If lunar abi has the same performance as before, but can't fight bosses alone, will you bring her back?

[YuRinshue]

13 minutes ago, Koomin said:

Again- whether Wortox has downsides or not is not relevant to this discussion, so I'm not sure why you are linking videos about Wortox.  The topic is about Wendy.  My opinion is that I would not find her fun or interesting to play if her downsides were removed.  I don't know why watching a Wortox speed run would be relevant to that.

I agree with you that focusing on Wendy post-rift is the correct choice.  I would be happy if her skill tree was weakened before rifts, and strengthened after rifts.  I have made many posts saying specifically that.  We agree, as long as both the weakening and strengthening happen.  I do not agree that bringing back the too strong, ignorable, and unfun previous Gestalt Abigail is the way to do it, even if she can't solo bossss.  Having Abigail survive without me doing anything is not fun for me, and so that version was not fun for me.  I would be open to supporting other ideas, but not that one.

 

Aren't you asking me about my understanding of the game Wotokes? Why else do I need to show you this video? It has been proven that the so-called food weakness of Votox can be completely ignored by the skill tree in such a harsh environment. May I ask where the viewpoint that 'skill trees cannot eliminate shortcomings' comes from?

 

Why mention the previous moon Abigail? Because the current moon Abigail is completely mismatched with the effect that Wendy should have put in so much effort, and the previous moon Abigail is the only matching method that has been made. I am looking forward to you coming up with a better plan, but every time I see you only saying 'no, no, we need to weaken' or only giving a 'pretended effective plan'. Before providing a truly satisfactory solution, I believe you should not reject a completed plan that is already ready, which is the reason for my discussion.

[Koomin]

6 hours ago, YuRinshue said:

Aren't you asking me about my understanding of the game Wotokes? Why else do I need to show you this video? It has been proven that the so-called food weakness of Votox can be completely ignored by the skill tree in such a harsh environment. May I ask where the viewpoint that 'skill trees cannot eliminate shortcomings' comes from?

 

Why mention the previous moon Abigail? Because the current moon Abigail is completely mismatched with the effect that Wendy should have put in so much effort, and the previous moon Abigail is the only matching method that has been made. I am looking forward to you coming up with a better plan, but every time I see you only saying 'no, no, we need to weaken' or only giving a 'pretended effective plan'. Before providing a truly satisfactory solution, I believe you should not reject a completed plan that is already ready, which is the reason for my discussion.

I asked you, YuRinshue, about your play style and experiences with Wortox.  I asked about how you, YuRinshue, interact with and enjoy or not enjoy his downsides when you play as him.  That would be relevant here, since we are discussing whether removing downsides makes things fun or not.  Sending me a video of someone else that is not you playing Wortox has nothing to do with your experiences playing Wortox and nothing to do with the topic.  Wortox as a whole barely has anything to do with this discussion about Wendy.

And again, I don't agree with the moon Abigail suggestion because it would make the character not fun for me.  I have discussed why.  Implementing a plan that makes a character no longer fun for me to play just because it is ready is not a plan I want.

I've been trying to keep this discussion going since it seems important, but we seem to be having communication issues, so I might leave this one here.

[YuRinshue]

2 hours ago, Koomin said:

I asked you, YuRinshue, about your play style and experiences with Wortox.  I asked about how you, YuRinshue, interact with and enjoy or not enjoy his downsides when you play as him.  That would be relevant here, since we are discussing whether removing downsides makes things fun or not.  Sending me a video of someone else that is not you playing Wortox has nothing to do with your experiences playing Wortox and nothing to do with the topic.  Wortox as a whole barely has anything to do with this discussion about Wendy.

And again, I don't agree with the moon Abigail suggestion because it would make the character not fun for me.  I have discussed why.  Implementing a plan that makes a character no longer fun for me to play just because it is ready is not a plan I want.

I've been trying to keep this discussion going since it seems important, but we seem to be having communication issues, so I might leave this one here.

I have already used Votox's method in the video, and I don't understand why you need me to explain this multiple times. Through the skill tree, I am completely unaffected by the "food gain" and can easily achieve the progress goals in the game, which is what I want to express. There is no such thing as a 'skill tree cannot eliminate a weakness', let alone a weakness that requires you to spend more cost to access, which is regrettable.
Do you want to emphasize that the content that you cannot choose when choosing another route should not exist? This is not a default option, if you don't like it yourself, you can choose a route that contradicts it.
I completely don't understand what you're trying to express in this paragraph. Just because you don't like it, do you want to erase a non default option?
I also like to come to effective conclusions, but our communication has made me doubt the feasibility of this viewpoint. An option at a fork in the road provides another content that cannot exist simultaneously. Your persistence has caused the part you originally did not choose to disappear. This is all the content expressed in your words.

[Uedo]

18 minutes ago, YuRinshue said:

I have already used Votox's method in the video, and I don't understand why you need me to explain this multiple times. Through the skill tree, I am completely unaffected by the "food gain" and can easily achieve the progress goals in the game, which is what I want to express. There is no such thing as a 'skill tree cannot eliminate a weakness', let alone a weakness that requires you to spend more cost to access, which is regrettable.
Do you want to emphasize that the content that you cannot choose when choosing another route should not exist? This is not a default option, if you don't like it yourself, you can choose a route that contradicts it.
I completely don't understand what you're trying to express in this paragraph. Just because you don't like it, do you want to erase a non default option?
I also like to come to effective conclusions, but our communication has made me doubt the feasibility of this viewpoint. An option at a fork in the road provides another content that cannot exist simultaneously. Your persistence has caused the part you originally did not choose to disappear. This is all the content expressed in your words.

My dude, it's getting so hard to follow what you're saying. I think this may be an issue with the translation software you're using, the sentences make sense but only just.

[YuRinshue]

9 hours ago, Uedo said:

Mydude, it's getting so hard to follow what you're saying. I think this may be an issue with the translation software you're using, the sentences makesense but only just.

ok In short, I just want the game to be more fun, having choices is always more fun than having no choices. I strongly oppose creating various' unwritten rules' to limit choices.

[Uedo]

7 hours ago, YuRinshue said:

ok In short, I just want the game to be more fun, having choices is always more fun than having no choices. I strongly oppose creating various' unwritten rules' to limit choices.

Well if that's Klei's choice, that's their choice. You can't argue that you should get your way because you're you. 

[YuRinshue]

4 hours ago, Uedo said:

Well if that's Klei's choice, that's their choice. You can't argue that you should get your way because you're you.

If you stand from the perspective of unrelated people, your ideas are reasonable. However, the relationship between KLei and players should never be like this. Consumers have the right to make demands to manufacturers, and manufacturers have a necessary obligation to respond. If your long-standing opposition to our views has been built around blurring the relationship between manufacturers and consumers, then I can only say that this kind of communication was pathetic to the extreme from the beginning, like a traitor.

[Uedo]

2 hours ago, YuRinshue said:

If you stand from the perspective of unrelated people, your ideas are reasonable. However, the relationship between KLei and players should never be like this. Consumers have the right to make demands to manufacturers, and manufacturers have a necessary obligation to respond. If your long-standing opposition to our views has been built around blurring the relationship between manufacturers and consumers, then I can only say that this kind of communication was pathetic to the extreme from the beginning, like a traitor.

It's specific language like that that makes me feel this MUST be a translation issue. Yes, that's absolutely what i'm saying. I have purchased the game, I have received what I payed for and more. I am in no position to make demands. I feel there's some type of bias i'm missing here, cause we both have wildly different views on what a manufacture (which they're not) should provide to their customers.

Maybe i'm not understanding something, Why should the relationship between Klei and players not be like this? You make a lot of statements but don't give your reasoning.

'manufacturers have a necessary obligation to respond' Erm, no they don't. Remember that you're applying consumer law to a country you don't operate in. A manufacturer does not have an obligation to do this, that would invalidate the concept of a free market - If their practice was unfavourable or poor, our system would allow consumers to choose other manufacturers who operate at a higher standard. That's how it works here.

[YuRinshue]

4 hours ago, Uedo said:

It's specific language like that that makes me feel this MUST be a translation issue. Yes, that's absolutely what i'm saying. I have purchased the game, I have received what I payed for and more. I am in no position to make demands. I feel there's some type of bias i'm missing here, cause we both have wildly different views on what a manufacture (which they're not) should provide to their customers.

Maybe i'm not understanding something, Why should the relationship between Klei and players not be like this? You make a lot of statements but don't give your reasoning.

'manufacturers have a necessary obligation to respond' Erm, no they don't. Remember that you're applying consumer law to a country you don't operate in. A manufacturer does not have an obligation to do this, that would invalidate the concept of a free market - If their practice was unfavourable or poor, our system would allow consumers to choose other manufacturers who operate at a higher standard. That's how it works here.

I can see your thoughts quite clearly now. While you voluntarily gave up your rights, you also demanded that others give up their rightful rights.
Your behavior is just proof that you don't care about DST getting worse. This is a pure sense of self deception and satisfaction, deeply unaware of the consumer's inherent right to correction and its important role in improving product quality.

“I am in no position to make demands. ”， How could you say such an incredibly lowly sentence?
In your words, what is the purpose of the negative review? What is the purpose of the feedback? Since you feel that you are 'unqualified', your opposition to me here is even more 'unqualified'. All your statements related to DST are 'unqualified', this is the only way for you to practice your standards, rather than coming to this feedback platform to tell me 'you are unqualified'.

I used to not know why DST has become worse and worse in the past two years, but now I have found the reason from you. It is your cowardly and pitiful attitude that has facilitated all of this, which really makes me angry. I feel like I have wasted so much of my time with you.

Why do you ask me for feedback and opposition? Firstly, because I have the right and obligation as a consumer; Secondly, I hope that the game that has left me with 10 years of memories can go uphill instead of getting worse. I don't care if you don't have such a fighting spirit. In the end, you will still enjoy everything that others have fought for. But if you dare to support KLei's mistakes and stand in front of everyone like me, I can only say that you are really seriously ill.