Do you want Fuelweaver to be

[Evelo]

34 minutes ago, Midow said:

strong item management,

I can appreciate your over all comment, but this here has always irritated me about Don't Starve Together focusing so much on combat over other content. This mechanic has become more and more important as boss fights are introduced during the Rift Arc. It is so unfriendly in terms of accessibility. I love challenge and am okay with it if said challenge wasn't so hindered by the general lack of accessibility tools. (For reference I play only with a left hand and use the keyboard, occasionally using the mouse to place objects using said left hand, it's why Crab King and AFW are so incredibly difficult for me compared to any other boss)

Edited January 20 by Evelo

[Redtooth]

Personally I think he's fine the way he is. The auto targeting on shield is a nuisance but that can be mitigated by simply learning how to position him around the arena. I don't see a reason why he needs a nerf given the whole shtick behind the fight is that you actually need to learn it as opposed to being able to face tank it without holding F. He is the only boss that actually makes you think about how you position yourself and manage cooldowns. Honestly, given how strong most skill trees are and the fact that brightshade gear is really good against him, he's not a hard boss to solo consistently after practicing it. You either learn how to fight him or overprepare.

[Evelo]

47 minutes ago, Redtooth said:

Personally I think he's fine the way he is. The auto targeting on shield is a nuisance but that can be mitigated by simply learning how to position him around the arena. I don't see a reason why he needs a nerf given the whole shtick behind the fight is that you actually need to learn it as opposed to being able to face tank it without holding F. He is the only boss that actually makes you think about how you position yourself and manage cooldowns. Honestly, given how strong most skill trees are and the fact that brightshade gear is really good against him, he's not a hard boss to solo consistently after practicing it. You either learn how to fight him or overprepare.

do it one handed and let me know how it goes.

[Edible Coal]

1 hour ago, Evelo said:

do it one handed and let me know how it goes.

i highly recommend you to try pausing during mid fight , it allows you to rearrange your inventory and plan out what to do in the chaos

afw fight difficulty actually comes from fighting the dst inventory system because is so bad to swap items in a quick manner, and not to mention if one of your gear is broken, it creates a hole in your inventory and your item start position them self all over the place.

also theres just way too much things to juggle in the fight ( hitting the bugs, insanity, also need to be insane to hit the hands, cage trapping you, health)

[DegenerateFurry]

Y'know, another thing I hate about Fuelweaver that I rarely see anyone mention is how high the threshold for mind control is. You don't have to be insane for him to do it, nor do you even have to be close to insane for him to mind control you. You basically have to keep your sanity full the whole fight because there's no clear indicator of when you're vulnerable and not otherwise. 

[Edible Coal]

15 minutes ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Y'know, another thing I hate about Fuelweaver that I rarely see anyone mention is how high the threshold for mind control is. You don't have to be insane for him to do it, nor do you even have to be close to insane for him to mind control you. You basically have to keep your sanity full the whole fight because there's no clear indicator of when you're vulnerable and not otherwise. 

i think you have to? unless someone else on the team triggers it

[DegenerateFurry]

Just now, Edible Coal said:

i think you have to? unless someone else on the team triggers it

I mostly play solo, he's mind-controlled me when I was at least at half sanity. I was Walter most recently but it's happened as other characters too.

Edited January 20 by DegenerateFurry

[Evelo]

55 minutes ago, Edible Coal said:

i highly recommend you to try pausing during mid fight , it allows you to rearrange your inventory and plan out what to do in the chaos

afw fight difficulty actually comes from fighting the dst inventory system because is so bad to swap items in a quick manner, and not to mention if one of your gear is broken, it creates a hole in your inventory and your item start position them self all over the place.

also theres just way too much things to juggle in the fight ( hitting the bugs, insanity, also need to be insane to hit the hands, cage trapping you, health)

Pause? You can't swap your inventory around while the menu is up. Is there some thing in the game I don't know about? Is it a mod?

Edited January 20 by Evelo

[Edible Coal]

Just now, Evelo said:

Pause? You can't swap your inventory around while the menu is up. Is there some thing in the game I don't know about?

you can bind a button that pauses the server, which you can swap items around ( and even rotate the camera), doesnt have to be in the pause menu

[Gashzer]

Having both played DST on pc and on Switch.

AFW isnt designed with controller targetting in mind. As said above. The targetting jank is the true boss not ancient fuelweaver. 

Please klei nerf ancient targetjank.

[AliceShiki]

3 hours ago, Edible Coal said:

you can bind a button that pauses the server, which you can swap items around ( and even rotate the camera), doesnt have to be in the pause menu

Oh hey, I didn't know about that. That's cool. I'm pretty terrible at inventory management, so this is good to know. 

As for how I feel about the fight... Uhn... Tried it solo before, and the need to manage sanity and inventory was way too overwhelming for me, and I don't play DST enough to even consider seriously trying to learn the fight, so it's kinda weird to give feedback on it when I'm pretty confident I'll never beat it solo without abusing console power... Maybe I might one day beat it with friends though, I dunno.

But well, even with a convenient brightshade staff spawned by the console it was still quite annoying to handle the spawning minions while constantly hitting his shield, so uhn... Yeah, guess I'll echo the thought of please make him untargetable by "F" and "Ctrl + F" while he is invulnerable.

Other than that, I don't have much to say... If anything, I dislike bosses healing in general, I guess? I feel like it's too punishing for players to make mistakes against healing bosses... I'd prefer if he instead got a shield from the woven shadows (as in, a shield that functions as extra HP that you can damage when he is not invulnerable), and this shield had a hard cap on it (like, 1000 Shield HP or something, for example. Numbers could be tweaked), so like... It would still create the effect of protecting the boss from your damage, but at least it would never undo your progress. Once you dealt enough dmg to break the shield, all dmg you dealt afterwards would be progress.

[Jakepeng99]

14 hours ago, Maxil20 said:

I think this could be interesting, but I feel it would be better to incorporate both at the same time? I'm specifically thinking of where either a set amount of HP is done and the 20 seconds elapse. That way you're not bodied by playing a higher damage character, but also not at a significant disadvantage compared to a lower damage one.

I dunno that does the opposite of what you want achieved.

[Mr Giggio]

You guys wanting to change the best concept of a fight the whole game has since the introduction of it just shows how it's impossible to make everyone happy.

Nothing will be more DST than the fuel weaver fight in every aspect possible and baffles me all this resistance just cuz it's a hard fight to learn

Like what is even the sense of reward if you defeat a final boss with a couple of easy clicks and hold F,  I just can't understand 

Edited January 20 by Mr Giggio

[Edible Coal]

2 hours ago, Mr Giggio said:

You guys wanting to change the best concept of a fight the whole game has since the introduction of it just shows how it's impossible to make everyone happy.

Nothing will be more DST than the fuel weaver fight in every aspect possible and baffles me all this resistance just cuz it's a hard fight to learn

Like what is even the sense of reward if you defeat a final boss with a couple of easy clicks and hold F,  I just can't understand 

celestial champion is the "final" boss of cc, yet people complain much less about it then afw.

afw feels much annoying to fight consider it throws tons of things at the player and require multiple expensive tools just to envade its attack while cc is just a regular boss fight but with more attacks and more phrases

[Cruvimaster]

16 minutes ago, Edible Coal said:

celestial champion is the "final" boss of cc, yet people complain much less about it then afw.

AFW is only the most complained about boss by that minority of 17% of the votes because it's the hardest boss. As soon as it becomes a trivial boss, that group will start attacking the other boss that occupies the new position. But that group will never complain that an easy boss should be buffed. That's their logic.

This minority makes so much noise in the forum that it seems like the majority. That's why polls are good.

[linabagel]

Whether it's in the field of art design or mechanism design, Fuelweaver has always been the best among all. 

What the players need is to learn how to switch and use different types of items.

Not to mention that in the version with SkillTrees and Brightshade-equipments, Fuelweaver really doesn't need to be nerfed.

[AliceShiki]

2 hours ago, Mr Giggio said:

You guys wanting to change the best concept of a fight the whole game has since the introduction of it just shows how it's impossible to make everyone happy.

Nothing will be more DST than the fuel weaver fight in every aspect possible and baffles me all this resistance just cuz it's a hard fight to learn

Like what is even the sense of reward if you defeat a final boss with a couple of easy clicks and hold F,  I just can't understand 

Because... Different people like different things?

AFW requires inventory management, something that the game doesn't usually require mid-battle... If someone disliked inventory management, they'll most likely dislike AFW.

It's not that complicated. It's just different people liking different things about the same game.

There is a reason why there have been posters advocating for an AFW nerf that also allows one to fight the original version of the fight if one chooses to do so... Because they're aware that different people like different things, and giving options to the players is the simplest way to please everyone... Well, everyone, except the people who don't like options existing, but I'll never understand the argument against options, so... >.>

[AuRuS]

11 hours ago, Evelo said:

I can appreciate your over all comment, but this here has always irritated me about Don't Starve Together focusing so much on combat over other content. This mechanic has become more and more important as boss fights are introduced during the Rift Arc. It is so unfriendly in terms of accessibility. I love challenge and am okay with it if said challenge wasn't so hindered by the general lack of accessibility tools. (For reference I play only with a left hand and use the keyboard, occasionally using the mouse to place objects using said left hand, it's why Crab King and AFW are so incredibly difficult for me compared to any other boss)

Inventory management is like one of the only ways to make bossfights interesting when the combat system is so dull as it is in DST. If the shadow rift final boss requires me to juggle between 4 different weapons, 5 helmets and 2 amulets then so be it, I'll take that with open arms even though it might be problematic while playing on ~200 ping servers.

With such niche problems as not playing with both hands for some reason I honestly think (hot take right there) that for starters this shouldn't be taken into consideration while designing new content and especially shouldn't take any of the dev time improving the single-handed gameplay since it benefits only a tiny fraction of the community and for the overwhelming majority it's just nothing. Problems like these should be resolved by your own initiative or by group effort of more people with that condition - maybe make a mod allowing for more flexibility of rebinding keys or something idk but don't hinder the experience of the majority because of it

[AliceShiki]

12 minutes ago, AuRuS said:

With such niche problems as not playing with both hands for some reason I honestly think (hot take right there)

Calling it "hot take" is a bit of a misnomer... It's more like a take that seriously lacks tact and empathy about someone who has a disability and is talking about how there are 2 specific bosses in the game that aren't friendly to a person with a disability while the rest of the game is.

As in... Wow, wtf? I'm not exactly surprised that there are people who don't care about accessibility in their hobbies, but I'm surprised that someone feels fine voicing it out loud... Geez.

[AuRuS]

5 minutes ago, AliceShiki said:

As in... Wow, wtf? I'm not exactly surprised that there are people who don't care about accessibility in their hobbies, but I'm surprised that someone feels fine voicing it out loud... Geez.

The need of devs taking the time out of their usual work to provide solutions for a microscopic fraction of the playerbase is in fact harmful (or at least NOT beneficial) for everyone else. If my eyesight is bad I dont need devs to provide me with a large text mode, I need to get myself a pair of glasses, it is really simple.

[AliceShiki]

23 minutes ago, AuRuS said:

The need of devs taking the time out of their usual work to provide solutions for a microscopic fraction of the playerbase is in fact harmful (or at least NOT beneficial) for everyone else. If my eyesight is bad I dont need devs to provide me with a large text mode, I need to get myself a pair of glasses, it is really simple.

Wait, are you really comparing a disability with needing glasses?

I have no words.

Edited January 20 by AliceShiki

[hyoton123]

4 hours ago, Mr Giggio said:

Like what is even the sense of reward if you defeat a final boss with a couple of easy clicks and hold F,  I just can't understand 

I mean, that’s fuelweaver right there. All of its gimmicks (shield, woven shadows, bone cage, mind control) are designed to distract you from fuelweaver itself literally being a treeguard. And I have serious issues with a boss where all of the mechanics are designed at preventing the player from playing the game, especially where the cure is item selection, not really inventory management insofar as DST items notoriously randomly move around to whatever slot is open. 
 

I don’t see how it could be controversial that fuelweaver is controversial. All of the gimmicks it has are designed at CCing or preventing players from executing a game plan. Thats exactly the kind of gameplay a lot of people dont like!

[Redtooth]

13 hours ago, Evelo said:

do it one handed and let me know how it goes.

I don't see a reason to do that myself but if you bind your keys properly I don't imagine it being impossible. You can animation cancel with keybinds and you don't need a mouse to stutter step so wovens aren't much of an issue either.

11 hours ago, DegenerateFurry said:

Y'know, another thing I hate about Fuelweaver that I rarely see anyone mention is how high the threshold for mind control is. You don't have to be insane for him to do it, nor do you even have to be close to insane for him to mind control you. You basically have to keep your sanity full the whole fight because there's no clear indicator of when you're vulnerable and not otherwise. 

The threshold is slightly higher than being sane for the any survivor but there are ways to cancel it (Lazy Explorer teleport) but the key is just doing teleporting early enough to break it. The other thing is that even if you do get your sanity high enough, there is a point to where it will still mind control you even if you get to full sanity. The mind control is also on a cooldown when you are insane, from my own tests with willow, he does 2 bone cages before he can mind control you again.

[Evelo]

11 hours ago, Edible Coal said:

you can bind a button that pauses the server, which you can swap items around ( and even rotate the camera), doesnt have to be in the pause menu

How long has that been there holy moly Guacamole! Oh my this changes everything. hugs kisses, everything thank you thank you. 

[aidancode]

Nerf or buff, I don't care. But please please please make this fight more consistent for singleplayer vs multiplayer. Either buff him for multiplayer or nerf him for singleplayer.