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EuedeAdodooedoe

Could we have driven the devs to become reluctant to work on this game?

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I said my next topic was going to be something exciting... well, I'm post-poning that a little. Been busy with stuff lately myself.

So... I want to reflect a little on how we've come to this point. We've been suggesting a lot of things to devs. They have been doing a lot of work, trying to implement quite a bit of content over the past few months. Wouldn't say a lot, but quite a bit, some of which being more significant than others.

As you may know, I, and many others have had a lot of criticisms about the game. And I have a feeling that the hotfix roast that some of us participated in (myself included, kind of) might have made some developers think "Well, what's the point? We're working on all of this, and we always get so much hate from what we create because it's not exactly how they want it."

To be fair, we don't know what's going on. Klei doesn't really tell us. I have a feeling that they try to keep smiling faces on so much, and try to encourage positivity so much, to a point where telling what's actually going on might be bad.

The way I laid out my previous topic was horse****. I spent a lot of time, trying to explain to the developers what half the time we, and the other only I found to be problematic about the game and what could be changed for the better. But the thing is, we have said a lot of these things over and over, but nothing really changes. And we don't know why, because a lot of the points I did make, general points in all fairness, are issues the game needs to address. Those being:

* Game supporting newbies better

* Game making things harder for late-game players

* Items that are virtually useless actually having some usage

* Mechanics that are unfinished/not fleshed out enough to get finished/be fleshed out enough

* Game preventing griefing automatically (this one's kind of split between thoughts, but the option to turn on auto-griefing protection and off is something I read a lot of players were hay with, however.)

* Game making you feel like you're actually trying to survive, instead of being in a world you essentially rule and exploit and it being a grindy social club, rather than a survival experience

* Everything having some way of being renewed that cannot be destroyed from within the game, so that content isn't destroyed

* Some ways to deal with lag better by erasing items accross the world that just make things worse overall

* Balance of certain items that makes them unreliable in any way or not reliable enough

 

Wow, that kind of summarized my whole wall of text from before.

Anyway, Klei. If you are reading this, and we have driven you away from making bug fixes, or even from completing the portal-related stuff... Please, come back. The game needs improvements, and if these improvements are placed within the game, then I assure you, you will get the praise you deserve. I mean, look at the vote kick. It was improved, and while you did have some issues here and there, since it's not perfect, you balanced it out well, based on the feedback given to you by the players and everyone was happy! Just pay more attention to feedback, if you don't already and put some thought into some of the things some other players are suggesting, and especially are getting a common consensus here. We all want the game to be good, right? So, what gives the notion that just brushing the feedback away would make for a game that everyone loves?

Lastly, I think I'll mention the fact that... the way the game is currently now, it encourages players to spread on their own and gather things, yet the fun in multiplayer is you being there with other players. Perhaps incentivising us to stick together with other players outside of something like a base would benefit the game a lot too? Because once you're a pro, you realize you need to scatter, not stick together, which is a bit sad considering the game's called Don't Starve Together.

I hope I've made my points clear and have done a bit of reflection on what's been going on recently. I really don't want this game to rest in pepperonies, and I know many others don't either. But it is all up to you, Klei. If the content you keep bringing is just the same things over and over, the game becomes boring and the will to play it withers as time goes by. I would say it's more about the quality than the quantity of the game's content. You have just about enough quanity of content. Now it would probably be the best time to re-assess its quality.

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TheKingDedede    2,266

I think the devs would be willing to read your suggestions if you didn't keep pinging V2C in some of your posts and having a joke at his expense.

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Rellimarual    1,832

I don't think you should tie yourself into knots about this. First, we just received a huge amount of free content in the form of both ANR and several events. It's not unreasonable that the devs would turn to other projects for a while. Second, they are professionals and perfectly capable of sorting worthwhile suggestions from the rest without getting overwhelmed. You do need to accept that suggestions that seem both self-evident and urgent to you don't seem that way to many if not most other players and are unlikely to be taken that seriously, let alone implemented, by the devs. Weren't you among the people who suggested changes to the vote kicking system? That was changed, which is a reason to be glad as well as evidence that when the devs agree that something needs changing, they will do it when they are able.

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Essay man, at it again. If anybodys a nuisance to the devs its you, with your incessant 10-paragraph rants chock full of haughty recommendations, overly needy question spam, and dare i say entitlement? It's an overused term, but it applies.

 You might have good intentions but ramming your BS criticisms down everyone's throat with these text walls(spacing doesn't matter when you babble that much) would annoy anybody, especially a group of people who poured their heart and soul into something for years. Nobody wants to hear some rando on the Internet, with ZERO game design experience, piss all over that. Its disrespectful, and I think you should stop.

The game is fine how it is, if they chose to quit it forever you'd have no right to complain, as it's worth a damn sight more than 15 bucks already. Shut the heck up and stop being so "helpful", please! We JUST got a huge free update, chill out and take a break from forums for a while, you seriously need it.

 

Somebody's gotta be the bad cop. Sorry if it sounds harsh, but I'm being honest with you.

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GiddyGuy    7,015
5 minutes ago, OttoVonChesterfield said:

Its disrespectful, and I think you should stop.

Everyone is free to state their own opinion, but I agree with how much he has spammed it, with how much time he has wasted writing these essays he probably could've made a game liking to his design.

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Josonic    106
2 hours ago, Rellimarual said:

I don't think you should tie yourself into knots about this. First, we just received a huge amount of free content in the form of both ANR and several events. It's not unreasonable that the devs would turn to other projects for a while. Second, they are professionals and perfectly capable of sorting worthwhile suggestions from the rest without getting overwhelmed. You do need to accept that suggestions that seem both self-evident and urgent to you don't seem that way to many if not most other players and are unlikely to be taken that seriously, let alone implemented, by the devs. Weren't you among the people who suggested changes to the vote kicking system? That was changed, which is a reason to be glad as well as evidence that when the devs agree that something needs changing, they will do it when they are able.

Not all of us have received that ANR content yet

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Sinister_Fang    3,533
4 minutes ago, Josonic said:

Not all of us have received that ANR content yet

Actually, that's likely what the team is probably working on. I wouldn't be surprised if the lack of updates on PC is due to them porting over ANR. As far as I know, Klei does all of that themselves instead of handing it over to another developer like most other games are.

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JohnWatson    1,756

No criticism allowed please. Minimise hostility and make sure your opinions are positive before posting. Okay thanks bye

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JoeW    15,792

The team is working on the game, just as much - if not more than ever. We just don't have a regular schedule for updates as before with the ANR cycle at an end.

We'll let you know when we're ready to talk about what we're working on next. 

 

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minespatch    27,242
4 minutes ago, JoeW said:

We just don't have a regular schedule for updates as before with the ANR cycle at an end.

Figured. I don't like to pressure the staff since they're a small company. Geez people, give them time. As someone who constantly busy, I can see where Klei is coming from.ariel sweats.png

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Sinister_Fang    3,533
34 minutes ago, JoeW said:

We'll let you know when we're ready to talk about what we're working on next.

Now this sounds pretty interesting. Sounds like it's a little more then the usual bug fixes...

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minespatch    27,242

I'm curious about that orphan willow hat, the keys, and slipstor from the thread here:

Also hyped for Nome's creature. Hyped for the debut of that character- Wait, could Slipstor be the character Nome is voicing?:wilson_shocked::wilson_shocked:

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Captain_Rage    440
2 hours ago, JoeW said:

The team is working on the game, just as much - if not more than ever. We just don't have a regular schedule for updates as before with the ANR cycle at an end.

We'll let you know when we're ready to talk about what we're working on next. 

 

Klei is a small (great!), independent, game developer. They have showed us again and again that they are following and encouraging feedback from their players/fans in their forums and social media.

When they aren't reading through the forums, they are working on their games or other projects, so you would rather take it as a good sign to see an occasional absence of developer posts.

There have been numerous threads about feedback/ideas from the community already. There is no way the developers might have missed them. We have received tonnes of free content for Don't Starve Together and Klei is clearly still working on it (<3).

To my knowledge smaller studios don't always know exactly what direction their next project is heading, hence it is nothing strange to keep it "secret" when it is still being conceptualized and the developers don't know most of the answers themselves. When it comes to Klei, they are very transparent with us already, which is very lovely.

Bugs/features are usually prioritized by the time it would take fix/implement them, as the developers have kindly pointed out.

I don't understand the point of the first post, to sum it up.

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ImDaMisterL    17,334
2 hours ago, minespatch said:

I'm curious about that orphan willow hat, the keys, and slipstor from the thread here:

I really hope they weren't crapped.

Well, except for Willow's hat, that was probably from the old skin system that they were probably testing out.

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CarlZalph    1,543
9 hours ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

* Game supporting newbies better

* Game making you feel like you're actually trying to survive, instead of being in a world you essentially rule and exploit and it being a grindy social club, rather than a survival experience

The learning curve is part of the fun and experience of the game, though.

The second bullet sort of goes against the first here in that by making the game harder it will inherently make it less new player friendly.

9 hours ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

* Game making things harder for late-game players

* Items that are virtually useless actually having some usage

* Mechanics that are unfinished/not fleshed out enough to get finished/be fleshed out enough

* Game making you feel like you're actually trying to survive, instead of being in a world you essentially rule and exploit and it being a grindy social club, rather than a survival experience

* Balance of certain items that makes them unreliable in any way or not reliable enough

I don't really see any simple way to make things harder for late-game players with the combat scheme in place.

Perhaps a PvP-oriented update could solve all of these issues in one fell swoop.

I can just see Waxwell taking in a nice deep breath of fumes from the nightmare light.  Refreshing, indeed!

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11 hours ago, Rellimarual said:

I don't think you should tie yourself into knots about this. First, we just received a huge amount of free content in the form of both ANR and several events. It's not unreasonable that the devs would turn to other projects for a while. Second, they are professionals and perfectly capable of sorting worthwhile suggestions from the rest without getting overwhelmed. You do need to accept that suggestions that seem both self-evident and urgent to you don't seem that way to many if not most other players and are unlikely to be taken that seriously, let alone implemented, by the devs. Weren't you among the people who suggested changes to the vote kicking system? That was changed, which is a reason to be glad as well as evidence that when the devs agree that something needs changing, they will do it when they are able.

I was pretty late to the whole vote kick thing. Wasn't the first to suggest any changes for it nor the last. Plenty of people complained about it.

Okay people can you stop there for a second? The **** you're posting about my turdy suggestions I did address here. I do realize the content was laid out like crap. That is part of what this thread is about, so what do you want me to do? What now? You don't have to keep bashing me with this crap anymore, alright?

Why do I get this hostility when I don't intend to get it? I mean yes, half the time things are just my opinion, but what's so problematic about that? I guess it's simply the way I put things in my "suggestion" threads.

3 hours ago, CarlZalph said:

The learning curve is part of the fun and experience of the game, though.

The second bullet sort of goes against the first here in that by making the game harder it will inherently make it less new player friendly.

I don't really see any simple way to make things harder for late-game players with the combat scheme in place.

Perhaps a PvP-oriented update could solve all of these issues in one fell swoop.

I can just see Waxwell taking in a nice deep breath of fumes from the nightmare light.  Refreshing, indeed!

No it won't if done correctly. I have not been the only one who's complained about the game being too easy later on. Making it easier for newcomers doesn't mean making it harder late game. Why do some people keep thinking this?

7 hours ago, JoeW said:

The team is working on the game, just as much - if not more than ever. We just don't have a regular schedule for updates as before with the ANR cycle at an end.

We'll let you know when we're ready to talk about what we're working on next. 

 

Thank you for the clarification. Part of what I wanted to do in this thread was apologise for the havok that I've created due to continually writing in detail when I could have kept it brief like here, not making a ton of useless texts and just taking the micky even when that wasn't my intention.

8 hours ago, Sinister_Fang said:

Actually, that's likely what the team is probably working on. I wouldn't be surprised if the lack of updates on PC is due to them porting over ANR. As far as I know, Klei does all of that themselves instead of handing it over to another developer like most other games are.

Ahh! I forgot ANR is still not on PS4!

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Kittydub    1,298

The way you described everything in this topic is very understandable and I get where you're coming from in most of your suggestions. I guess now it's just that time where we all have to sit back and wait for a bit to see what they have in store for us. I'm sure they have seen all the suggestions made by the community and are keeping track of what everyone wants and needs in the game.

You can't please everyone of course, but I hope some of your suggestions do make it, the game does get easy after a good amount of days (Making me start over again and again) and support for newbies is definitely needed. I'd enjoy a new 'hard' game mode personally, because Plus really isn't that bad actually and light's out is not something everyone is interested in. Not everyone is interested in hard mode either, some just want that social club feeling, so a new mode would be needed. Too many items have no use like you said or could be more than they are now, so you are completely correct with most of these. 

Thanks for rephrasing your previous topic and making it more readable. :) 

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CarlZalph    1,543
11 hours ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

No it won't if done correctly. I have not been the only one who's complained about the game being too easy later on. Making it easier for newcomers doesn't mean making it harder late game. Why do some people keep thinking this?

* Game supporting newbies better

* Game making you feel like you're actually trying to survive, instead of being in a world you essentially rule and exploit and it being a grindy social club, rather than a survival experience

Your points combined of wanting to make it harder while making it new player friendly is what I was referring to- they conflict with interest.

Anything more difficult won't be as new player friendly since it is inherently harder.

It takes time and/or effort to overcome content, and it would increase the investment by making it harder while decreasing the investment by making it newer player friendly.

It's like taking a step forward and then a step backward, in other words; a side-step.

 

 

This is under the assumption of your term 'newbie' to mean a new player to the game, and not someone who has joined in a world later post worldgen.

If you are meaning the latter, then I have misinterpreted your meaning in which case I would say: Yes, the world could do with helping late joiners better.

Birds dropping things are a bandage, and I have no real good ideas on how to make it better.

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15 hours ago, CarlZalph said:

Your points combined of wanting to make it harder while making it new player friendly is what I was referring to- they conflict with interest.

Anything more difficult won't be as new player friendly since it is inherently harder.

It takes time and/or effort to overcome content, and it would increase the investment by making it harder while decreasing the investment by making it newer player friendly.

It's like taking a step forward and then a step backward, in other words; a side-step.

 

 

This is under the assumption of your term 'newbie' to mean a new player to the game, and not someone who has joined in a world later post worldgen.

If you are meaning the latter, then I have misinterpreted your meaning in which case I would say: Yes, the world could do with helping late joiners better.

Birds dropping things are a bandage, and I have no real good ideas on how to make it better.

Yes, newCOMERS is what I mrant, sorry for the misunderstanding. Would you agree that the game should get harder overall when youbget into hudreds of days of gameplay, outvof curiosity?

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Lumina    1,514
On 14/05/2017 at 0:21 AM, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

The game needs improvements, and if these improvements are placed within the game, then I assure you, you will get the praise you deserve

"I'm a jerk but it's your fault, work harder and do what i ask and you'll have thanks".

 

Wow. Are you sure that your topic is about what the title says ? Because i was expecting apologies and maybe a questionning and we are back into the "you should follow my ideas" topic. Seriously. I want to scream.

 

I don't know about the devs but yeah, people like you are discouraging, not because of the criticism, which is fair, but the repeating of the same thing again and again with a problematic tone without seeing that maybe what you think is good for the game isn't.

 

I doubt this is enough to make Klei stop doing bugfixes or working on the game. But it's enough to discourage people liking the game to make some answers on forum, or people reading suggestions, or people wanting to discuss this kind of stuff because they associate this to your awful behaviour.

Maybe people like you are a part of the reason why suggestions seems useless.

 

So please, when you do a step in the right direction, like you did with the title, don't ruin it with starting again with the problem. Yes, you are a part of a problem, yes, you should change your behaviour to avoid this problem to become more and more important and more discouraging.

And you shouldn't repeat the same stuff like you must say it because klei MUST read it to be saved. Please. I was hopeful reading the title "he starts to understand". But it was a false hope. I know it's hard thinking that you can help the game more by saying nothing than doing long topics, i know it's a lot of work you did, honestly i know this, i was in the same situation about another game, and it was really painful to realise that i should really post less about this game, so i know that i'm asking something difficult, but for the good of the game and yours,  you should really take some distance and post less.

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Lumina    1,514

Anyway i'm glad to know that Klei is still working on the game, good luck !

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The listed "problems" you posted aren't actual issues besides one or can be fixed with mods (which I heavily encourage unless you're an anti-modest or something). I'd agree it's difficult for new players to start in harsh weather early on in a (esp. populated server), but I don't think there's anything logical they can do about it besides giving them a starter amount of essentials for the current season at a set player and weather threshold.

The game will not be adjusted made harder for experienced players since it will backlash on newbies (unless they implement a separate modifier/mode). Items being useless are done slightly purposeful for example a fern is useless because it's for decoration. Every item has a purpose some are just non-obvious. There'll always be griefers, which is why there has been no such thing as "griefing protection" implemented, the only true protection would be to have/be a active mod(s).

I'll regurgitate what others already said and say be appreciative at least at the end of your writing of whatever devs should address. I understand the urgent need of wanting what you want I've been through it myself, but let's try to stop for a second and think.

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jantonio    1,670

everyone has to understand that....they are just a small indie development team.

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