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Saturnus    333

I use hatches to get rid of stuff that literally has no use, like sedimentary rock and sandstone (abyssalite, granite and sometimes igneous rock fulfills all your needs for building materials and they are each the best at certain things).

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Cilya    31
20 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

and sometimes igneous rock

What use the Igneous rock does have ?

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Saturnus    333
3 minutes ago, Cilya said:

What use the Igneous rock does have ?

It has high heat capacity but low conductivity so it acts as a thermal buffer. Raising temperature slower but also losing it slower.

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Reaniel    40
5 hours ago, Kasuha said:

Polluted water outgassing is proportional to amount of polluted water in the tile and to the number of exposed water tiles. Since in his design the water has large exposed area and the exposed tiles are under pressure with more than 800 kg of polluted water per tile in most tiles, it also turns to more polluted oxygen. I like the design a lot. I believe the mesh tiles aren't necessary though, the trick is in the gas permeable walls and their ability to withstand any pressure.

 

No, they're not necessary, but I just like the looks of it :p

Kidding aside, what happened was that I had a dupe dropping down and drowning in my first test build (I shouldn't start filling it with water BEFORE I finished building), and then dropping down and can't get out (I still can't understand how they drop into it in the first place).  So in the end, I decided to just do mesh for the rows where water will come in so I wouldn't need to use ladders (this was back when I was still doing 2 width rows for liquids).

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brummbar7    471
13 hours ago, Lifegrow said:

Before I started the timer (whilst paused in debug) I introduced 50kg of polluted oxygen in each room, and primed all surfaces with 10kg of polluted surface water.

A)14*23 room * ~539g per tile= 173.6kg -50 = ~123.6kg gain

B)14x23 room * ~148g per tile =47.7kg -50 = ~2.3kg loss... (I'm putting this down to some dodgey water-destruction)

C)14x17 room * ~613g per tile = 145.9kg -50 = ~95.9kg gain

D)14x17 room * ~1527g per tile = 363.4kg -50 = ~313.4kg gain

 

I'm a bit curious as to how D played out exactly, in terms of where water ended up.   I count 55 potentially exposed tiles in design A (not counting very bottom of room) while design B has 65 tiles just based on the horizontal rows, plus 6 more if you count the ones in the vertical column that are exposed to at least one gas permeable tile.  But more importantly, does not design D tend to drain all the 10kg primed water tiles mostly toward the bottom?  Or do the mesh tiles have some sort of weird suspension effect?  B clearly wasn't going to work well due to most tiles being not exposed to air, and C, again, I would think most water would tend to drain to the bottom.   And as Kasuha says, offgassing is a percent. 

So really I think a better test would fill all the reservoir tiles totally full,  especially in C and D where gravity will make the water flow to the bottom anyway?  Because the player will want to fit as much water in as few of tiles as possible to get maximum offgassing.  And I'm still not entirely clear if PO tiles offgas downward and/or sideways.  If so that would make Reaniel's design, which has two-wide PW channels so that each gas permeable tile is accepting from at least 2 PO tiles (above and below) much better I think.

But even beyond the raw production tests, I think there's a question of delivery perhaps.  You have to get that oxygen purified and into your base.  So for instance does gas flow better or worse through 1-wide air channels, vs perhaps 2 wide?  Gas pumps vs just running it across deodorizer?  I've been slowly trying to build up a system that just pushes the PO into the base across deodorizers, to see just how far one can abuse deodorizers and offgassing for a 0 power oxygen system.  I'm not near as scientific about it as you all though.

Edited by brummbar7

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Kasuha    519
8 minutes ago, brummbar7 said:

I count 55 potentially exposed tiles in design A (not counting very bottom of room) while design B has 65 tiles just based on the horizontal rows, plus 6 more if you count the ones in the vertical column that are exposed to at least one gas permeable tile.  But more importantly, does not design D tend to drain all the 10kg primed water tiles mostly toward the bottom?

Design A has 32 high-fill (800 kg) and 21 low fill (grams to a few kg) exposed

Design B has just the 21 low fill tiles

Design C has 60 low-fill tiles, though the actual filling depends on speed of water diffusion along the row

Desing D has 65 high-fill tiles, plus most of them contain more than 800 kg

In designs A to C, outgassing from the very bottom row probably plays role too. I assume in design D the structure was just filled with polluted water, it did not have to get spilled to the floor.

Design A is actually very close to design D, it's just about half the volume and lacks the overpressure element.

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Saturnus    333

Note deoderizers creates negative air pressure since 10% of the polluted oxygen is destroyed. Knowing this is useful as it by itself, if cleverly used, can transport polluted oxygen without the need of pumps.

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Lifegrow    278
49 minutes ago, Kasuha said:

Design A has 32 high-fill (800 kg) and 21 low fill (grams to a few kg) exposed

Design B has just the 21 low fill tiles

Design C has 60 low-fill tiles, though the actual filling depends on speed of water diffusion along the row

Desing D has 65 high-fill tiles, plus most of them contain more than 800 kg

In designs A to C, outgassing from the very bottom row probably plays role too. I assume in design D the structure was just filled with polluted water, it did not have to get spilled to the floor.

Design A is actually very close to design D, it's just about half the volume and lacks the overpressure element.

Indeed, and as I mentioned in the edit - all of them were primed with surface water - because D) would have taken an age to fill.

As I say, this wasn't a scientific test, just some derping around in debug to test whether the gas perms (airflow tiles? - yeuch!) really were as overpowered as was mentioned ;) B) was always going to fail, but to see the difference between the two setups I figured it was worthwhile. 

For me, the most startling realisation was just how much gas the morb tank produces - and in terms of space efficiency - it wins hands down. Easy to set up in normal games too. Dirty an outhouse, seal it off, wait for morbs then pump in your water. Easy. This is my little set up for providing way more than enough PO2 for a liquid o2 setup. Somebody mentioned that they gravitate to the left side of the tank, but they really go where they please. Once they're in sync of emitting gas, they don't move ever, and just keep outputting. There are 5 on that tile.

image.thumb.png.41594af2b7aebb20f0359be73d72c344.png

 

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Saturnus    333

Further testing with morbs reveal that they actually convert polluted water into polluted oxygen. Just not very effectively. My test show that for every 1g of polluted oxygen that was created 15g of polluted water was consumed. So while they are 15 times faster than passive evaporation, they also consume 15 times more polluted water in the process.

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Jackblac    4
6 hours ago, BlueLance said:

Wait so morbs dont die when submerged??? do they have to be fully submerged or could you in theory put them in shallow water that hatches can survive in and have hatches/morbs at the bottom feeding pufts at the top and satisfying your coal needs?

I set my hatches free in my fertilizer maker area. This way I can get use for the polluted water from natural gas generators and their carbon skimmers and also more natural gas for power production. In this setup the hatches have more room to poop, make coal faster that way and I dont need to feed them manually. I can just go in and get the coal for coal generators. Also if you arent growing sleet wheat this is the only use for fertilizer in the game. Any other materials can be used for other things.

Hatches.jpg

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