Walter doesn’t need an ammo bag and here’s why

[Lucas Rego]

I have seeing many people suggesting a Bag for Walter to hold ammo, but with the Prototyped ammo update it is kind of irrelevant guys, hear me out:

Lets say that you are gonna fight Fuelweaver and needs Moonglass rounds, if you have it prototyped already, you could simply just bring moon shards, it has a stack of 40, therefore with one slot you are holding 1200 of his ammo (which in this situation would be 61,200 total damage)

The same thing applies to Thulecite fragments (although you are bringing also Nightmare fuel, which you would regardless), Dreadstone, and etc…

I know you could say that no all of them are like that and it’s a good argument, my point is that I do agree with the devs saying that the logistic of you managing to open the bag, picking an ammo and etc…

of course we could have a bag with infinite ammo, but IMO it’s not necessary, we don’t need that much.

btw, I do criticize a lot, but I’m not only that, and I wanna congratulate the Devs that are working on him, being able to cancel animation + the fire rate buff is amazing, nice job bro.

[Mysterious box]

4 minutes ago, Lucas Rego said:

I have swing many people suggesting a Bag for Walter to hold ammo, but with the Prototyped ammo update it is kind of irrelevant guys, hear me out:

Lets say that you are gonna fight Fuelweaver and needs Moonglass rounds, if you have it prototyped already, you could simply just bring moon shards, it has a stack of 40, therefore with one slot you are holding 1200 of his ammo (which in this situation would be 61,200 total damage)

The same thing applies to Thulecite fragments (although you are bringing also Nightmare fuel, which you would regardless), Dreadstone, and etc…

I know you could say that no all of them are like that and it’s a good argument, my point is that I do agree with the devs saying that the logistic of you managing to open the bag, picking an ammo and etc…

of course we could have a bag with infinite ammo, but IMO it’s not necessary, we don’t need that much.

btw, I do criticize a lot, but I’m not only that, and I wanna congratulate the Devs that are working on him, being able to cancel animation + the fire rate buff is amazing, nice job bro.

I bring up what I mentioned before the issue isn't carrying a lot of a single ammo type but carrying a variety of ammo types that would be too situational to be used otherwise like poop pellets and freeze rounds. For example a post rift lunar Walter at bare min will have husk rounds, brilliance rounds, glass rounds, and slowdown rounds which just translates to dps and aoe now if your using the thulecite frame that takes up one special round slot but that's still 3+ slots going towards your rounds already with Shadow making a similar compromises and leaving basically no room for freeze rounds and poop pellets.

[MisterBilly]

I generally agree that he doesn't need an ammo back for a couple reasons:

1. The game has always had a involvement of inventory management, the clunky nature of the swapping ammunition from the inventory is natural part of the game.

2. An Ammo bag that simply works as a bag for only ammo would still be clunky, and some sort of strange esoteric complex bag system that lets you more comfortably swap ammo and use less spaces really isn't necessary for this game.

Also, we have the scrappier slingshot, which holds infinite ammus of your choosing. Of course, don't be expecting to swap ammo easily with that, but you could always make multiple slingshots. (I.E., one for damage, one for cc.)

[Lee Sy]

但有一个弹药袋也没什么坏处不是吗，如果你不喜欢，不点就是了，毕竟沃尔特的技能点也比较珍贵，你完全可以选择其他更有价值的技能。

[Mysterious box]

36 minutes ago, MisterBilly said:

I generally agree that he doesn't need an ammo back for a couple reasons:

1. The game has always had a involvement of inventory management, the clunky nature of the swapping ammunition from the inventory is natural part of the game.

2. An Ammo bag that simply works as a bag for only ammo would still be clunky, and some sort of strange esoteric complex bag system that lets you more comfortably swap ammo and use less spaces really isn't necessary for this game.

Also, we have the scrappier slingshot, which holds infinite ammus of your choosing. Of course, don't be expecting to swap ammo easily with that, but you could always make multiple slingshots. (I.E., one for damage, one for cc.)

Again it still comes down to the issue of Walter just abandoning variety due to lack of space as rather than juggling your entire inventory with different ammos for different situations the way it's currently designed and if that's the case then there's not really a point for him to even use most of his crowd control ammos. A bag would allow you to store those and only dig into them when you need them rather than just never using them at all.

[MisterBilly]

33 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

Again it still comes down to the issue of Walter just abandoning variety due to lack of space as rather than juggling your entire inventory with different ammos for different situations the way it's currently designed and if that's the case then there's not really a point for him to even use most of his crowd control ammos. A bag would allow you to store those and only dig into them when you need them rather than just never using them at all.

Ah, you know, I completely forgot he even had poop pellets or freeze pellets. If they added more unconventional misc ammo types I'd definitely would like a small ammo bag, so you don't have to carry all the mats on you.

[Torpeda]

1 hour ago, Lucas Rego said:

I know you could say that no all of them are like that and it’s a good argument, my point is that I do agree with the devs saying that the logistic of you managing to open the bag, picking an ammo and etc…

What about the logistics of bringing those items and converting them before the fight? It's easier to open the bag and take out desired ammo than to convert raw materials every time you want to use different ammo. In my opinion if you can stack up to 40, let's say Thulecite Fragments, in a single inventory slot, you should at the very least be able to hold equivalent number of Cursed Rounds.

You got so many different ammo types in this Skill Tree, but you would end up using just a few, because you wouldn't want to waste inventory space. You may want to use two Slingshots because of the different frames, at least one ST rounds, one AoE, some utility Rounds and then the inventory becomes cluttered.

Also if I was a new player and saw Walter's Skill Tree I would think that I'm encouraged to switch between between different ammo's or different Slingshot's parts depending on the scenario, but I wouldn't be provided with neccessary space to hold so many items. And I know we got Woby, but then instead of her being a personal chester she becomes personal ammo bag instead.

A bag that can hold several ammo types or some kind of "marble jar" that could hold up to 1200 rounds (Yeah, I realise there's a scrap frame. I'm not a big fan, tho :P) of your chosen ammo would be really welcome and appreciated in my opinion. Also if it was a perk, then it would be something optional. Who would want to be bothered with those "logistics" would choose so and I'm always in favour of giving players more options.

[aidankocherhans]

Between the high damage rounds, low damage cheap rounds, potentially 2 slingshots, a melee weapon, and so many utility rounds... That's a lot of space for one weapon. It's gonna be hard to bring more than one utility round with me, so I might just not use them

[Lucas Rego]

43 minutes ago, MisterBilly said:

Ah, you know, I completely forgot he even had poop pellets or freeze pellets.

I tried using the Freeze ones on DF with no walls, it's heaven man, along with thulecite frame it's amazing.

2 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

post rift lunar Walter at bare min will have husk rounds, brilliance rounds, glass rounds, and slowdown rounds which just translates to dps and aoe now if your using the thulecite frame that takes up one special round slot but that's still 3+ slots going towards your rounds already with Shadow making a similar compromises and leaving basically no room for freeze rounds and poop pellets.

I like freeze rounds, I do need to find uses for poop ones though. but if we come to think about it Woby came with 9 slots, I always had in my mind that i was already for that extra ammo, and if you think, every boss is different ammo, but we don't use more than 3 different ones a boss, do we? With FW I only used the Glass round, the thulecite on phase 1 and the slow down with the purple gem, idk, the bag only for ammo imo (just an opinion) makes little to no difference maybe, but I respect what you said and there's true statements there

1 hour ago, MisterBilly said:

1. The game has always had a involvement of inventory management, the clunky nature of the swapping ammunition from the inventory is natural part of the game.

2. An Ammo bag that simply works as a bag for only ammo would still be clunky, and some sort of strange esoteric complex bag system that lets you more comfortably swap ammo and use less spaces really isn't necessary for this game.

Yeah, I 100% agree with that, besides, creating 30 per time + 120 is good enough, maybe adding the bag is too much, I like the inventory challenge (well, I suffer as well hahahah), but adding the bag is even a bit "too powerful" (not that much, but my point is that we don't need it)

1 hour ago, Lee Sy said:

但有一个弹药袋也没什么坏处不是吗，如果你不喜欢，不点就是了，毕竟沃尔特的技能点也比较珍贵，你完全可以选择其他更有价值的技能。

We are good on DPS, we got a good slow, we have 120 per slot and we can make 30 ammo per time, if we have the bag my opinion is that we would be too spoiled hahahah, I'm more concerned about Woby and new skills than a bag, but it wouldn't harm me indeed, I'm just stating that it's not 100% necessary.

49 minutes ago, Torpeda said:

What about the logistics of bringing those items and converting them before the fight? It's easier to open the bag and take out desired ammo than to convert raw materials every time you want to use different ammo.

I understand the pain my man, my last gameplay I just used the slow down, the freeze, the thulecite and the glass ones, and the slow down and freeze I rarely use more than 120, so it's 4, 2 is already in my Slingshot and the other 2 is situational, I walk with Thulecite fragments and moonglass in Woby's inventory since they are the most expensive ones, so theoretically it's only 2 or 3 more slots which I already have more since I have Wobby.

I did use the ones made with stingers early game for information, and I know these 4 are just a style of gameplay, but I'm just sharing so we could analyse the best options.

35 minutes ago, aidankocherhans said:

Between the high damage rounds, low damage cheap rounds, potentially 2 slingshots, a melee weapon, and so many utility rounds... That's a lot of space for one weapon. It's gonna be hard to bring more than one utility round with me, so I might just not use them

Indeed, I usually only use slow and damage, rarely I use freeze (DF), but it's always in my bag.

------------------------------

But all in all, if we want to have every ammo of him in hand, it may be necessary a bag, I know it's my playstyle and I tend to be efficient, I just wanted to share that we don't reeeeally need a bag and this post is to try helping out people that are struggling.

[mima_]

i agree,

with woby as extra carrier. why u need more bag? 

[Mysterious box]

8 minutes ago, Lucas Rego said:

like freeze rounds, I do need to find uses for poop ones though. but if we come to think about it Woby came with 9 slots, I always had in my mind that i was already for that extra ammo, and if you think, every boss is different ammo, but we don't use more than 3 different ones a boss, do we? With FW I only used the Glass round, the thulecite on phase 1 and the slow down with the purple gem, idk, the bag only for ammo imo (just an opinion) makes little to no difference maybe, but I respect what you said and there's true statements there

It's not just about bosses specifically it's the day to day use aoe freeze is useful in dealing with some hordes and poop pellets to give a good example for poop pellets they can deaggro nightmare creatures spawned by nightmare lights which is nice when you don't want to fight the ruins exclusive one for example. It works on a wide variety of things most wouldn't think of really.

If Woby is meant to be our ammo container then she's by far the worst method of the currently available character specific containers since she runs from you in combat and you can't access her storage while mounted it's flawed from both fronts. I don't mean that your wrong or to disrespect your stance but I just find it hard to commit to using his other ammo types with this limitation.

4 minutes ago, mima_ said:

i agree,

with woby as extra carrier. why u need more bag? 

What I mentioned above this 

[mima_]

5 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

What I mentioned above this 

but u could swap your unused stuff for fight and place your ammo that being carried by woby before fight begin right? 
noone ask you hot swapping in middle of fight with woby.
it isnt that hard to figure how to manage inventory when u get 9 extra slot everywhere.

[Mysterious box]

4 minutes ago, mima_ said:

but u could swap your unused stuff for fight and place your ammo that being carried by woby before fight begin right? 
noone ask you hot swapping in middle of fight with woby.
it isnt that hard to figure how to manage inventory when u get 9 extra slot everywhere.

That only works for a boss fight what about the rest of the time?

[MisterBilly]

30 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

That only works for a boss fight what about the rest of the time?

Hey, I'd like to ask you; don't you feel like a core part of the game experience is making decisions and preparing? I know it's strange, and know that I'm not against you or anything, but I'd like to suggest this-

If a player decides to not use a specific ammo type because he wants to save on bag space, what's wrong with that? Someone might not utilize the entire kit because they feel like it would take up too much inventory space, but isn't giving them a bag where they can simply take everything with them essentially removing that decision, or necessity for him to prepare? Walter would no longer have to ask himself what resources he should bring, how much, and what type of ammo he needs to bring. He wouldn't have to make sacrifices on resources to make room for more ammo, or otherwise important decisions. The ammo bag would be quality of life, for sure... but sometimes too much freedom and convenience can detract from experience, especially in a game like this.

It's just a weak philosophical take, don't take it too seriously or anything. Just something you might consider?

[mima_]

53 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

That only works for a boss fight what about the rest of the time?

the rest of time people can survive by hitting things with axe. what the problem ?

[Mysterious box]

1 minute ago, mima_ said:

the rest of time people can survive by hitting things with axe. what the problem ?

There's nothing wrong with it but why even bother having them if there's never going to be a place to use them without packing out your inventory? Heck by this distinction why does Wendy even need a potion storage it's not like she needs all her potions at all times no? The goal is to encourage Walter to be more flexible not just be straight dps and slow I don't see why this is such a issue?

[mima_]

1 minute ago, Mysterious box said:

why does Wendy even need a potion storage it's not like she needs all her potions at all times no?

maybe cus she didnt put backpack on abigail 

[Mysterious box]

1 minute ago, mima_ said:

maybe cus she didnt put backpack on abigail 

Okay then why doesn't her potion case runaway from her?

To be a bit more serious for a moment the reason Walter needs a ammo bag is for his utility rounds and if the only way he can use them is by having them clogging up most of his inventory then either his round's effects need to be condensed or people are just gonna not use much utility outside of slow.

[Lucas Rego]

3 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

it's the day to day use aoe freeze is useful in dealing with some hordes and poop pellets to give a good example for poop pellets they can deaggro nightmare creatures spawned by nightmare lights

The day to day freeze is nice, I didnt know the poop pellets would deaggro nightmare creatures, this is really dope!

1 hour ago, Mysterious box said:

the reason Walter needs a ammo bag is for his utility rounds and if the only way he can use them is by having them clogging up most of his inventory then either his round's effects need to be condensed or people are just gonna not use much utility outside of slow.

If you come to think about it, we barely use 120 in a day to day situation, but I do understand your point

2 hours ago, MisterBilly said:

don't you feel like a core part of the game experience is making decisions and preparing? 

If a player decides to not use a specific ammo type because he wants to save on bag space, what's wrong with that? Someone might not utilize the entire kit because they feel like it would take up too much inventory space, but isn't giving them a bag where they can simply take everything with them essentially removing that decision, or necessity for him to prepare? Walter would no longer have to ask himself what resources he should bring, how much, and what type of ammo he needs to bring. He wouldn't have to make sacrifices on resources to make room for more ammo, or otherwise important decisions. The ammo bag would be quality of life, for sure... but sometimes too much freedom and convenience can detract from experience, especially in a game like this.

It's just a weak philosophical take, don't take it too seriously or anything. Just something you might consider?

I agree, we are already in a good spot with the ammo and fire rate, if we get even a bag it would be pushing it too much, he needs to be better but it is pushing to perfection, we are good the way we are 

[aidankocherhans]

3 hours ago, MisterBilly said:

Hey, I'd like to ask you; don't you feel like a core part of the game experience is making decisions and preparing? I know it's strange, and know that I'm not against you or anything, but I'd like to suggest this-

If a player decides to not use a specific ammo type because he wants to save on bag space, what's wrong with that? Someone might not utilize the entire kit because they feel like it would take up too much inventory space, but isn't giving them a bag where they can simply take everything with them essentially removing that decision, or necessity for him to prepare? Walter would no longer have to ask himself what resources he should bring, how much, and what type of ammo he needs to bring. He wouldn't have to make sacrifices on resources to make room for more ammo, or otherwise important decisions. The ammo bag would be quality of life, for sure... but sometimes too much freedom and convenience can detract from experience, especially in a game like this.

It's just a weak philosophical take, don't take it too seriously or anything. Just something you might consider?

I mean, it's just one weapon, how many slots does it need to take? One of his main perks is extra storage, but if it's taken up primarily by his signature weapon does that even count?

[Steorra]

I have no idea about that why some of us would like to against some simply QoL changes like an ammo bag for Walter. Would this change destroy some game experience of yours?

[Soul7k]

4 hours ago, mima_ said:

i agree,

with woby as extra carrier. why u need more bag? 

because i do not have to chase a bag while a fight is happening

[OMEGASCRUFF]

Am I the only person abusing the Scrappier Slingshot Frames like this to hold all the ammo I could ever need?

[Tarnishedmax]

13 minutes ago, OMEGASCRUFF said:

Am I the only person abusing the Scrappier Slingshot Frames like this to hold all the ammo I could ever need?

i have been thinking of doing this but since they all look the same i dont think its THAT effective, you still end up just scrambling around your things

[OMEGASCRUFF]

1 hour ago, Tarnishedmax said:

i have been thinking of doing this but since they all look the same i dont think its THAT effective, you still end up just scrambling around your things

I've been just taking them out one at a time since I remember the order I've chosen inside of Woby. Before I farmed some Enlightened Crowns, I just kept Thulecite Fragments, Moon Rock, Purple Gemstones, Moon Shards, Gunpowder, and Flint in Woby and just crafted whatever I needed before a fight. Added Pure Horror after Fuelweaver. Was just a little annoying having some spare ammo lying around in small chunks sometimes after finishing combat, since I kinda just guess how many rounds I need for a fight, but I'd just throw the leftovers in a chest at base and restock from there occasionally.

I was thinking about making a dedicated suggestion that they should show the contents of the slingshot when you hover over them, since I usually carry two for combat and it would make keeping track easier if my inventory gets shuffled around. This has been fine for Woby, though the visual indicator would be nice there too, but there have definitely been times where I choose the wrong slingshot from my inventory and got punished for it.