You should not touch the base numbers for circuits

[DVGMedia]

This past update has made alot of changes to the base circuits to be able to accommodate for the combinations of circuits. However I feel like that is not the right way to approach this. Skill trees are not supposed to change too much about the base character yet wx got the most of these changes. Because of that there was so much that the player could do cause now they have access to way more right out of the gate. without having to spend anything. 

Its kind of crazy that the player needs to spend points on the tree to just get some of  the circuits back to their normal status. 

There really is just something up with this tree and idk how much tweaking there is going to be to fix it up

I honestly kind of feel like they should scrap the beta gamma and alpha setup.  And just give wx 14 universal slots through upgrades. 

and give certain circuits diminishing returns after a set amount have been inserted. 
Speed circuit already has diminished returns for each addition one added so there definitely is another way to approach the tree 

having the 14 universal would actually give way more build variety than having the 21 separated into groups 

And the alpha and beta skill tree perks were there to give more benefits the other circuits making them more viable alternatives.
but having the dedicated slots basically made those benefits too strong so they had to be nerfed making them pointless.
Making other circuits more competitive for a universal slot would make  for a better wx tree instead of being able to use all the circuits right out of the gate

Edited April 3 by DVGMedia

[flamboyant wolf]

I would disagree. Specific changes from the hotfix aside, I don't think it's a bad thing in of itself.

I feel like avoiding base-kit changes would only lead to limiting the potential and making balancing harder, since anything new would have to be based on/built around an old, possibly in some ways flawed foundation.

[YouKnowWho142]

I think it's starting to become clear what it means for Klei to focus on the quality of just one tree. It's true, WX has a lot of cool ui/animation stuff, but I don't really think that cute little gamma circuit animations are what players are looking for here, especially with a character who already had quite a few problems going into this update.

It's also becoming extremely clear why the base characters have typically been hardly touched during these skill trees, namely that now Klei is building the character around the skill tree instead of the other way around. All of WX's new basekit changes accomodate specifically the skill tree, and now we are seeing the consequences of that by making the base character weaker and needing to play around the skill tree to regain that strength.

Edited April 3 by YouKnowWho142

[DVGMedia]

Just now, flamboyant wolf said:

I would disagree. Specific changes from the hotfix aside, I don't think it's a bad thing in of itself.

I feel like avoiding base-kit changes would only lead to limiting the potential and making balancing harder, since anything new would have to be based on/built around an old, possibly in some ways flawed foundation.

There is ways to do balance here which would be making it so that wx doesn't start with 21 slots. 
Thats the biggest problem for all of this. 

skill trees originally added onto the base of a character to allow them to do more.  And as the youknowwho142 said this tree is more about wx conforming to the tree instead of the tree being built around wx. 

It just doesn't feel right.  

[Koomin]

35 minutes ago, DVGMedia said:

There is ways to do balance here which would be making it so that wx doesn't start with 21 slots. 
Thats the biggest problem for all of this. 

skill trees originally added onto the base of a character to allow them to do more.  And as the youknowwho142 said this tree is more about wx conforming to the tree instead of the tree being built around wx. 

It just doesn't feel right.  

I feel like the extra slots was needed and was a good change.  Without the alpha beta gamma thing everyone just used 3x speed or sometimes a thermal circuit if they wanted to be lazy for a season.  Like 90% of the circuits were entirely wasted space, and there was nothing that could really be done about it.  The change made it possible for all the circuits to be used which is great.  But multiplying the circuits by 3 requires some of them to be toned down.  

I'm also not 100% sure on that the character is built around the skill tree - no skill points WX will still get 21 points now, which all these changes are needed for.  

Only thing that should really get changed back is electrification which was fine and pretty fun, and if they want to reduce beta stuff speed should get reduced instead as the clear overachiever (actually pretty baffled after thinking about it that electrification was chosen instead of speed for beta nerf).

[DVGMedia]

6 minutes ago, Koomin said:

I feel like the extra slots was needed and was a good change.  Without the alpha beta gamma thing everyone just used 3x speed or sometimes a thermal circuit if they wanted to be lazy for a season.  Like 90% of the circuits were entirely wasted space, and there was nothing that could really be done about it.  The change made it possible for all the circuits to be used which is great.  But multiplying the circuits by 3 requires some of them to be toned down.  

I'm also not 100% sure on that the character is built around the skill tree - no skill points WX will still get 21 points now, which all these changes are needed for.  

Only thing that should really get changed back is electrification which was fine and pretty fun, and if they want to reduce beta stuff speed should get reduced instead as the clear overachiever (actually pretty baffled after thinking about it that electrification was chosen instead of speed for beta nerf).

 Speed already gets nerfed the more you equip anyway  And with the alpha and beta skill tree perks were there to give more benefits to having the other circuits.
but having the dedicated slots basically made those benefits too strong so they had to be nerfed making them pointless. Making the other circuits more competitive for a universal slot would make A player choose more and mess with their builds with less because now they cant just have everything. Creativeity strives in famine than in feast. 

and since now all the others are nerfed there is basically no longer a reason to not just run speed circuits. 

Its better to make the others viable competition to the speed circuit rather than giving them their own  place to sit. 

Edited April 3 by DVGMedia

[Koomin]

1 minute ago, DVGMedia said:

 Speed already gets nerfed the more you equip anyway  And with the alpha and beta skill tree perks  there were more benefits to having the other circuits.
but having the dedicated slots basically made those benefits pointless.  A player would actually choose more with less because now they cant just have everything. Creativeity strives in famine than in feast. 

and since now all the others are nerfed there is basically no longer a reason to not just run speed circuits. 

Its better to make the others viable competition to the speed circuit rather than giving them their own  place to sit. 

Tbh was a bit confused by your first few sentences but I do agree with the last bit.

Toning down speed a bit and toning up (if that's a phrase?) the other beta circuits a bit would be great.