can have higher than average damage against all other enemies in the game.

[Siren11]

2 hours ago, Bumber64 said:

Cursed vexation brings beefalo damage on par with Wolfgang. Wendy now handles AFW better than ever, so affinity is even less an issue. (I've also been told unlocking affinities with one survivor unlocks them for everyone?) She's got access to overwhelming follower strats as much as any other survivor.

Team Spirit probably helps with AFW, but tbh I have hand tremors and I’m struggling to manage that in addition to everything else, and there aren’t really any other pre-affinity options in her skill tree that help beyond making it quicker to collect Spectral Cure-Alls (which wasn’t even an issue before, imo). Ghastly Experience is okay, I guess. And you could beat it as Winona or go for CC first, but that still takes time and sometimes you just wanna do something as your favorite character. Assuming everyone just has affinities unlocked feels dismissive.

2 hours ago, Bumber64 said:

Sure, not everyone wants to play as Wolfgang or tame a beefalo. Not everyone wants to create an army of followers, either. So what's the actual point being made here? It certainly isn't that Wendy is weaker than Webber for a given investment. Is it that you can't steamroll bosses without putting in effort?

My point wasn’t that Wendy is weak or that I’m mad about not being able to steamroll bosses or whatever, and I’d appreciate it if you wouldn’t put words in my mouth. My point is that not everyone is going to metagame or have beaten the hardest bosses, and there should be options for them too. Realistically, most players are not going to be taming a Beefalo (which takes time and continued upkeep, not to mention the increased difficulty with all the knockback in the game now) and beating multiple bosses just to unlock her best damage. And even if a player does want to put in that work, they should be rewarded. Fix the interaction between Spectral Cure-All and Blessed Sisturn III (and idk, maybe tweak her shadow affinity but I can’t test), and I think Wendy will be balanced fine.

There are a surprising number of bosses who already do the same damage to mobs and players, so Blessed Sisturn III likely isn’t as useful as people think it is.

(Also like. There are plenty of things in DST that I don’t use because I dislike them, and I do feel like that’s an option here? Skill trees feel like they were made for player choice and that’s awesome.)

[Steorra]

1 hour ago, thesooz9000 said:

Wendy only struggles against shadow creatures, that's the only mob that Abigail cannot help her against, and even then, Wendy has reduced sanity drain from monsters / structures, has a sisturn to increase her sanity, and it's not like that reduced damage changes the way you deal with the shadow creatures, you still fight them the same as any character, it just takes 2-3 more hits on average, for a character who can have higher than average damage against all other enemies in the game.

I dont know what point you wanna make.

It's confusing that some of you say "Shadow creature is not a weakness for Wendy", some of you say "Wendy struggles against Shadows"

And also it is ridiclours that some of you continuosly ignoring the Shadow Creatures spawned from ruins.

[thesooz9000]

7 minutes ago, Steorra said:

I dont know what point you wanna make.

It's confusing that some of you say "Shadow creature is not a weakness for Wendy", some of you say "Wendy struggles against Shadows"

And also it is ridiclours that some of you continuosly ignoring the Shadow Creatures spawned from ruins.

The shadow creatures spawned from the ruins are on a timer, and they automatically despawn once the ruins enters it's calm phase, if you don't wanna engage the shadow creatures from the ruins, don't go near the nightmare lights during the nightmare phase, it's that simple.

[Steorra]

59 minutes ago, thesooz9000 said:

The shadow creatures spawned from the ruins are on a timer, and they automatically despawn once the ruins enters it's calm phase, if you don't wanna engage the shadow creatures from the ruins, don't go near the nightmare lights during the nightmare phase, it's that simple.

I've said that most fighting-focused character have more options to deal with these sceranios.

You CANT simply ignore these extra options. They are advantage of other but disadvantage of Wendy.

[thesooz9000]

Just now, Steorra said:

I've said that most fighting-focused character have more options to deal with these sceranios.

You CANT simply ignore these extra options.

And Wendy has more options against small mobs, certain bosses, and just horde mobs in general.

[Steorra]

Just now, thesooz9000 said:

And Wendy has more options against small mobs, certain bosses, and just horde mobs in general.

So?

[thesooz9000]

Just now, Steorra said:

So?

So? should other characters be able to solo bee queen whilst just holding down F with no thought? not every single character needs to excel in every single situation.

[Steorra]

3 minutes ago, thesooz9000 said:

So? should other characters be able to solo bee queen whilst just holding down F with no thought? not every single character needs to excel in every single situation.

Winona and Wurt: ?

[thesooz9000]

1 minute ago, Steorra said:

Winona and Wurt: ?

you can solo bq as wendy in 5 days whilst just holding down F with no thought, winona and wurt take TONS more resources than wendy and they take more than 16 days to set it up to even be as braindead as wendy can do it.

[Steorra]

4 minutes ago, thesooz9000 said:

you can solo bq as wendy in 5 days whilst just holding down F with no thought, winona and wurt take TONS more resources than wendy and they take more than 16 days to set it up to even be as braindead as wendy can do it.

【饥荒联机版 沃托克斯第二天新天赋速杀蜂后 by Ameslarii-哔哩哔哩】

Wortox: Haha! What is a bee queen? I can kill her without weapon in day 2.

[thesooz9000]

2 minutes ago, Steorra said:

【饥荒联机版 沃托克斯第二天新天赋速杀蜂后 by Ameslarii-哔哩哔哩】

Wortox: Haha! What is a bee queen? I can kill her without weapon in day 2.

lmao, that fight was easily 10 riskier than just holding down F as Wendy

the fight also took like 3-4x longer than it would have as wendy.

[Steorra]

5 minutes ago, thesooz9000 said:

lmao, that fight was easily 10 riskier than just holding down F as Wendy

Lmao, you have admit that Wendy can't do this. And no experienced player need a completely brain-dead method to kill BQ.

[thesooz9000]

2 minutes ago, Steorra said:

Lmao, you have admit that Wendy can't do this. And no experienced player need a completely brain-dead method to kill BQ.

There is literally another video by that same creator of him beating bq on day 2 as wendy.

[Steorra]

4 minutes ago, thesooz9000 said:

There is literally another video by that same creator of him beating bq on day 2 as wendy.

Yea, but what about 2 affinity lines in day15 of Wortox?

 

[thesooz9000]

Just now, Steorra said:

Yea, but what about 2 affinity lines in day15 of Wortox?

 

What are you talking about?

[Steorra]

5 minutes ago, thesooz9000 said:

What are you talking about?

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I guess teleport would be fewer important than Wolfgang-like DPS later.

[webberer]

I don’t agree that you don’t agree with the Sistern skills change. Because what you said is not convincing and you did not provide evidence that you defeated boss easily with abi

[thesooz9000]

12 minutes ago, Steorra said:

【燃烧的红色灵魂！小恶魔用时15天速通击杀天体英雄＆织影者！【饥荒联机版】-哔哩哔哩】 https://b23.tv/otToYjb

【饥荒小恶魔8天速通织影者【测试服随机图】-哔哩哔哩】 https://b23.tv/o2FlkTc

 

I guess teleport would be fewer important than Wolfgang-like DPS later.

The first speedrun is very impressive, Don't see how it makes blessed sisturn III not op however

As for the second speedrun, it is also very impressive, however the WR as far as I know day 4, not 8.

Still don't see how linking videos of the best players in this game doing insane stuff is gonna magically invalidate blessed sisturn III being busted.

 

[Steorra]

1 minute ago, thesooz9000 said:

The first speedrun is very impressive, Don't see how it makes blessed sisturn III not op however

As for the second speedrun, it is also very impressive, however the WR as far as I know day 4, not 8.

Still don't see how linking videos of the best players in this game doing insane stuff is gonna magically invalidate blessed sisturn III being busted.

 

Still don't see how Sisturn III is OP if no one can give a video comparison for show how it worked as "I cant overcome this boss before, but now I can with Sisturn III help"

If your "OP" means for newcomer, then I guess it should be none of your business when you were a veteran.

A simply thing is that veteran should not gatekeep newcomer.

[thesooz9000]

Just now, Steorra said:

Still don't see how Sisturn III is OP if no one can give a video comparison for show how it worked as "I cant overcome this boss before, but now I can with Sisturn III help"

If your "OP" means for newcomer, then I guess it should be none of your business when you were a veteran.

A simply thing is that veteran should not gatekeep newcomer.

I'm not "gatekeeping" anyone, I'm suggesting that Blessed Sisturn III not work on normal/shadow abigail, If new players want a abigail where they don't have to manager her during boss fights, then gestalt abigail can keep the player tag, whilst other versions of abigail don't have the player tag

[Steorra]

Just now, thesooz9000 said:

I'm not "gatekeeping" anyone, I'm suggesting that Blessed Sisturn III not work on normal/shadow abigail, If new players want a abigail where they don't have to manager her during boss fights, then gestalt abigail can keep the player tag, whilst other versions of abigail don't have the player tag

Normal Abi does matter. the basic survival enhancement for Abi should be more easier to get for casual players. And I do agree with you that the survival enhancement should not work for Shadow Abi.

Shadow Abi is a far more broken thing rather than current sisturn III.