Walter Ammunition Thoughts

[Chestworth]

Ive been having a blast enjoying the beta branch with the three characters Wendy, Wortox, and Walter.
I am not a Walter main by an merit but I am looking forward to seeing the future updates they have after christmas break on tuning some perks and I have my thoughts onto what id like to see from Walters skill tree.

I love the idea for Walter to be able to craft special alignment rounds! I think I will be definitely using the Pure Horror Rounds as they are quite unique and pretty strong.

The Ichor round I feel definitely have their place in this being a late game ammunition (i also tried honey rounds  + ichor rounds and it was amazing)|

One thing I have thought though is the dread stone rounds, Now they may have said something about altering them or changing them and I havent seen it yet but, if it hasnt come up id like to express my thoughts on the rounds.

I feel the dread stone rounds being a craft that doesnt require the shadow alignment feels a bit out of place. I would love to see all 3 of these shadow magic rounds in one perk.

The other thing I wanted to talk about was resource costs and damage outputs on these rounds.

Of course- Ichor does 0 Damage but slows them more than honey rounds, however, I may have a slight preference to either have them do small damage numbers or slow them down more.

The Pure Horror rounds are an amazing ammo. With each round doing an initial 37 DMG and then linger another 70 DMG (There are some cool animations tied to it in having nightmare minion like creatures fly around them and hit them 7 times, each doing 10 DMG) With both sets of ammo conserving perks- you can get 120 of these rounds for 4 pure horror. Which for 4 pure horror and 4 rocks I think is amazing in my opinion! With all of that added up- each shot dealt 107 DMG with no modifiers, Which is 12,840 damage from 4 pure horror and 4 rocks. Which for a ranged character- that sounds amazing and it is!

My problem starts to slip with dread stone rounds. Now yes, they arent a part of the alignment- (which I personally think they should) but, each round does 68 DMG per shot with a chance to regain that round as it drops on the floor. My problem arises in this in that dread stone is hard to gather. Im not saying its impossible- but I think that for something that is very valuable such as dread stone should do more damage. 

My reasoning behind this is that yes- you have a chance to regain that ammunition- but in a fight its going to be on the ground and picking up ammo off the floor mid fight might not go well- forcing people into potentially very dangerous positions. 

The other problem is that dread stone quite a bit more difficult to gather than pure horror. Every Shadow rift spawns Fused Shadelings which drop 2-4 pure horror a piece and they are quite frequent with this graph from the Dont Starve Wiki

So at tier 3 they can have a max of 5 shadelings out at a time and respawn 1 every minute. 
So every 60 seconds you can get 2-4 Pure horror when it is at phase 3

Phase 3 lasts around 5 days so if you did sit there for 5 days straight (You poor soul) you would get 40 minutes of shadelings

which is 40 shadelings in 5 days which gives you 80-120 pure horror.

Thats also not counting the other shadows such as Nightmare werepig dropping 4-5 Pure Horror, The Resting horrors dropping 1 upon being startled, and 4-7 pure horror total for killing Rasp, Jitters, and Shriek (The Shadow Thralls)

Which just for the funnies and because I like math- 80-120 pure horror makes at most- 2,400-3,600 Pure horror rounds. Which again- because math is fun- 2400-3600 rounds does 256,800-385,200 Damage. That is enough rounds to kill 11-17 beequeens. I love it-

With Dread stone rounds though- they need 1 dreadstone a piece. So 4 dread stone makes 120 ammo with the max walter ammo perks

Each doing 68 damage which leaves us at 8,160 damage for 4 dreadstone VS 12,840 damage for 4 pure horror and 4 rocks.

To get dread stone you get 3-4 per pillar from the nightmare werepig which then you have to go kill on the surface as the scrappy werepig to get more dread stone, and 3 from the dread stone outcrops. (if you count wilson then yes- he can turn 3 pure horror into 1 dreadstone)

 

Now I dont think nerfing pure horror rounds is the way to go but instead I think we should make some changes.

-Making Dreadstone a shadow alignment ammo

-Make Dreadstone do more damamge- potentially around 70-75

-Instead of the Dreadstone ammo dropping at the enemies feet we could have it come back into our slingshot. (The way I thought this would work is when it hits and you see it break animation- it reforms- and hurls itself back at out and putting it in your slingshot or inventory)

 

Im curious what others may think of Walters skill tree because im actually excited to play a character I dont usually ever play. I feel ive played all the others besides Wes. 

Which I mean- Thats just a given- 
But im excited to play walter and even if this wasnt to be added id probably still enjoy the skill tree nonetheless! 

[Mysterious box]

5 minutes ago, Chestworth said:

Ive been having a blast enjoying the beta branch with the three characters Wendy, Wortox, and Walter.
I am not a Walter main by an merit but I am looking forward to seeing the future updates they have after christmas break on tuning some perks and I have my thoughts onto what id like to see from Walters skill tree.

I love the idea for Walter to be able to craft special alignment rounds! I think I will be definitely using the Pure Horror Rounds as they are quite unique and pretty strong.

The Ichor round I feel definitely have their place in this being a late game ammunition (i also tried honey rounds  + ichor rounds and it was amazing)|

One thing I have thought though is the dread stone rounds, Now they may have said something about altering them or changing them and I havent seen it yet but, if it hasnt come up id like to express my thoughts on the rounds.

I feel the dread stone rounds being a craft that doesnt require the shadow alignment feels a bit out of place. I would love to see all 3 of these shadow magic rounds in one perk.

The other thing I wanted to talk about was resource costs and damage outputs on these rounds.

Of course- Ichor does 0 Damage but slows them more than honey rounds, however, I may have a slight preference to either have them do small damage numbers or slow them down more.

The Pure Horror rounds are an amazing ammo. With each round doing an initial 37 DMG and then linger another 70 DMG (There are some cool animations tied to it in having nightmare minion like creatures fly around them and hit them 7 times, each doing 10 DMG) With both sets of ammo conserving perks- you can get 120 of these rounds for 4 pure horror. Which for 4 pure horror and 4 rocks I think is amazing in my opinion! With all of that added up- each shot dealt 107 DMG with no modifiers, Which is 12,840 damage from 4 pure horror and 4 rocks. Which for a ranged character- that sounds amazing and it is!

My problem starts to slip with dread stone rounds. Now yes, they arent a part of the alignment- (which I personally think they should) but, each round does 68 DMG per shot with a chance to regain that round as it drops on the floor. My problem arises in this in that dread stone is hard to gather. Im not saying its impossible- but I think that for something that is very valuable such as dread stone should do more damage. 

My reasoning behind this is that yes- you have a chance to regain that ammunition- but in a fight its going to be on the ground and picking up ammo off the floor mid fight might not go well- forcing people into potentially very dangerous positions. 

The other problem is that dread stone quite a bit more difficult to gather than pure horror. Every Shadow rift spawns Fused Shadelings which drop 2-4 pure horror a piece and they are quite frequent with this graph from the Dont Starve Wiki

So at tier 3 they can have a max of 5 shadelings out at a time and respawn 1 every minute. 
So every 60 seconds you can get 2-4 Pure horror when it is at phase 3

Phase 3 lasts around 5 days so if you did sit there for 5 days straight (You poor soul) you would get 40 minutes of shadelings

which is 40 shadelings in 5 days which gives you 80-120 pure horror.

Thats also not counting the other shadows such as Nightmare werepig dropping 4-5 Pure Horror, The Resting horrors dropping 1 upon being startled, and 4-7 pure horror total for killing Rasp, Jitters, and Shriek (The Shadow Thralls)

Which just for the funnies and because I like math- 80-120 pure horror makes at most- 2,400-3,600 Pure horror rounds. Which again- because math is fun- 2400-3600 rounds does 256,800-385,200 Damage. That is enough rounds to kill 11-17 beequeens. I love it-

With Dread stone rounds though- they need 1 dreadstone a piece. So 4 dread stone makes 120 ammo with the max walter ammo perks

Each doing 68 damage which leaves us at 8,160 damage for 4 dreadstone VS 12,840 damage for 4 pure horror and 4 rocks.

To get dread stone you get 3-4 per pillar from the nightmare werepig which then you have to go kill on the surface as the scrappy werepig to get more dread stone, and 3 from the dread stone outcrops. (if you count wilson then yes- he can turn 3 pure horror into 1 dreadstone)

 

Now I dont think nerfing pure horror rounds is the way to go but instead I think we should make some changes.

-Making Dreadstone a shadow alignment ammo

-Make Dreadstone do more damamge- potentially around 70-75

-Instead of the Dreadstone ammo dropping at the enemies feet we could have it come back into our slingshot. (The way I thought this would work is when it hits and you see it break animation- it reforms- and hurls itself back at out and putting it in your slingshot or inventory)

 

Im curious what others may think of Walters skill tree because im actually excited to play a character I dont usually ever play. I feel ive played all the others besides Wes. 

Which I mean- Thats just a given- 
But im excited to play walter and even if this wasnt to be added id probably still enjoy the skill tree nonetheless! 

I can't really agree the lunar side is already not doing too well vs the shadow side giving this on top of it would just make shadow too much of a better option. For context with a void robe dreadstone rounds do 10 more damage on top of them being recoverable and with the possessed slingshot band it becomes even more resource efficient while the lunar side is kinda starved.

[Chestworth]

53 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

I can't really agree the lunar side is already not doing too well vs the shadow side giving this on top of it would just make shadow too much of a better option. For context with a void robe dreadstone rounds do 10 more damage on top of them being recoverable and with the possessed slingshot band it becomes even more resource efficient while the lunar side is kinda starved.

I appreciate the opinion! I do see that im not paying much attention to the lunar side which I definitely am at fault for that. So maybe instead the underlying problem is the ammo for the lunar side. Such things like- explosive munitions. Since over time I feel I see the Shadow side become the persistent low but constant damamge VS Lunar being low firing rates with massive outputs of damamge. I wonder if maybe charging a giant shot would be in the realm of possibilities in making the lunar side stronger. Also adding another munition to the lunar side is another nice thought- Like if we had the shadow side with the Ichor, Pure horror, and Dreadstone VS the Pure Brilliance, Brightshade, and Infused moonglass? Im not sure but I hope to see the other side get more love too!

[Mysterious box]

1 minute ago, Chestworth said:

I appreciate the opinion! I do see that im not paying much attention to the lunar side which I definitely am at fault for that. So maybe instead the underlying problem is the ammo for the lunar side. Such things like- explosive munitions. Since over time I feel I see the Shadow side become the persistent low but constant damamge VS Lunar being low firing rates with massive outputs of damamge. I wonder if maybe charging a giant shot would be in the realm of possibilities in making the lunar side stronger. Also adding another munition to the lunar side is another nice thought- Like if we had the shadow side with the Ichor, Pure horror, and Dreadstone VS the Pure Brilliance, Brightshade, and Infused moonglass? Im not sure but I hope to see the other side get more love too!

I feel like that would just widen the gap as the shadow side already offers more utility I feel like instead they should just keep things as they are but boost the vine spawn chance of husk rounds to 50% like cursed rounds so it becomes dot and utility vs power. Otherwise if they lock dreadstone behind the shadow path then icker should take it's place. 

[Chestworth]

4 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

I feel like that would just widen the gap as the shadow side already offers more utility I feel like instead they should just keep things as they are but boost the vine spawn chance of husk rounds to 50% like cursed rounds so it becomes dot and utility vs power. Otherwise if they lock dreadstone behind the shadow path then icker should take it's place. 

Im fine with that too! I just thought it was odd that something that required a somewhat endgame material would be one of the normal perks. It just threw me through a loop essentially