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How to cool your base?


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All this heat reduction is super counterintuitive for new players it seems.

So the only "normal" way to make a heat reduction is to use abyssalite pipes and place heat reduction machines to hydrogen rooms with wheezworts?

I am not looking for dripping water exploit but the simplest way to cool down your gases and liquids.

Am I understanding it right -  main source of heating of the base is the pipes? And by passing around your base they heat up everything, so mining abyssalite should be a main priority?.

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41 minutes ago, Technoincubus said:

Am I understanding it right -  main source of heating of the base is the pipes?

Main source of heating in the base itself is the electrolyzer and probably batteries.
You'd think it'd be the steam geyser but it's only hot as long as there is water being taken from it, which is going where....
 

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7 hours ago, Technoincubus said:

I am not looking for dripping water exploit but the simplest way to cool down your gases and liquids.

The simplest way that doesn't potentially require exposing large regions of the map is lockers full of ice and snow, but eventually you'll run out of ice and snow (when I say eventually I mean really far out eventually), and you have to deal with the melt.  Wheezeworts don't melt or require filling and are infinite, but you'll have a limited quantity of them in the map.  Wheezeworts will also stifle if the area is already above a certain temperature, while ice and snow will not.

7 hours ago, Technoincubus said:

Am I understanding it right -  main source of heating of the base is the pipes? And by passing around your base they heat up everything, so mining abyssalite should be a main priority?.

They can be.  It depends on your strats.  If you pipe in water from geysers, and duct your electrolyzer gasses around, then yes, those ducts and pipes will spread heat around if not abyssalite.   If you use deoxidizers and don't cook mush bars and lice loaf, don't use showers, and switch over to hand sanitizers asap, you need almost 0 water, so you can get by for ages on your starting water, so you don't need geyser water for a long time, and also don't need electrolyzers for a long time either.  You'll have plenty of time to accumulate all the abyssalite you'll ever need.

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3 hours ago, Lifegrow said:

This is getting to be a pretty long thread for a pretty straight forward concept ;)

My choice is to cool my oxygen, then heat my entire base. 

Easier to warm to a specific temperature than cool to it.

To be fair, there is a lot of nuance in how to manage the different factors. This is more directed at @Technoincubus , but one of the reasons I didn't want to offer specific build approaches to the problem is because we all sort of figure out what works best for us.

@Lifegrow, I think, tends to prefer to use wheezeworts spread across multiple electrolyzers and I guess heat his base if it gets to cold. That works well for him. But I don't like the unregulated nature of wheezewort cooling. So I lean more on Thermo Regulators than perhaps anyone. And my approach is to lock up my electrolyzers in abyssalite where they achieve their max operating temp in a thermally isolated room of around 71.5c. Pushed through 3 thermal regulators the oxygen comes out very consistently at around 29.5c and I pipe that around my base in granite ducts.

For me this helps regulate temperature both positively and negatively everytime dupes breathe. As if the air is heating up it always get replaced by something cooler.  If it is cooling down it heats it up. Always trying to push it to 29.5. Which is just on the upper end of dupe's ideal temp range.

But it is just part of a larger strategy and we all accomplish these things with different takes. @Lifegrow and I take it from different directions and there are yet more approaches to all these problems that we haven't necessarily considered. The core is to know how the buildings work to exploit them to your advantage.

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8 minutes ago, Whispershade said:

But it is just part of a larger strategy and we all accomplish these things with different takes. @Lifegrow and I take it from different directions and there are yet more approaches to all these problems that we haven't necessarily considered. The core is to know how the buildings work to exploit them to your advantage.

Hah, I've done it all to be honest - just bored of power hungry thermo regs, I prefer to manage my temperatures via convoluted pressure systems nowadays - more of a challenge :D 

The electrolyzer capped builds (playing to their max temperature) were something everybody was doing as soon as they maxed the temperatures of the outputs - however it always struck me as a non-fluid way of managing your gasses, i.e. adjusting via pressure can allow less/more hydrogen production, etc.

Anywhoo, I wasn't trying to put a downer on the thread, merely pointing out that although a lot of people like to show off their "complex" (and often recycled) builds for handling a problem, sometimes a different perspective can present new solutions. Where the OP @Technoincubuswas asking how to cool their base due to their machinery/oxygen production heating everything up - my solution would be to use their cooled oxygen to fix everything, then gently warm their base to a perfect 20 degrees, for example :D 

There's no right or wrong solution as you so rightly say, horses for courses as ever with this game ;) 

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4 minutes ago, Lifegrow said:

The electrolyzer capped builds (playing to their max temperature) were something everybody was doing as soon as they maxed the temperatures of the outputs

Interesting, I didn't see a lot of that. It always seemed to me that most people around here and on reddit were trying to build the perfect "electrowheeze" configuration.

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17 minutes ago, Whispershade said:

Interesting, I didn't see a lot of that. It always seemed to me that most people around here and on reddit were trying to build the perfect "electrowheeze" configuration.

It predates that, not sure you were a familiar face then :) 

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On 12/10/2017 at 2:52 PM, Saturnus said:

Very slow? It takes a few cycles.

My Black Pink Heart takes less than 6 cycles to get from 70C to -210C. And that's not even optimized for efficiency but rather because I like how it looks. And really discount the first cycle as I made some mistakes and had to change it so it only cooled 40C so degrees in the first cycle.

Debug save file below.

Black Pink.png

Cold Black Pink Heart.sav

My situation was different, I had a lot more oil because a needed it for liquify 70°c oxygen from 4 electrolizers via wolframite pipe radiator

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Some early to mid game ideas:

I put my battery bank on the highest floor of the base, moving it upward later as I dig out more area. Every machine that outputs massive heat I put outside the base if possible. I use insulated tiles (2-3 thick) around my entire start biome ASAP. When I can make the floors permeable to allow hot air to move up quickly I set that up too. Other very hot machines like manual generator, electric grill, etc go on the next floor down. Once I get an Ice biome my battery room is ice cooled. I put a storage bin between each battery and set it to ice and snow, no polluted ice. To keep enough water in without flooding the batteries I make the walls out of gas permeable tiles, 2 high on one side topped with an airlock door and 1 gas permeable with a mesh tile on top, then a door or whatever tiles I feel like on the other. I run a row of ladders above the batteries so the dupes can fill the bins without stepping in the resulting melt water. Ceiling can be made out of whatever or left untiled. I put a catchment room with a pitcher pump for the excess water that runs out of the mesh tile to drip into. If you have lots of chlorine around you can put your batteries in to prevent the heat from transferring to other materials, but it won't protect the batteries themselves  from overheating.

The method I use to maintain core temperature seems to work pretty well. I put non-insulated pipes through all my floors and walls. I make sure the entire system is one continuous pipe (this may take quite a few gas bridges if they have to cross over a lot). Sedimentary rock pipes are nice because it will exchange cold/heat faster than the other minerals. I run up a gas pump in an Ice biome, send the gas (doesn't really matter what gas, Hydrogen is supposed to work best but it's not that big a difference) through insulated gas pipes to the base. You will need an exit vent as well. I usually put the "out" vent into the same ice biome so it keeps cooling. It is not the fastest or easiest solution, but it helps maintain the base in the "green" zone. For an added advantage you can use a gas filter to dump any cold oxygen picked up from the Ice biome into your base directly.

If there's an Ice biome above the geyser you can dig out the tiles between and drop the cold gasses an water onto the geyser to help cool the area. if it's below it you can drop the water into the cold area and let it cool before you pump it into the base. You can mix the hot water and whatever non-germy water you find together and the waters will exchange heat pretty well and even out. Making the water flow by wheezeworts helps, but isn't enough by itself. Dripping the hot water a long distance helps somewhat too.

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There's tons of ways to cool your base, the implementation is all up to you.

The main thing to know imo is that heat travels up, so as long as you put the hot stuff above the main base, it will have a natural tendency to stay there. Just like with gases, your life is a lot easier if things want to stay where they are.

Other important tips:

- Scour the map early for wheezleworts, 6-8 of these guys will go along way to cooling down your living area.

- Use ice biomes to cool anything hot coming into your base. Never bring an outside source of heat into your base, it must be cooled first.

- Insulate well, create heat barriers and keep them intact.

- Consider generating your oxygen in an icon biome, and pumping the cool air into your base.

- Hvac equipment only uses tons of power in the beginning, once a system is primed and stable, then they run at more like a 10% duty cycle. For example, a cooling system that lowers air temp from 30 to 22 will use a ton of power to get there, but once at 22, combined with a thermal switch, you can maintain the temp for a reasonable power cost. Priming the systems, and dealing with that initial surge of energy required is one of the hardest parts of the game imo.

 

 

 

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On 10/20/2017 at 10:05 PM, Botaxalim said:

Just want to add

You can use single thick wall using abbysalite ,insulated or normal. And have same effect

The tiles in question are built before I have enough abyssalite. once you have it, it's way more effective. This just allows me to keep the interior cooler while I go dig up the more exotic materials.

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With automation it seems to get worse. 

I transfer water from geyser via abyssality pipes - base temp goes up.

I transfer cooled oxygen from electrolyzers - temp goes way up.(oxygen in pipes 24c, temp in room - 35c) 

After reading this thread my understanding is that there are no any non-complex ways to reduce your base teemperature. You either build some coling installations that span half the map or you play in overheated base?

Because even when I followed advices about placing heat generating installations on the top, of using hydrogen+wheezes room, it still never ever gets below 35c. Which means only way to survive is microbe musher, as lices are not growing, berries too, and mushrooms take way too long to feed the colony.

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1 hour ago, Technoincubus said:

With automation it seems to get worse. 

I transfer water from geyser via abyssality pipes - base temp goes up.

I transfer cooled oxygen from electrolyzers - temp goes way up.(oxygen in pipes 24c, temp in room - 35c) 

After reading this thread my understanding is that there are no any non-complex ways to reduce your base teemperature. You either build some coling installations that span half the map or you play in overheated base?

Because even when I followed advices about placing heat generating installations on the top, of using hydrogen+wheezes room, it still never ever gets below 35c. Which means only way to survive is microbe musher, as lices are not growing, berries too, and mushrooms take way too long to feed the colony.

@Technoincubus: The effectiveness of most cooling solutions is pretty much proportional to how complex the solution is.  Same with oxygen solutions, power solutions, etc.  Could you share some screenshots of the base and specifically any problem areas?

IMO, the best effectiveness/complexity ratio might be abusing the ice biome.  You could batteries, transformers, and generators in the ice biome.  If you keep a reservoir for either H20 or PH20 in base, you could turn it into a massive heatsink by building submerged storage containers, filling them with 2-5 tons each of ice/polluted ice you mined out, and dumping it out on the floor.  Cold natural gas generators (below -26C) produce polluted ice instead of water, which you can dump into the PH2O reservoir mess-free.  Lavatories and showers seem to work the same way, but that's just mean.  Plus, broken pipes.

Build the electrolyzers in a granite room in a cold biome, then vent it to base.  Take a scenic route through the cold biome using granite, and switch to abyssalite as the cold biome ends.  Place wheezeworts near the generators, electrolyzers, and anywhere inside the base you deem necessary.  They only work with air pressure, though.

This is all pretty unsustainable, but you only need a few areas of the tech tree to make it work and it is effective long enough to design something more complex.

Oh, and be sure to surround your core base with abyssalite.  That will keep the higher temps of surrounding biomes at bay.

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i kept my base cool by keeping it that way from the beginning, minerals are stored in ice biome, tiles used are sandstones which are 20c at most, water kept at less than 30c, generator insulated with wheezy

also outer rim of my base is insulated to keep outside temp from going in, looks pretty decent that way

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On 10/13/2017 at 9:10 PM, Whispershade said:

So I lean more on Thermo Regulators than perhaps anyone. And my approach is to lock up my electrolyzers in abyssalite where they achieve their max operating temp in a thermally isolated room of around 71.5c. Pushed through 3 thermal regulators the oxygen comes out very consistently at around 29.5c and I pipe that around my base in granite ducts.

For me this helps regulate temperature both positively and negatively everytime dupes breathe. As if the air is heating up it always get replaced by something cooler.  If it is cooling down it heats it up. Always trying to push it to 29.5. Which is just on the upper end of dupe's ideal temp range.

If I understand correctly, Thermo Regulators achieve cooling by just soaking up the heat into themselves as 1-1 ratio, and so you must still deal with the hot equipment. The more hot air that they're cooling, the more they need to be cooled themselves. How are you keeping your regulators cool - wheezeworts-in-hydrgen abysellite room? Keep them in the same room with the electrolyzers or separate?

How do you regulate the electrolyzer thermally isolated room to 71.5c?

Got any screenshots?

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38 minutes ago, midjones said:

If I understand correctly, Thermo Regulators achieve cooling by just soaking up the heat into themselves as 1-1 ratio, and so you must still deal with the hot equipment. The more hot air that they're cooling, the more they need to be cooled themselves. How are you keeping your regulators cool - wheezeworts-in-hydrgen abysellite room? Keep them in the same room with the electrolyzers or separate?

How do you regulate the electrolyzer thermally isolated room to 71.5c?

Got any screenshots?

The HVAC systems are 1:1 to get the most out of them you should only allow max size packets go through them this can be done with pipe bridges it saves power.The solution to cool them is easy put them in abyssalite rooms with hydrogen and 2-3 warts per HVAC you can also make one of theese rooms and cool it by dripping polluted water from you’re power on the HVACS before you send it to the fertilizer machine.

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1 hour ago, BT_20 said:

The HVAC systems are 1:1 to get the most out of them you should only allow max size packets go through them this can be done with pipe bridges it saves power.

Could this be done with a liquid valve instead? I'm not actually sure how to force max size packets to go through.

1 hour ago, BT_20 said:

The solution to cool them is easy put them in abyssalite rooms with hydrogen and 2-3 warts per HVAC

Wow that's a lot of wheezeworts then, since Whispershade's build requires 3 thermo regulators. 9 wheezeworts, and this would probably only cool 1 electrolyzer worth of oxygen (assuming 1 electrolyzer with 2 gas pumps would feed constant max packets of oxygen)

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On 10/12/2017 at 1:07 AM, Technoincubus said:

Any help on cooling my base?

I made a video guide about cooling that might help:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UFd5rnrFzI

I don't think anyone mentioned the anti entropy thermo-nullifier which in my opinion is one of the most powerful ways to cool things. The oil cooler mentioned, is even more powerful but does use game exploits which may be removed. My main tips would be to build heat producers in ice biomes near the anti entropy thermo-nullifiers, insulate pipes with abyssalite if you're moving hot liquids. As @Lifegrow mentioned, it's much easier to cool your oxygen and pump that into the base and then heat where you need to.

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15 minutes ago, GrindThisGame said:

I made a video guide about cooling that might help:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UFd5rnrFzI

I don't think anyone mentioned the anti entropy thermo-nullifier which in my opinion is one of the most powerful ways to cool things. The oil cooler mentioned, is even more powerful but does use game exploits which may be removed. My main tips would be to build heat producers in ice biomes near the anti entropy thermo-nullifiers, insulate pipes with abyssalite if you're moving hot liquids. As @Lifegrow mentioned, it's much easier to cool your oxygen and pump that into the base and then heat where you need to.

That's unfortunate, because IMO anti entropy thermo-nullifier is not fun. Also, natural cooling with ice biome is not fun for me. I love building automated systems. Funny that the exploit is subjectively harder and more fun to use than the game-provided cooling solutions.

That being said, I do appreciate your guide(s) as they explained things in detail with useful examples.

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