On the topic of Strafe Jumping


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I'm an avid player of bhop and surf on the source engine. I also usually play Bunny Hop League. How the game handles air strafing and bunny hopping is off putting and even after hours of play I still get messed up on it. Specifically having to hold FORWARD and LEFT/RIGHT to do the air strafe, and you can only do one air strafe per jump. I'd love if both these issues were addressed, so you'd only have to hold LEFT/RIGHT and be able to alternate while still in the air.

Basically I'm wondering if the way it is now is basically the final model for the movement mechanics, or there is room for changing it to be closer to source engine mechanics.

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I would like to add a bit to this. I have done bhops in source games and actively run the L4D speedrunning community, which is a game that has its own beast of a bunnyhopping system. Also Portal 2.

I really appreciate the fact that it is built in to the game and has a nice, clear indication of how you are doing. I do feel that it could be adjusted to give players even more control over how they move, however, which is an important thing for a platformer. Particularly, the mechanic that locks you into a single strafe direction once one is held in the air feels quite odd, and I do think it is unnecessary to punish the player for switching directions when doing so frequently is vital to platforming accurately in this game. There are a few options I can think of for tweaking this, in order of what I think would be best to worst (without being able to playtest it),

- Allow building speed for both strafing directions, but only apply the bonus for whichever direction was greater. This doesn't change the current mechanic in any way, only opens it up so that you can strafe more freely where you need to, when you need to. It might be a good idea to hide the progress bar for the opposite strafe if you switch so it doesn't look like you need to fill both directions up? So only the bar shows for the direction you are currently strafing in. Possible that should also be what is applied rather than whichever direction is greater. If switching direction multiple times, your previously built progress should be saved.

- Similar to above, but have switching strafe simply overwrite the previous strafe's gain, and you just get whatever bonus you have at the time of jumping. This might feel punishing, unsure.

- Allow both directions to compound on each other for bonus. This is probably unreasonable since it will be a mechanic change as well as adjusting how much the bonus actually gives, and then require double strafing each jump, but it's still a thought to throw out there.

Either way, I would implore the developers to consider some option to open up the ability to effectively strafe in more than one direction per jump as I just feel held back right now and it will help to attract more bhop veterans to run it. I do recognize not everything needs to copy what's been done previously, even though this is clearly heavily inspired from engines like Source, and so I am not recommending a change to holding forward since it's not a problem to adjust to. I do think general strafe mechanics need to be looked at as I've laid out, though.

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Real talk, though, can someone explain (other than that Source games have apparently done it) why jumping left and right while strafing to go faster is even a mechanic? 
When there could have been 'keep forward momentum' or even the venerable 'hold the run faster button', why would you choose 'wiggle around' as a game's boost mechanic? Or just don't ever make it a necessity, and ideally let me turn it off entirely so I don't have random shifts in my speed as I play, and I'll happily play the game pretending there's no boost.
 

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6 hours ago, janusfenix said:

Real talk, though, can someone explain (other than that Source games have apparently done it) why jumping left and right while strafing to go faster is even a mechanic? 
When there could have been 'keep forward momentum' or even the venerable 'hold the run faster button', why would you choose 'wiggle around' as a game's boost mechanic? Or just don't ever make it a necessity, and ideally let me turn it off entirely so I don't have random shifts in my speed as I play, and I'll happily play the game pretending there's no boost.
 

It was a bug within source engine that caused it, and a lot of people used the bug to move quickly around maps within the game. It was then turned into its own thing with bunny hop. It's just the movement that people got used, and it's the most comfortable sort of movement to most people. And like Hot Lava, you still have to move the camera with the movement, so it's hard to accidentally do.

8 hours ago, TheMaster627 said:

- Allow building speed for both strafing directions, but only apply the bonus for whichever direction was greater. This doesn't change the current mechanic in any way, only opens it up so that you can strafe more freely where you need to, when you need to. It might be a good idea to hide the progress bar for the opposite strafe if you switch so it doesn't look like you need to fill both directions up? So only the bar shows for the direction you are currently strafing in. Possible that should also be what is applied rather than whichever direction is greater. If switching direction multiple times, your previously built progress should be saved.

I feel like a balanced way to do multiple directions is half the speed bonus each time you change direction. So your first turn in the air will do +.30, your second turn would do +.36 but instead does +.18, your third turn would do +.28 but instead does +.07. This would reset each time you jump off the ground. 

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On 11.4.2018 at 12:34 PM, tapperyaus said:

I'm an avid player of bhop and surf on the source engine. I also usually play Bunny Hop League. How the game handles air strafing and bunny hopping is off putting and even after hours of play I still get messed up on it. Specifically having to hold FORWARD and LEFT/RIGHT to do the air strafe, and you can only do one air strafe per jump. I'd love if both these issues were addressed, so you'd only have to hold LEFT/RIGHT and be able to alternate while still in the air.

Basically I'm wondering if the way it is now is basically the final model for the movement mechanics, or there is room for changing it to be closer to source engine mechanics.

You were actually able to alternate directions mid-air in an earlier build but the devs decided to get rid of that because it was a bit too easy for experienced players to gather insane amounts of speed in very few jumps and it also let you basically just go straight if you alternated fast enough. 

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11 hours ago, Fateless27 said:

You were actually able to alternate directions mid-air in an earlier build but the devs decided to get rid of that because it was a bit too easy for experienced players to gather insane amounts of speed in very few jumps and it also let you basically just go straight if you alternated fast enough. 

Was that before the current speed gain cap, though? I don't think the way speed gain caps needs changing, just needs to be opened up so you have more options for control in the air. I don't feel like limiting the player to a single strafe direction per jump is necessary.

Another thing I thought of is to simply have both directions count towards a single boost bar. Instead of separate bars on either side of the crosshair they just go up in tandem. No need to adjust the speed bonus or its cap.

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On 4/14/2018 at 12:31 AM, TheMaster627 said:

Was that before the current speed gain cap, though? I don't think the way speed gain caps needs changing, just needs to be opened up so you have more options for control in the air. I don't feel like limiting the player to a single strafe direction per jump is necessary.

Another thing I thought of is to simply have both directions count towards a single boost bar. Instead of separate bars on either side of the crosshair they just go up in tandem. No need to adjust the speed bonus or its cap.

Before the update it was just normal strafing.  The only big difference i noticed besides having to hold W was the speed gain cap.  With the new update for the first 20 min I didn't really like it but after giving it a chance im really glad they changed it.  It increases the skill gap so much and you can do everything you could before, its just a lot harder.  Also it doesn't really limit you to one direction per jump.  For example if you strafe left first, you can start strafing right and when you switch back to left you will still gain speed.  I use this a lot for far jumps because you get a better air path.

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