Skill Trees/Other Various Recent Suggestions

[GelatinousCube]

Don't get me wrong and I want to preface this that I really enjoy reading cool complex suggestions for the game even when they aren't things I think could feasibly or reasonably be included in the game and even when they aren't things I personally would like added to the game. It's fun to read players ideas, skill trees and whatnot and I appreciate that a lot of thought and creativity goes into them

 However, I feel like a lot of player suggestions lately especially skill trees are a little wild. Like a lot of the skill tree ideas I've seen of late are absolutely hectic. I know that just bigger numbers and simple mechanics can be a bit boring/stale but I'm pretty sure most skill trees we get are going to be half awesome skills and half bigger numbers/simple changes/additions. This is simply based on what we have already received with the four skill trees so far and the limitations of the game itself.

Ones where almost every skill suggested are a huge change or addition to the character while fun to read just don't seem realistic or likely. Don't get me wrong I'd love to have Volt Goat Chariots for Wig, entire Merm ecosystems and shops for Wurt, several new cooking structures for Warly with new cooking mechanics (this one is maybe a bit more likely?) Etc but I just don't think it's going to happen on quite the grand scale suggested by many users at least.

I am in no way trying to complain or suggesting people don't use their creativity to come up with such interesting and complex suggestions I just don't think we should be expecting so much from Klei or getting our hopes up too much. It will only lead to disappointment in the long run.

Same goes for stuff like elevation being added. It just isn't realistic imo.

There are plenty of forum users who politely suggest that some of these suggestions would be very hard to include or implement and provide actual experience and knowledge to back this up but they are sometimes drowned out by those simply repeating Yeah but it would be cool so why not? It unfortunately isn't as easy or simple as an idea being really cool so why not implement it regardless of the time and effort and potential issues it would then cause with other mechanics.

Klei are fantastic developers giving us so many constant free updates for a game that has existed this long and I just think it's  worth tempering our expectations and hopes to be a little bit more realistic in the long run. There have been some hit and miss updates like Moon Quay pirates as well I know but that only goes to show that it isn't so easy to always make an idea work so well when actually being implemented and added to the game. 

Again, not suggesting people tone down or stop suggesting such creative ideas but we just need to be a tiny bit more realistic or at least accept that while they would be really cool many suggestions unfortunately just aren't ever going to make it to the game. 

We still don't even have treasure chests from the ocean usable as movable storage chests or other simple suggestions I know many players would enjoy! 

[jrthekidRS]

Yeah, those suggestions are completely unrealistic but that doesn't mean they are useless for Klei. You can still figure what issues a player have with the game by figuring out what they want. They can spark ideas in the developer's heads even if it isn't the suggestion itself. And most of those posts have the thought process of, "Hey, a man can dream."

But a lot of people in general need to really temper expectations. Wolfgang's skill tree was incredibly disappointing to some people. While I understand why; I am not surprised that his skill tree was just stat increases. Wolfgang himself is basically just stat increases. Skill trees are meant to add more depth to what's there, not completely change the character. That's why Wilson's skill tree doesn't have any insane perks. You can't just add a perk that gives him the ability to brew potions and throw them to debuff mobs, at that point just do a full rework or create a new character.

[Shunky]

Relatable. I made a post for a Wendy skill tree with what I thought were fairly reasonable ideas and some of the comments giving their ideas were pretty out there.

[GelatinousCube]

5 hours ago, Shunky said:

Relatable. I made a post for a Wendy skill tree with what I thought were fairly reasonable ideas and some of the comments giving their ideas were pretty out there.

Just read your post. It's definitely one of the more realistic skill tree suggestions. I think some numbers would need tweaking and certain elements may need to be a little simpler but it's one of if not my favourite skill tree suggestion post thus far.

Renewing graves would be superb. I like the cost you gave and the requirement of dark petals and lune blossoms, you both have to visit lunar island and setup a lune tree farm and dark petals aren't super easy to amass in big numbers. Grave loot could use an overhaul as well for sure. New uses for the garland would be great. Improving both potions themselves and giving new crafts that make them potentially easier to mass create (chance of making multiples like the hallowed nights potions and a chance to reduce the cost) is simple but neat. Really like the elixirs container too. Seed of Sorrow is also super cool. Overall great ideas. 

Only parts I don't like are Elegy, the new option that reduces Abi damage but increases shield time and restore seems very strong. 

Spinechill and Floral Protection seem strong enough to be alignment skills you have to pick between however they don't really fit the shadow and moon thematically unfortunately. With a little tweaking and flavor I'm sure versions of them could. 

I think a skill tree similar to yours but just a little more basic and toned down would be fantastic for Wendy. 

You also weren't wrong that some of the suggestions others made are pretty wild.

[Saladmanders]

14 hours ago, GelatinousCube said:

Don't get me wrong and I want to preface this that I really enjoy reading cool complex suggestions for the game even when they aren't things I think could feasibly or reasonably be included in the game and even when they aren't things I personally would like added to the game. It's fun to read players ideas, skill trees and whatnot and I appreciate that a lot of thought and creativity goes into them

Personally I love making skill trees & it's part of the reason why I actually post & see other posts in the forums.

14 hours ago, GelatinousCube said:

 However, I feel like a lot of player suggestions lately especially skill trees are a little wild. Like a lot of the skill tree ideas I've seen of late are absolutely hectic. I know that just bigger numbers and simple mechanics can be a bit boring/stale but I'm pretty sure most skill trees we get are going to be half awesome skills and half bigger numbers/simple changes/additions. This is simply based on what we have already received with the four skill trees so far and the limitations of the game itself.

I see it as not about making a realistic Skilltree, I see it as how much I can push the limits for a single character to make a Skilltree suitable for their playstyle. Of course, I don't want a Wes to do 1000 damage in an instant, but it's a foundation for more of my & others ideas to grow & change the skills to be more optimal & balanced.

 

14 hours ago, GelatinousCube said:

Ones where almost every skill suggested are a huge change or addition to the character while fun to read just don't seem realistic or likely. Don't get me wrong I'd love to have Volt Goat Chariots for Wig, entire Merm ecosystems and shops for Wurt, several new cooking structures for Warly with new cooking mechanics (this one is maybe a bit more likely?) Etc but I just don't think it's going to happen on quite the grand scale suggested by many users at least.

I gotta agree with that, however I wouldn't try to lower nor heighten my expectations for the ranges of potential expanded skills of characters. With DS as a whole, you never know what to expect.

14 hours ago, GelatinousCube said:

I am in no way trying to complain or suggesting people don't use their creativity to come up with such interesting and complex suggestions I just don't think we should be expecting so much from Klei or getting our hopes up too much. It will only lead to disappointment in the long run.

I very much agree. Better to dream than to despair for the future.

14 hours ago, GelatinousCube said:

Same goes for stuff like elevation being added. It just isn't realistic imo.

Elevation seems more like an idea that would only be touched upon once things in the overworld & caves have been fully fleshed out.

14 hours ago, GelatinousCube said:

There are plenty of forum users who politely suggest that some of these suggestions would be very hard to include or implement and provide actual experience and knowledge to back this up but they are sometimes drowned out by those simply repeating Yeah but it would be cool so why not? It unfortunately isn't as easy or simple as an idea being really cool so why not implement it regardless of the time and effort and potential issues it would then cause with other mechanics.

Balancing the crazy with the modest is quite hard to do & I can see why people would instead take the easier (but understandable) route of showing ideas without balance checking them (myself included).

14 hours ago, GelatinousCube said:

Klei are fantastic developers giving us so many constant free updates for a game that has existed this long and I just think it's  worth tempering our expectations and hopes to be a little bit more realistic in the long run. There have been some hit and miss updates like Moon Quay pirates as well I know but that only goes to show that it isn't so easy to always make an idea work so well when actually being implemented and added to the game. 

I don't think any updates were bad. They all added content right? Though of course, using time to create an unimpactful generally weird update would be bad for both the community & developers morale. But of course, there is always a path to improvement. And yeah, Klei's developers, artists, music, games, etc. are really good! We take these free updates & their games for granted.

14 hours ago, GelatinousCube said:

Again, not suggesting people tone down or stop suggesting such creative ideas but we just need to be a tiny bit more realistic or at least accept that while they would be really cool many suggestions unfortunately just aren't ever going to make it to the game. 

Hahahahaha (laughs in JoJo references).

 

Thanks for reading! Cool post

 

 

[Jakepeng99]

9 hours ago, Saladmanders said:

I don't think any updates were bad. They all added content right?

Once you experiance a Monkey pirate raid, your mind will change. I normally log out as soon as i hear them to despawn them because it is a really unfair fight that punishes you for winning. If you lose, they take your stuff and destroy stuff on your boat. I am hoping Klei reworks them. Maybe make their boats smaller and make them come in a few boat waves with 2 monkeys on each boat, and maybe instead of dropping trinkets, they are in a chest along with the loot of the raid so you can choose to ignore the loot and the trinkets. 

 

Klei just added a few bad bandaid fixes, like cannons despawning them and dropping monkey trinkets on death though they are not good fixes. Maybe a monkey shrine mast upgrsde that you can give bananas to remove trinkets?