Mattle Doesn't Credit After Negotation

[BlackMagicAngel]

I wanted to ask if anyone else had this problem. I already reported it as a bug, but I want to see if anyone else has a similar experience like mine.

I was doing one of those events where you can remove a bane from yourself by defeating the person that giving it to you if you find them randomly on the map. During the negotation part of it, an argument started on the AI's end that was "if you defeat this argument, gain X Matte if you win the negotation, with X equal to remaining stacks on this argument." I defeated the argument with 7 stacks left on it and won, but after checking the battle rewards and winning, the game didn't credit the 7 Matte that I should have gotten with Sal (who was I playing with for that event).

In addition, after clearing that bane event, the game treated my next quest as a failure, and that was before I even accepted any quests at that time (and none were currently active). The reason was that the "bane" event person was defeated, but her name wasn't ever in the details of that quest. Plus, I had the "boon" active that lets you negotiate for better quest rewards with no quest active for it, but the game still said "you failed," despite not taking it yet.

That's all that I can say on it for now. Has anyone else had any problem with Matte from just the Matte argument that could show up randomly in negotiations not crediting after winning, and other odd stuff going on after this event? I wanted to share, just to ask if their have been other things that glitch stuff likes this happens.

[AuntHerbert]

I know that Sal's tax collection quest is an autofail if you, for example beat up a merchant or bilebroker, because their negotiations are too annoying, and then start a fight with any Admirality that shows up to investigate. Makes sense, given the purpose of the quest.

46 minutes ago, BlackMagicAngel said:

after clearing that bane event, the game treated my next quest as a failure, and that was before I even accepted any quests at that time (and none were currently active). The reason was that the "bane" event person was defeated, but her name wasn't ever in the details of that quest. Plus, I had the "boon" active that lets you negotiate for better quest rewards with no quest active for it, but the game still said "you failed," despite not taking it yet.

I am not entirely sure how that would work. *surprised pikach face* You had no quest going on, then you agreed to a quest and it instantly failed, before you did anything? Sounds strange. Do you remember the name or the content of the quest? Tax quest? I think the people that you can encounter in any quest are created with a specific location where they are, at the same time as the selection of quests is created. If you check all the possible questgivers, you can often see them hang out beforehand, but if killing one of them makes one of the quests fail, that would indeed be a bug.

Oh, talking about bugs, DON'T play regular Griftlands, always play Griftlands Experimental. Regular Griftlands still has a swath of minor bugs, that have been fixed long ago in Griftlands Experimental.

[BlackMagicAngel]

42 minutes ago, AuntHerbert said:

I know that Sal's tax collection quest is an autofail if you, for example beat up a merchant or bilebroker, because their negotiations are too annoying, and then start a fight with any Admirality that shows up to investigate. Makes sense, given the purpose of the quest.

I am not entirely sure how that would work. *surprised pikach face* You had no quest going on, then you agreed to a quest and it instantly failed, before you did anything? Sounds strange. Do you remember the name or the content of the quest? Tax quest? I think the people that you can encounter in any quest are created with a specific location where they are, at the same time as the selection of quests is created. If you check all the possible questgivers, you can often see them hang out beforehand, but if killing one of them makes one of the quests fail, that would indeed be a bug.

Oh, talking about bugs, DON'T play regular Griftlands, always play Griftlands Experimental. Regular Griftlands still has a swath of minor bugs, that have been fixed long ago in Griftlands Experimental.

I try my best to explain this more clearly, since I don't remember names that well.

I think the quest was named "Another Day Older And Deeper in Debt." The way it worked was the request person was in a location, but before I started the quest, there was an Admiralty that was giving me a bane due to a past quest, and they were also in the same location as the quest person. I was on the Spree route for that run, and the quest that triggered the bane is the one that "defeat 3 Admirality people in battle. (You can leave them in panic.)

The way it worked was that before I ever talked to the person who was giving the quest, I talked to the "bane" Admiralty person, trigger that bane negotiation (which had a Matte argument so up), knocked out the Matte argument with 7 Matte pending and won. However, upon ending that negotiation, that 7 Matte never credit on my account (or whatever you would call it), and it show up in the rewards screen, either. (To summarized, what did the game tell me I could earn 7 Matte if it won't increase my Matte by 7 afterwards, and not display it in rewards.)

Afterwards, this lead to the battle, which I won, and resulted in her "defeat." Afterwards, I talked to the person that was giving the "Another Day..." quest, but the game just gave me 2 options:

1. Tell him that the Admiralty person I just defeated was defeated

2. Negotiation for better quest rewards

I couldn't under why option 1 was there, since I know that this quote didn't involve the Admiralty person I just defeated. Anyway, I did the negotiation quest and won, and I do have a screenshot of the person giving that quote, which I'll share in a bit.

But after finishing that negotiation for better pay, I was forced to pick option 1, and the game told me "since you killed that Admiralty person that hated you in the same location as the quest giver, this quest is a failure, even though I let you negotiation for better rewards for it a minute ago, and you didn't accept the quest yet." Again, it was marked as a failure, and I didn't even get an option to accept that quest during any of this time.

Does that clear the situation up? And as I said, here's a picture of the person that was offering the quest to me at the time, despite in the middle of the "negotiation for better pay" part of it.

And just to ask too, if I start a run in the regular verison of the game, would it carry over to the "beta" verison of it, and vice verison? I want to check to make sure that save data can carry over between different versions of the same game, as long as it's coming from the same account from Steam.

[AuntHerbert]

Forget what I said about Griftland Experimental. That is a version distributed by Epic Games. They still offer the original early-access version from June 2020 as "Griftlands" and the updated version as "Griftlands Experimental", due to, let's say "historical" reasons. The Steam version has the newest updates.

"Another day older and deeper in debt".... oh yeah, I remember. Quest giver is always a Civilian Laborer. They owe someone a huge amount of money and Sal is supposed to negotiate a relief. She can discuss with the debtholder, or beat them up, but if she kills them, the laborer is shocked, because they didn't want to hire a killer. That's why you failed the quest, as you provoked and killed the debtholder beforehand. That IS awkward and a bug in quest design, as there is no way to know at that time. If you get the quest normally it makes sense, to characterize the relationship.

I really think your mettle problem is a separate issue. Are you sure it was 7 stacks of mettle, and not just a lower amount of mettle with 7 resolve? Because 7 mettle seems a lot for an Admiralty goon at day 1, and I initially mixed up the amount of mettle and the resolve of the bounty, too, in such a situation, and was surprised when I only got 3 mettle or so. Then the next time in a comparable situation I looked again, and saw, that I mistook the resolve of the mettle bounty with the amount of mettle awarded, the stacks. Are you sure you didn't get any mettle at all? I think the "bug" in that case would be, that the amount of mettle is easy to miss, while the number for the resolve to overcome is quite visible. 

[BlackMagicAngel]

10 minutes ago, AuntHerbert said:

Forget what I said about Griftland Experimental. That is a version distributed by Epic Games. They still offer the original early-access version from June 2020 as "Griftlands" and the updated version as "Griftlands Experimental", due to, let's say "historical" reasons. The Steam version has the newest updates.

"Another day older and deeper in debt".... oh yeah, I remember. Quest giver is always a Civilian Laborer. They owe someone a huge amount of money and Sal is supposed to negotiate a relief. She can discuss with the debtholder, or beat them up, but if she kills them, the laborer is shocked, because they didn't want to hire a killer. That's why you failed the quest, as you provoked and killed the debtholder beforehand. That IS awkward and a bug in quest design, as there is no way to know at that time. If you get the quest normally it makes sense, to characterize the relationship.

I really think your mettle problem is a separate issue. Are you sure it was 7 stacks of mettle, and not just a lower amount of mettle with 7 resolve? Because 7 mettle seems a lot for an Admiralty goon at day 1, and I initially mixed up the amount of mettle and the resolve of the bounty, too, in such a situation, and was surprised when I only got 3 mettle or so. Then the next time in a comparable situation I looked again, and saw, that I mistook the resolve of the mettle bounty with the amount of mettle awarded, the stacks. Are you sure you didn't get any mettle at all? I think the "bug" in that case would be, that the amount of mettle is easy to miss, while the number for the resolve to overcome is quite visible. 

Actually, when I had that bane event, it was on day 4 of the campaign, and a new run after erasing the entire profile. The matte argument started with 8 stacks and 11 resolve. I knocked it out on turn 2, which is why I had 7 matte pending if I won. (It loses 1 stack every turn it is not defeated, until it disappears when it hits 0.) And yes, I did read the tooltips on that argument to know what it does. You did forget to ask what day that argument was on, since the higher the day number on a run, the better the rewards are, but the stronger the enemies get. I did see though that the day number isn't shown on that screenshot that I shared, though.

As for the quest itself, did you already know that the Admiralty was already killed before the quest was ever accepted? I already said that the game didn't give me an option to accept it. It just have me failed the quest upon the Admiralty's death, which happen before accepting any quests that I wanted to do. (Since you mentioned "that's why you failed it" and "it's a bug" in the same paragraph is confusing me about which side you're taking there. Sorry.) I think it's because both the Admiralty who hated me and the quest holder were in the same location, hence why the bug might have been caused there.

It is hard to explain when you see a bug happen on your side, especially when you try to explain it to other people who wasn't with you to see the same problem, and you don't have screenshots to back it up. 

[AuntHerbert]

1 hour ago, BlackMagicAngel said:

(Since you mentioned "that's why you failed it" and "it's a bug" in the same paragraph is confusing me about which side you're taking there. Sorry.) 

I think it is a design bug, and it caused you to fail the quest. But I tried to explain WHY that bug occured. Usually you don't meet the guy prior, but are sent to meet him, and if you then kill him it makes total sense storywise that you fail the quest. To avoid your experience, the quest must probably be re-written to make a check if the original target is still alive at the moment the quest is accepted, and have a prepared "reserve target" it can switch to in that case. That is a typical beta version bug, you just did something that no one thought of, when the quest was written, so the way the quest reacted made no sense.

There might be also an issue with the mettle reward, but I am 99% certain, that is a separate thing, just from my own bit of programming experience. There is really no reason for the procedure that awards mettle after a provoked fight to check for quests available on the map, or to have any variables in common, that could interfere. Not awarding mettle wouldn't be a design bug, but some bug with the programming of the specific procedure.

[BlackMagicAngel]

1 hour ago, AuntHerbert said:

I think it is a design bug, and it caused you to fail the quest. But I tried to explain WHY that bug occured. Usually you don't meet the guy prior, but are sent to meet him, and if you then kill him it makes total sense storywise that you fail the quest. To avoid your experience, the quest must probably be re-written to make a check if the original target is still alive at the moment the quest is accepted, and have a prepared "reserve target" it can switch to in that case. That is a typical beta version bug, you just did something that no one thought of, when the quest was written, so the way the quest reacted made no sense.

There might be also an issue with the mettle reward, but I am 99% certain, that is a separate thing, just from my own bit of programming experience. There is really no reason for the procedure that awards mettle after a provoked fight to check for quests available on the map, or to have any variables in common, that could interfere. Not awarding mettle wouldn't be a design bug, but some bug with the programming of the specific procedure.

I think the way you worded it here does make sense. Most likely, the failed quest bug triggered since both of those things happened at the same location, and I should have left the area and gone back into it after killing off the Admirity person to see if refreshing the area fixed the problem. However, the details you shared here makes sense for a patch to fix that problem.

As for the matte, I don't what else to say on it, other than the game didn't credit me the 7 matte I was owned afterwards. It's most likely a bug that should be fixed, so that when I have that mattle thing on my size, it will add the amount to my total for the character if I win. 

Also, I don't know if the matte bug triggered the problem with the quest, but both happened at the same location without me refreshing the area (go to the map and come back), or going back to the menu. That might have help it a bit, if possible.

[AuntHerbert]

Btw, its m e t t l e not matte, sorry.