Jump to content

Steam Generator


Recommended Posts

A generator that takes in steam gas and outputs water plus a small amount of heat. would be a good "end" game creation since most people are turning contaminated water into steam then into water. It would also make sense. It could lower the tempature of the steam to just around it's condensation point.

 

:edit: The generator would be a means of producing energy. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

yeah that wouldnt be a bad idea necessarily though there is a way to convert steam back to water using a technique, i saw it on youtube. I have tried converting contaminated water to steam but the temperature got so hot i was unable to turn it back to water, so it would benefit inexperienced players more.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

It is already planned for the game update due out tomorrow.

I didn't see it anywhere in this. http://oxygennotincludedfr.blogspot.com/2017/03/klei-preview-of-first-content-patch-of.html 

6 minutes ago, mr_anderson said:

yeah that wouldnt be a bad idea necessarily though there is a way to convert steam back to water using a technique, i saw it on youtube. I have tried converting contaminated water to steam but the temperature got so hot i was unable to turn it back to water, so it would benefit inexperienced players more.

My idea to transform steam is to get it just hot enough to turn to steam then pump through thermo regulator. and if i wanted to have an intermediary storage room for steam put it in a mined out chamber of abyssalite.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

The steam geyser. They spend quite a bit of time talking about it. And there's a cold biome. Combine the two in a clever way, and hey presto, you got a water source :D

Sorry i didn't mean to make it unclear. The steam generator would be a means of producing energy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Joshu145 said:

Sorry i didn't mean to make it unclear. The steam generator would be a means of producing energy

Maybe you should indicate that in the original post as it doesn't actually say that anywhere.
 

23 minutes ago, Joshu145 said:

A generator that takes in steam gas and outputs water plus a small amount of heat.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Saturnus said:

Maybe you should indicate that in the original post as it doesn't actually say that anywhere.
 

 

I'm not sure many other ways to take the word "generator" And i did edit the original post. Especially a generator that takes "in" steam gas and outputs water and heat.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Although heat is energy, it's not useful energy. Not trying to be pedantic, just that fewer thermodynamics issues here, the better :)

To get energy from heat, you need a heat gradient -- hot one place, cold another. If everything is equally hot, no energy is gained. In a steam generator, for example, if steam is on both sides of the turbine blades of equal temperature, the blades wouldn't move. It has to be hotter on one side, more pressurized. Same for stirling engines, thermocouples, or any other method.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Crimeo said:

Although heat is energy, it's not useful energy. Not trying to be pedantic, just that fewer thermodynamics issues here, the better :)

To get energy from heat, you need a heat gradient -- hot one place, cold another. If everything is equally hot, no energy is gained. In a steam generator, for example, if steam is on both sides of the turbine blades of equal temperature, the blades wouldn't move. It has to be hotter on one side, more pressurized. Same for stirling engines, thermocouples, or any other method.

Not entirely true considering we can control the amount of pressure(irl). temperature doesn't directly equate to pressure. I meant for it to give off heat and energy because energy conversion is never 100% efficient. also, it needs to balance in the game

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Joshu145 said:

Not entirely true considering we can control the amount of pressure(irl). temperature doesn't directly equate to pressure. I meant for it to give off heat and energy because energy conversion is never 100% efficient. also, it needs to balance in the game

The pressure in a steam engine comes entirely from heating. Yes you could push on the gas in a cylinder directly, for example, but that would be pointless in the case of a steam engine, because you'd be using energy to make less energy. Unless you have a constant free source of pushing (like a hydro dam) but if so you're probably not using steam engines in the first place *shrug* 

Game balance: If you make thermodynamics work reasonably properly, the game would be FORCED to be balanced as a result anyway.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Crimeo said:

The pressure in a steam engine comes entirely from heating. Yes you could push on the gas in a cylinder directly, for example, but that would be pointless in the case of a steam engine, because you'd be using energy to make less energy. Unless you have a constant free source of pushing (like a hydro dam) but if so you're probably not using steam engines in the first place *shrug* 

Game balance: If you make thermodynamics work reasonably properly, the game would be FORCED to be balanced as a result anyway.

A typical steam engine works by having a boiling chamber then releasing steam into a piston chamber that forces the piston back to do pressure. You are correct that the pressure is created from the steam. But in this setup we can control the amount of pressure inside each cylinder. the piston chamber is designed with an opening at the back stroke of the piston so when it's fully "open" it releases the pressure out of the chamber allow the piston to cycle forward all the way. When the pressure leaves the piston chamber we control the amount of pressure in each cylinder, because we can close the valve coming the the boiling chamber. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've been thinking about this a bit and I honestly don't think a traditional steam engine is in line with the spirit of the game. A better choice would be a more generic thermo-generator, it could take the form of a steam turbine, a stirling engine, or a Peltier element. In any case it should just have 2 inputs, one hot, one cold, and one output. These could be both liquid or gas, and the power produced would be based on the thermal differential and type of the inputs. It should naturally be radiate heat as anything that produces power, and the output should be something that is a mix of the two inputs.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

I've been thinking about this a bit and I honestly don't think a traditional steam engine is in line with the spirit of the game. A better choice would be a more generic thermo-generator, it could take the form of a steam turbine, a stirling engine, or a Peltier element. In any case it should just have 2 inputs, one hot, one cold, and one output. These could be both liquid or gas, and the power produced would be based on the thermal differential and type of the inputs. It should naturally be radiate heat as anything that produces power, and the output should be something that is a mix of the two inputs.

I like that idea, good balance because of a mixture coming out. I seriously can not wait for mod support. This game has the most potential i think for just fun sciency breaking the game **** haha

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Joshu145 said:

when it's fully "open" it releases the pressure out of the chamber allow the piston to cycle forward all the way. 

Yes, which means that on both strokes, there's a pressure differential between the hot steam and the colder venting steam. Which, on both strokes, comes entirely from the temperature difference. If the atmosphere were equally hot as the boiler, then neither stroke would do anything, no matter how you ever designed the engine, with any combination of valves, etc. (unless you put in some other form of external energy, defeating the purpose).

 

Quote

more generic thermo-generator

Yes, definitely this! If you're going to make it that generic and abstract, you might even be able to get away with including the temperature control service (the little thing with the ribbons already in game) as part of the same building, via toggle option alone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Crimeo said:

Yes, which means that on both strokes, there's a pressure differential between the hot steam and the colder venting steam. Which, on both strokes, comes entirely from the temperature difference. If the atmosphere were equally hot as the boiler, then neither stroke would do anything, no matter how you ever designed the engine, with any combination of valves, etc. (unless you put in some other form of external energy, defeating the purpose).

No it could definitely still work, We can control the atmosphere. Even if we could not control the tempature we could control many other factors that would still make it work. Temperature does not directly equate to pressure. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Joshu145 said:

No it could definitely still work, We can control the atmosphere. Even if we could not control the tempature we could control many other factors that would still make it work. Temperature does not directly equate to pressure. 

If you could figure out a way to run a steam turbine in a steam-hot atmosphere, then you'd be able to violate laws of thermodynamics by running it forever with no input, since you wouldn't need any fuel to boil water in a 105 degree atmosphere.

Generally I'd say the burden of proof is on the guy claiming a perpetual motion machine is possible to explain how, precisely, in more specific terms.

Unless, again by "other factors" you mean "making it justnot a steam engine anymore" by utilizing some other external third party energy source like a river.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, Crimeo said:

If you could figure out a way to run a steam turbine in a steam-hot atmosphere, then you'd be able to violate laws of thermodynamics by running it forever with no input, since you wouldn't need any fuel to boil water in a 105 degree atmosphere.

Generally I'd say the burden of proof is on the guy claiming a perpetual motion machine is possible to explain how, precisely, in more specific terms.

Unless, again by "other factors" you mean "making it justnot a steam engine anymore" by utilizing some other external third party energy source like a river.

I do not believe in perpetual motion at all. If we can control the density of the materials inside a chamber we can control the amount of material that can be turned into steam.

Here 

http://littleshop.physics.colostate.edu/tenthings/WhatCausesPressure.pdf

Pressure is a combination of more than just temperature. that's all i've been trying to tell you this whole time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Please be aware that the content of this thread may be outdated and no longer applicable.

×
  • Create New...