Winona and Wurt Skilltree actually Work Really Well as Skilltrees layouts

[Jakepeng99]

Time i talk about what i really, really like about these new skilltrees. Ignoring how they affect the character itself (for example, doesnt change the fact i believe Wurt needs more utility stuff), they work really well as a skilltree layout. (I don't have a good way to explain what i mean by this sentence so i hope you get what i mean. Otherwise what i am going to say may sound contradicting.)

 

But, what i mean by that, is that there are a lot of viable builds for different playstyles and preferances, you think about each skillpoint you invest, and you may often choose a new loadout on a new world rather than always going for the same thing almost all the time.

 

Wurt:

You have the choice between many preferances. You can go for a build with less focus on merms using amphibian and mosquito crafts, or go for more merm focus. There is a lot of mixing and matching between all these skills that i find hard to explain. There are problems with some of these skills like the mosquitos, sure, but choosing your skills feels so much better and fun than the rest of the cast. 

The affinities are good for this too. A lot affinities so far are often one sided, though Wurt's has great reason to choose either since both have their niches and usages. My only suggestion is to make the shadow 1 skill need you to feed the merm nightmare fuel for it to create a shadow merm upon death, as it blows the lunar side out the water since it is immediatly strong early game (and it can be annoying to have the shadow merms when you don't want them)

 

Winona:

Her shelf system is really interesting with how it works, it adds a lot of brainpower and though to choosing the skills. For shelf 1, do i want to choose this little spotlight gimmick? Do i think i need the faster gadget charge? All the options in shelf one are good and there is no "straight up the best". Shelf 2 does have a lot of stat stuff, though it does it well. Do i want more independant catapults so i need to use my remote less and can do more myself? (You might go for rapid fire, maxed catapult stats). Do i want to use my remote a lot in my catapults with more of my input? (You might focus on the fuel efficency perks, the aoe perks, click to target and stuff instead of things like rapid fire). It is pretty nice. It is all down for preferance and playstyle which you could mix up a lot.

For the 3rd shelf/affinities, its kinda similar. There is good reason to use some lunar perks over some shadow perks. The lunar stuff is probably better to pick, but the shadow stuff is still good with its own niches that you might like more, or choose for some change.

 

The other skilltrees:

For example, Wolfgang has little choice or variation as he has quite a lot of skills that feel like "must choose" skills, like the planar stuff late game, and the lunar affinity bonus is overall much better than the shadow. Wolfgang is the extreme and nobody else is near to him, but a portion of the other characters have this on a smaller scale, like with Wormwood's plant crafts. Though, out of all the characters, Winona and Wurt probably have the best layout so far as they work well for having variation for other playstyles which the other characters seem to have less of so Klei is learning and i am hopeful for some cool layouts in the future.

 

 

Tldr: Winona and Wurt skilltrees have skills that work towards many different playstyles or preferances, meaning you can mix and match a lot more which creates much more replayability.

[Jakepeng99]

More examples with Wurt:

Merm retreat synergise with mosquito skills.

Merm retreat anti-synergising with the merm shadow skills (means you may choose a different route if you choose this alignment)

 

Very Important one i missed: Multiplayer synergy: you may not choose all of the kings quests or structures in cooperative play with other Wurts, it gives each Wurt you play with a certain role, and allows you to one up each other to allow you all to benifit from everything. If they make the merm healer good at healing merms, there can be a builder, combat, utility (If we dream they add more utility), and healer role for Wurts.

Before, having multiple Wurts was often "unoptimal."

[Mysterious box]

27 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

Yeah.

Only thing missing from wurts skill tree is gnaw alignment.

Please klei it's still threatening to steal my house.

I imagine the reason it's not there being that Wurt herself isn't related to gnaw I still have a theory that merms existed before the whole gnaw thing and gnaw eventually learned of them and began turning creatures into them as a punishment due to how poorly he viewed them.

[Jakepeng99]

I am pretty sure Wurt in the future will miss out of stuff by not having normal alignments, since the alignment tags hold more purpouse.

[flamboyant wolf]

I will say, as skill trees, these are pretty good, noticeable rise in viable builds and meaningful choices compared to the first batch.

[Jakepeng99]

29 minutes ago, skile said:

I will say, as skill trees, these are pretty good, noticeable rise in viable builds and meaningful choices compared to the first batch.

Yeah, that is exactly what i mean.

[Jakepeng99]

42 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

Klei should not add in a boss that requires different alignments to be damaged/progress in the fight.

I never said that.

[Mysterious box]

51 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

some of wurt's (normally inaccessible) gorge quotes suggest a sort of 'holiness' feeling towards the Gnaw.

"but those aren't fully implemented quotes"

well they at least view the Gnaw positively.

"The plague ain't so bad, y'know." - Sammy

"Gnaw smile on you." - Pipton

They're implemented as a what if scenario not to be taken as canon 

[Copyafriend]

i really like how with winona you can really pick and choose whats important to you, and can even get minor things from both alignments if you want (fueling with nightmare fuel is irresistible, but i dont wanna be shadow aligned)

i think the telebrella and building needs buffs, but otherwise i really like that branch a lot

i think the shadow vs lunar has kind of an "early vs lategame" feel to it. nightmare fuel is relatively easy to acquire as a fuel alternative, but all of the lunar choices are lategame, but seemingly more powerful PER item because its a gemarator (and infinite power is neat, i think its supposed to have a cooldown, but still) 

its very nice. i like it a lot

[Mysterious box]

15 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

...

then the crop seeds for carrots, potatoes, onions, garlic, and tomatoes should not be tak- OH HEY.

Gonna be honest I have no idea what your getting at?

[Mysterious box]

3 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

those crops seeds from You Reap What You Sow actually originate from the gorge.

The Gorge Seeds - Don't Starve Wiki

Wait are you trying to say Gorge invented the concept of seeds?

Also how does this relate to unimplemented dialogue of a character who was never canonically present for gorge? 

[Mysterious box]

Just now, SSneaky said:

simply put yes, for those crops.

more complex answer is that that's the wrong question and don't try to twist my words jack***

I'm not trying to twist your words at all we already know that birds were the ones who brought the seeds and they came from the outside world they did not canonically come from the gorge.

That aside how does this even relate to Wurt's non canon dialogue?

[Mysterious box]

3 minutes ago, SSneaky said:

i see, so you instead just ignored both Sammy's and Pipton's dialogues regarding the gnaw.

then YOUR dialouge here shal be ignored too, g' day.

There's no need to get overly emotional about this I assumed you already understood my thoughts regarding that here.

 

2 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

I imagine the reason it's not there being that Wurt herself isn't related to gnaw I still have a theory that merms existed before the whole gnaw thing and gnaw eventually learned of them and began turning creatures into them as a punishment due to how poorly he viewed them.

But I guess I was wrong so let me just say this.

1 hour ago, SSneaky said:

well they at least view the Gnaw positively.

"The plague ain't so bad, y'know." - Sammy

"Gnaw smile on you." - Pipton

We know the thoughts of those corrupted by the plague but not those of merms who aren't directly in his presence. We also have no idea if Gnaw is the actual origin of all merms since there are various forces and objects that can shift the forms of others throughout the constant.