If you think Wendy would become OP due to the survival buff for Abi, we have more accessible options to adjust for balance's sake.

[blue fat]

We could nerf pipspooks line to ensure that "Cure-All" would not be abuse. We could to nerf Vex damage (particularly for Shadow Abi) to ensure that even Abi become "immortal" there's still no impact to current balance. We have no need to be obsessed with only the survival of Abi aspect.

[Debruh]

Nerfing pipspook line will damage the mourning glory line, along with Wendy's ability to craft elixirs

Nerfing Shadow Abby will harm her design as an alternative to the lunar branch, that priotizes damage over survivability.

The reason people are obsessed wirh nerfing Abby's survivability, is because Abby being fragile against bosses was Wendy's weakness from the start

A better way is to move the player tag thing to the lunar alignment skills. Freeing up the sisturn skills for a nice new effect that makes sense with both the shadow alignment's design, and the lunar alignment. Since currently, it doesn't mesh with the shadow alignments design wise, and completely outclasses the lunar alignments

[blue fat]

9 hours ago, Debruh said:

Nerfing pipspook line will damage the mourning glory line, along with Wendy's ability to craft elixirs

Nerfing Shadow Abby will harm her design as an alternative to the lunar branch, that priotizes damage over survivability.

The reason people are obsessed wirh nerfing Abby's survivability, is because Abby being fragile against bosses was Wendy's weakness from the start

A better way is to move the player tag thing to the lunar alignment skills. Freeing up the sisturn skills for a nice new effect that makes sense with both the shadow alignment's design, and the lunar alignment. Since currently, it doesn't mesh with the shadow alignments design wise, and completely outclasses the lunar alignments

When Wendy and Abigail fight together, Wendy has a 1.5 times damage multiplier, which is already quite high. Shadow Abigail doesn't need more damage as she is already too powerful. Instead of increasing her damage, the playability and interesting aspects of Shadow Abigail should be enhanced.

[Lardee]

The reason the survival buff needs to be removed is because it deletes Wendy's downside, not because it makes Wendy overall OP.

Character downsides matter just as much as upsides. Wendy's current downsides force players to be creative, think outside the box and adjust their playstyle to work around those downsides. If they do not feel like doing that, the game gives them the uncreative, but more costly option: Spectral Cure All.

If Klei were to remove Wendy's downside (which is what the Blessed Sisturn III does) Wendy ends up playing no differently than Wilson or Wolfgang against any enemy that Abigail can't solo.

This is the reason why Wendy's survivability needs to be reverted. Removing Wendy's upsides does nothing to solve this.

[blue fat]

26 minutes ago, Lardee said:

The reason the survival buff needs to be removed is because it deletes Wendy's downside, not because it makes Wendy overall OP.

Character downsides matter just as much as upsides. Wendy's current downsides force players to be creative, think outside the box and adjust their playstyle to work around those downsides. If they do not feel like doing that, the game gives them the uncreative, but more costly option: Spectral Cure All.

If Klei were to remove Wendy's downside (which is what the Blessed Sisturn III does) Wendy ends up playing no differently than Wilson or Wolfgang against any enemy that Abigail can't solo.

This is the reason why Wendy's survivability needs to be reverted. Removing Wendy's upsides does nothing to solve this.

I think some of what you said is correct. However, just a Player Tag doesn't bring about drastic changes to her disadvantages. She won't play in the same way as Wilson or Wolfgang. She still needs to use strategies to make sure that Abigail won't die during battles. You've adopted the wrong dialectical approach. You have ulterior motives and deliberately take things to extremes just to prove that you are right.

 

Appropriately enhancing Abigail's survivability will be beneficial for her to keep up with the current game version and prevent her from changing from a previously popular character to an unpopular one. Nowadays, Wendy is becoming less and less popular.

 

In previous versions, when there weren't so many powerful monsters in Don't Starve, Abigail was a very capable assistant for Wendy. With the update of the game version, it's getting more and more difficult for Abigail to assist Wendy. In the vast majority of cases, Wendy has been fighting alone. Such a relationship between sisters is not what it should be.

 

[Lardee]

Just now, blue fat said:

I think some of what you said is correct. However, just a Player Tag doesn't bring about drastic changes to her disadvantages. She won't play in the same way as Wilson or Wolfgang. She still needs to use strategies to make sure that Abigail won't die during battles. You've adopted the wrong dialectical approach. You have ulterior motives and deliberately take things to extremes just to prove that you are right.

Okay let's use an example. How does Wendy vs Deerclops differ from Wilson vs Deerclops if Abigail is unkillable?

 

Just now, blue fat said:

Appropriately enhancing Abigail's survivability will be beneficial for her to keep up with the current game version and prevent her from changing from a previously popular character to an unpopular one. Nowadays, Wendy is becoming less and less popular.

Her survivability has already been dramatically enhanced without Blessed Sisturn III. Do you have any sources to back up your claims about Wendy's popularity?

 

Just now, blue fat said:

In previous versions, when there weren't so many powerful monsters in Don't Starve, Abigail was a very capable assistant for Wendy. With the update of the game version, it's getting more and more difficult for Abigail to assist Wendy.

In the vast majority of cases, Wendy has been fighting alone. Such a relationship between sisters is not what it should be.

Wendy got her rework in 2020. At the time all the seasonal bosses were out, all the raid bosses except for Celestial Champion were out. There were plenty of powerful monsters that Abigail couldn't mindlessly tank, so "Abigail was a very capable assistant for Wendy" was no more true then than now. 

Wendy is capable of keeping Abigail alive against every boss in the game without Blessed Sisturn III.

 

[blue fat]

10 hours ago, Debruh said:

Nerfing pipspook line will damage the mourning glory line, along with Wendy's ability to craft elixirs

Nerfing Shadow Abby will harm her design as an alternative to the lunar branch, that priotizes damage over survivability.

The reason people are obsessed wirh nerfing Abby's survivability, is because Abby being fragile against bosses was Wendy's weakness from the start

A better way is to move the player tag thing to the lunar alignment skills. Freeing up the sisturn skills for a nice new effect that makes sense with both the shadow alignment's design, and the lunar alignment. Since currently, it doesn't mesh with the shadow alignments design wise, and completely outclasses the lunar alignments

I don't agree with the statement "The reason people are obsessed with nerfing Abby's survivability, is because Abby being fragile against bosses was Wendy's weakness from the start." In the early versions of Don't Starve, there weren't so many powerful bosses. However, in the current version, there are more and more powerful bosses, which has led to Abigail becoming weaker and weaker. Abigail is no longer suitable for the current version, and it's quite urgent to appropriately enhance her survivability. If we only increase her damage instead of improving her survivability, she will just become an unpopular character like Wes, only used by those who pursue the ultimate gaming experience. And she is already moving in that direction.

[thesooz9000]

Wendy is not moving in that direction, even if her skill tree added nothing, she will remain the most popular character for the simple fact that she makes day to day survival easier.

Blessed sisturn III must be removed / rebalanced imo

[blue fat]

2 minutes ago, Lardee said:

Okay let's use an example. How does Wendy vs Deerclops differ from Wilson vs Deerclops if Abigail is unkillable?

 

Her survivability has already been dramatically enhanced without Blessed Sisturn III. Do you have any sources to back up your claims about Wendy's popularity?

 

Wendy got her rework in 2020. At the time all the seasonal bosses were out, all the raid bosses except for Celestial Champion were out. There were plenty of powerful monsters that Abigail couldn't mindlessly tank, so "Abigail was a very capable assistant for Wendy" was no more true then than now. 

Wendy is capable of keeping Abigail alive against every boss in the game without Blessed Sisturn III.

 

But Abigail isn't invincible now. Do you understand what I mean? Have you taken this sentence to heart? Why did you say that Abigail is invincible? Is she invincible now?

 

The decline in Wendy's popularity was concluded by me through some player exchanges in the game community and my own gaming experience. There are a lot of voices from exchanges among players in the community showing that many players gave up using Wendy because she was too weak when facing bosses. After experiencing other characters, they just stopped choosing Wendy. I'm the same. The character I mainly play now is the Valkyrie.

From my own online gaming experience, Wendy is hardly seen in online games. I only chose Wendy when I was a novice and played with others. Since then, during a long period of time when I played with others, I haven't seen Wendy being chosen again.

[Steorra]

10 hours ago, Debruh said:

Nerfing pipspook line will damage the mourning glory line, along with Wendy's ability to craft elixirs

it won't. Since other uses of Glories has low value.

 

10 hours ago, Debruh said:

Nerfing Shadow Abby will harm her design as an alternative to the lunar branch, that priotizes damage over survivability.

It won't. Shadow Abby has broken amounts already, especially after the newest patch. 

Nerfing this only do harm to those who are Veteran. So it is unpopular idea to these people.

On the other side, nerfing survival of Abi do no harm to Veteran, that's why these guys would insist to nerf the survival of Abi but ingore the broken DPS from Shadow Abi continously.

This is a simply gatekeeping.

[thesooz9000]

1 minute ago, blue fat said:

But Abigail isn't invincible now. Do you understand what I mean? Have you taken this sentence to heart? Why did you say that Abigail is invincible? Is she invincible now?

 

With blessed sisturn III, abigail can facetank deerclops with spectral cure-all without ever dying lol, she can also facetank dfly aswell. she has triple or quadruple tanking time against certain other bosses aswell

1 minute ago, Steorra said:

it won't. Since other uses of Glories has low value.

 

It won't. Shadow Abby has broken amounts already, especially after the newest patch. 

Nerfing this only do harm to those who are Veteran. So it is unpopular idea to these people.

On the other side, nerfing survival of Abi do no harm to Veteran, that's why these guys would insist to nerf the survival of Abi but ingore the broken DPS from Shadow Abi continously.

This is a simply gatekeeping.

My balance suggestion for Blessed Sisturn III was to remove it from being useable on shadow and basic abigail, and only being use-able on gestalt abigail.

[Lardee]

Just now, blue fat said:

But Abigail isn't invincible now. Do you understand what I mean? Have you taken this sentence to heart? Why did you say that Abigail is invincible? Is she invincible now?

She is though. As long as you have Spectral Cure All, Abigail outheals Deerclops.

Just now, blue fat said:

 

The decline in Wendy's popularity was concluded by me through some player exchanges in the game community and my own gaming experience. There are a lot of voices from exchanges among players in the community showing that many players gave up using Wendy because she was too weak when facing bosses. After experiencing other characters, they just stopped choosing Wendy. I'm the same. The character I mainly play now is the Valkyrie.

From my own online gaming experience, Wendy is hardly seen in online games. I only chose Wendy when I was a novice and played with others. Since then, during a long period of time when I played with others, I haven't seen Wendy being chosen again.

So no evidence, just personal opinion.

In my experience, Wendy is still the most popular character in DST by far.

[Steorra]

10 minutes ago, thesooz9000 said:

 

My balance suggestion for Blessed Sisturn III was to remove it from being useable on shadow and basic abigail, and only being use-able on gestalt abigail.

No. Regular Abi does matter, she should become a valuable playstyle option.

And basic survival enhancement for Abi is important for casual players. It should be more easier to activate for them.

Remove player tag from Shadow and Lunar Abi, nerf Shadow abi by extra damage taken, rework lunar abi become completely invisible but dealt no damage if Wendy stop attacking would be better for every playstyle.

[blue fat]

9 minutes ago, thesooz9000 said:

With blessed sisturn III, abigail can facetank deerclops with spectral cure-all without ever dying lol, she can also facetank dfly aswell. she has triple or quadruple tanking time against certain other bosses aswell

The Deerclops and the Dragonfly are rather weak bosses. Those are the only two examples you can give. Can you name more examples? And that's under the condition that Abigail needs to use the Spectral Cure-All. However, how many bosses are there in the game now? You said, "she has triple or quadruple tanking time against certain other bosses as well". But how long can Abigail survive in a boss fight now? Against some bosses, she may not even survive for a few seconds. Have you ever thought about considering it from this aspect? How long does it take to defeat a boss?

8 minutes ago, Lardee said:

She is though. As long as you have Spectral Cure All, Abigail outheals Deerclops.

So no evidence, just personal opinion.

In my experience, Wendy is still the most popular character in DST by far.

Why the Deerclops again? Isn't the Deerclops the weakest boss in Don't Starve? Why use the weakest boss as an example instead of a boss with an average level of difficulty?

[thesooz9000]

4 minutes ago, blue fat said:

The Deerclops and the Dragonfly are rather weak bosses. Those are the only two examples you can give. Can you name more examples? And that's under the condition that Abigail needs to use the Spectral Cure-All. However, how many bosses are there in the game now? You said, "she has triple or quadruple tanking time against certain other bosses as well". But how long can Abigail survive in a boss fight now? Against some bosses, she may not even survive for a few seconds. Have you ever thought about considering it from this aspect? How long does it take to defeat a boss?

Why the Deerclops again? Isn't the Deerclops the weakest boss in Don't Starve? Why use the weakest boss as an example instead of a boss with an average level of difficulty?

 

[Lardee]

2 minutes ago, blue fat said:

The Deerclops and the Dragonfly are rather weak bosses. Those are the only two examples you can give. Can you name more examples? And that's under the condition that Abigail needs to use the Spectral Cure-All. However, how many bosses are there in the game now? You said, "she has triple or quadruple tanking time against certain other bosses as well". But how long can Abigail survive in a boss fight now? Against some bosses, she may not even survive for a few seconds. Have you ever thought about considering it from this aspect? How long does it take to defeat a boss?

How about you pick a boss.

Spectral Cure All is so cheap that you can get around 8 for every hunt. That's half a game day of invincibility per pipspook.

[blue fat]

16 minutes ago, Lardee said:

How about you pick a boss.

Spectral Cure All is so cheap that you can get around 8 for every hunt. That's half a game day of invincibility per pipspook.

Is the cost of Spectral Cure-All really low? Doesn't it take time to gather Pipspooks? Are you sure that you can obtain around eight each time you hunt? Why can I only get two each time I hunt at present? In the test server, the Pipspooks obtained can only be used to make three or four. And it also costs forty blood to make one.

 

As for Werepigs, Toadstool and Frostjaw, could you please talk about whether Abigail is invincible or rather vulnerable under their attacks?

[Lardee]

6 minutes ago, blue fat said:

Is the cost of Spectral Cure-All really low? Doesn't it take time to gather Pipspooks? Are you sure that you can obtain around eight each time you hunt? Why can I only get two each time I hunt at present? In the test server, the Pipspooks obtained can only be used to make three or four. And it also costs forty blood to make one.

Yes:

 

6 minutes ago, blue fat said:

As for Werepigs, Toadstool and Frostjaw, could you please talk about whether Abigail is invincible or rather vulnerable under their attacks?

How about I do you one better. Here's Wendy vs her absolute worst matchup. Blessed Sisturn III makes Abigail practically invincible which makes Wendy fight him no differently than Wilson/Wolfgang.

 

[blue fat]

5 hours ago, Lardee said:

Yes:

 

How about I do you one better. Here's Wendy vs her absolute worst matchup. Blessed Sisturn III makes Abigail practically invincible which makes Wendy fight him no differently than Wilson/Wolfgang.

 

Sorry, i cant load this attachment from websit www.youtube-nocookie.com .

[Debruh]

8 hours ago, Steorra said:

won't. Since other uses of Glories has low value

The mourning glory head item is 6 mourning glory on its own

Not to mention that elixirs that will be crafted for it