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Everything posted by mathmanican

  1. Unfortunately, @NurdRage deleted the post he made where he explained this, otherwise I'd link it. Liquid beads fall down the tube, and need something that holds lots of mass to transfer heat to them. Temp shift plates ruin the process. So instead, you use a liquid vent as a place holder to absorb heat. Cold beads falling are heated up by this 1 by 1 heat absorber. The rising hot gas is cooled down. Every 0.2 seconds this exchange takes place, and it's extremely efficient. Essentially, the liquid vents are there to hold heat in a specific tile, without transferring it to adjacent tiles. Perfect for a liquid bead boiler. Have you played with bridges (wire, automation, liquid, etc) connecting the sour gas and methane regions, in addition to your plates. You clearly want the two regions to transfer heat. I wonder if adding these bridges would help you shrink the overall height by quite a bit.
  2. Depends on whether or not you play using ONI's actual physics engine, or want to pretend and force yourself to play the game following whatever you believe actual physics is (you can't play the game with actual physics, as there is no ideal gas law for one). Your choice. Play the game the way you want, and keep whatever rules you want to abide by. For me, I'll exploit the crap out of ONI's physics engine as much as I can. (Isn't that what we do in real life, exploit the crap out of the laws of nature to get them to do as much for us as we can.) I assume you meant you would have to place it at the bottom (forgot "except" at the bottom). If you want it at the top, then I see plenty of places to put it along the sides of your silo. In all cases, you'll need a large cooling buffer (next section). You can use a liquid/solid buffer under the rockets (or along the sides of your silo) to absorb the huge amounts of heat. The rockets put out a constant DTU, and you can soak this up to keep temps low enough to enable the bypass pump. What I'm envisioning is a diamond/steel tile room full of >= 1000kg/tile steam to soak up the heat, directly under your rocket or along the side walls. The bypass pump can be placed next to, or under, the buffer room, so that hot gasses have to pass by this buffer (and cool down) to get to the bypass. You can easily handle the temps with petroleum. Steam turbines can keep the entire buffer room under 200C with ease, if you don't want to add extra power and have aquatuners actively cool this room. There are tons of options. If the bypass is too exploity for ya, then freeze everything to solid, steam and CO2. Power is not really an issue (if it is, then build a Crude->NG boiler). Then build a buffer at the top of each silo, lined with steel and filled with anything that you actively try to keep near 0K (or whatever keeps the buffer from solidifying or breaking walls - go with super cold 40000kg/tile hydrogen gas if you want). Freeze everything that tries to leave the silo using these buffers. If any gas tries to escape the top of the the room, it will insta-freeze. Use tempshift plates and doors to extend the reach of the cooling zone so NOTHING makes it out of your chamber. No bypass used here. If you don't like high pressure gasses, then don't use 40000kg/tile. Adjust these ideas to fit your gameplay style. @Zarquan ran an experiment once to see if he could capture ALL the gas coming from space, and he did it with ethanol (not super coolant). If you don't have a surplus of supercoolant, I'm sure you could use PW and keep the buffers full of hydrogen at around -10C (enough to liquefy any steam trying to leave). If you don't want the CO2, then just let it leave. With this approach, you just need a liquid pump at the bottom of your silo to slurp up cool water, or a sweeper arm to move away the ice. No bypass needed. Just keep your entire silo as cold as possible, at all times. I see that you have >=5 tiles of space between rockets, which means you can plop a steam turbine down between them, so you can enable even more aquatuner cooling of a super chilled buffer zone (between turbines). Using @Saturnus's trick for cooling steam turbines in a vacuum, you can put as many of these turbines as you need going up the walls of your silo. I'm sure there are many more ways to do this. I tend to enjoy using fluid mechanic solutions, rather than throwing power at it. There are lots of options. If/when you get one finished, please share. I'm sure others would love to see what you've done as well as me. If you try several options, please share them all.
  3. Bypass pumps might be the key. Build them a tad higher up so the temp is not as hot. They can work fine with 2 gasses. The cost is 10mg per sec of any liquid, basically nothing. Once the gasses are sucked from the chamber you can then manage them. You can build a natural filter with tile placement (such as a co2 lock and hydrogen/steam lock) and ignore thermium pumps. Dispose of the co2 if you dont want it or feed it to slicksters.
  5. My best guess is that the option does not show unless you have the debug file on your computer. Since you recently installed things, I'm guessing you have not yet added the debug file to the correct folder.
  6. Keep the temp of the water between 10 and 25 C, as all 3 types can survive in water at these temps.
  7. A fully automated prison cell personal gym, giving you strength, athletics, and machinery, all set with a 59/1 sec timer to make sure you dupe can do stuff when they need to (or not, if you want the prison cell route).
  8. I made it way to complicated with all the automation. The only automation you see here is a timer. This can be set up as soon as you have valves (minus the timer). Just put 1 load of 200kg of water in the room. The pipes cannot hold it all, you'll never flood the room, no automation needed. You could even use this as a hypothermia chamber that dupes must visit before bed (after sending your dupes into slimelung infested areas - to prevent them from getting slimelung when they wake, provide you're willing to manually toggle the door privileges). As I have it set up above, the timer goes off every 60 seconds, to free the poor dupe for other errands as needed. If nothing is available, they empty the bottle, and then get back to work mopping. So it's a passive strength trainer that can be set and forgot (I have priorities set at 3 and 2 for the emptier and mop command - I reserve 1 for truly despicable tasks).
  9. It's a bypass pump, rather than a bead pump. The key is to set the liquid output less than 10g (so 10mg) so that you don't have to mop up anything and you still get the benefits of swapping gas diagonally upwards. If you want the gym to train your dupes, then shrink your flow rate. You can make the flow extremely small, to keep your dupes there for as long as you want. I only realized this last week, and made a post about it. Maybe you missed it. By having liquid fall off a ledge, rather than directly dumping it for your dupes to mop, you can set the flow as low as you want (almost - gotta make sure liquid keeps falling). Want your dupes to mop for 1/4th of each cycle, and generate enough oxygen for 3 dupes (so you want 1/3 of your colony doing strength training for 1/4th of their time)? Run the numbers to set your flow rate. Then let your dupes mop it up. You can sense how long they mopped for, and you can control the rate at which they get new liquid. Or disconnect the two ideas completely. Oxygen product is one thing. Strength training is another. If you are trying to optimize PO2 production vis mopping, one dupe can basically mop for the entire colony (at 140kg/s). Do this once every few hundred cycles, and you won't even add an attribute increase. I added a new post to the link above with an example.
  10. Here is a prototype of a gym. With a minipump, this could be one tile thinner. As seen right now, you can add two ladder tiles left of the bottle emptier, and a pneumatic door above, as an alternate access point, so you can build dungeons the dupes have to crawl down into to sweep for ages, and build them all side by side (role playing torture chambers). Enable a small room for one dupe, lock out others. This makes it so dupes don't come in to constantly move the mopped water to the emptier. We only want that done once a day (at the start of the start of the shift, by putting high priority on the emptier). Use regular water (no offgassing to deal with), Set the flow pretty low (300g/s = 180kg/cycle). This saves power. The flow can probably be much less (same minimum needed for a waterfall to function, so 116 will work) . Have the dupe pick up their mess when they are done (if you want to stop the mopping with a timer or something), or before they start (letting the shift end break the mop command). Since they can't generate more than 180kg/cycle, they can empty an entire cycle's worth of mopping at the start of the next time they mop. Limit the total amount of water in the room, so that you can never flood the mopping tile. Or alternately, use a liquid shutoff to make sure that water won't keep on coming if no one is there mopping (a hydrosensor set to something small). You can also use the amount of total water in the room to limit the length of time they mop. Place a liquid element sensor right before the flow valve, that shuts the pnemuatic door above the mop command when there is no liquid in the pipe. This preserves the mop command. I figured since @nakomaru has already designated bubbles as having the mopping job, we might as well continue in that fashion. Here is a two dupe version (same 116g/s valve setting). (Edit: This doesn't work, as the senor detects water bottles.... You can still enable two dupes to enter and mop though.) This one unfortunately can result in more dupes inside. Once two dupes are mopping, the right door locks. Dupes can leave the room going upwards. However, there is a brief moment where one dupe may enter to use the bottle emptier, and then they get stuck there in short loop (what does using the bottle emptier train? - bonus extra gym.)
  11. Run the output of the AND gate into the input of an OR gate and the NOT gate you chose. Then connect these together. Sounds like you're making an edge detector. Search the forums for lots of posts on this. Use google's site: option for getting better search results. You'll find quite a few.
  12. You have connected the head and tail of a not gate. This is what causes the problem. The output of the AND gate is still red (false), but green overrides any red signal, so the green from the front of the and gate comes back. This all happens very fast. You can achieve the same thin by connecting the input and output of a NOT gate anywhere. As long as no GREEN signal shows up in the line, you will get lots of flicker. It's been like this since the gates were introduced.
  13. This might come in handy. If I needed to move one tile of bleach stone or slime out of a region, I would either dig out everything first before trying to get to vacuum, and then build walls over the entire region and then dig back in, or surround the single tile on all 4 sides, corner dig it, then use !!Priority to move it far away (that way it won't drop or off gas in transport). After this, I'd just build a solid tile in the recently dug out spot to destroy any off gassing. If I can't get access from above to corner grab it, then I'd do exactly what @Zarquan said. The petro approach will still require a small room. Otherwise, there is a small window, right after digging, where the stuff will offgas before being submerged. If you don't want to loose vacuum, then make a small room (again suggested by @Zarquan.
  14. It can be as simple as dropping water off a ledge at the edge of a wall. No need to complicate it much more than that. At the cost of 1 tile of water every 5+ cycles, you could probably just leave the water there indefinitely, or have it ready to be consumed for research. Now I just need a nice way to interrupt the mopping job with automation, so that a dupe doesn't get stuck there for the rest of their shift. I have a 59/1 sec timer on my manual generators, so that my dupes always go there rather than idling. Something like that would be nice with mopping.
  15. Have we been thinking about strength training gyms all wrong? While playing Oceania, I ran across some groups of mop commands that persisted, and kept my dupes quite busy indefinitely. Seemed like a perfect time to build a new strength training gym that won't hog your liquid resources, and can be scaled easily to accommodate any number of weak dupes.First a picture (oh, and note that the liquid is filtered at a minuscule 300g/s, could be lower). Ignore the fact that these dupes don't know how to social distance (they are in atmosuits, so maybe they are following local guidelines). Check your dupes local guidelines to verify if they need atmosuits or not to do this. Also ignore all the ladders, I've been trying a new way to mass clear regions of the asteroid by building rows of ladders every other row (it's pretty quick), and doesn't affect lag on my slow 8GB RAM machine. Runs counter to the monopathing arguments others make, but it makes clearing regions quick and efficient without adding lag. Here are a few key mopping facts (maybe new idea for the gym builders out there). Dropping liquid directly on your dupes from a vent means that liquid only arrives once every 5 ticks. This means that directly venting liquids onto your dupes will result in the mop command disappearing unless you make elaborate designs. Dropping liquid on a tile, and then letting it flow sideways to drip down to your dupes, means that liquid arrives every tick. The mop command never completes. When liquid drops onto a tile every tick, I've found I can preserve the mop command on the tile itself, and the adjacent tiles (left and right). So each drip down allows me to keep 3 mop commands active. Sometimes even tiles that are 2 left and right of the drip (for a total of 5 tiles) keep their mop commands, but these edge cases eventually disappeared (a few cycles in). The middle three never vanished. Note again that at 300g/s, the power cost to pump is less than 8W. I'm sure the total flow could be reduced even more, but I was fine with 8W. It takes a little over 5.5 cycles to drain one entire 1000kg block of water. You could set a cycle timer on a under the bottle emptier and allow people to drain the bottles every few cycles (saving gobs of dupe time). The above is not at all optimized. I look forward to seeing improvements. Basically, this allows us to build a strength training gym, that won't hog your liquid resources, requires almost no tech, and zero refined metal. Have fun.
  16. Yep. You can also use @Cairath's excellent mod, Wounded Go To Med Bed. Or you can wait till you find some ruins, and hope you get the regenerative trait.
  17. Haven't tested to see what lets them out. That could easily be it. Should be easy to test in sandbox. I'll let someone else post their results.
  18. They will escape out the upper left corner. You've been warned. Two tiles and 3 doors works fine too. All 8 squares must be blocked.
  19. Yep. One metal tile and 4 pneumatic doors will lock them in a 1 by 1 room. Free food forever.
  20. Depends entirely on what you plan to do. If state changes could happen in your setup, because something sits around for too long, then it is a problem. Realizing that one packet might be sitting somewhere for a long time is the key. Just design with that in mind.
  21. This junction is your main problem. Liquid come from the right and from above. You are correct that the liquid arrives at both green outflow valves at the same time, but it is impossible for both to flow into the junction at the same time. Your animation shows that the section from the aquatuner output got chosen first (have no clue why, but that's what your animation show), followed by the flow from above. So flow at this junction comes from (1) right (2) top (3) right (4) top (5) right. Each time flow comes from the "top", the aquatuner cannot accept a new packet, and so any new incoming liquid will go up the bypass. This will occur on the 4th bead of liquid (and 6th, 8th, 10th, etc., if you have more. To explore it more, open a new game, enable sandbox, fill some pipe segments with different liquids (so it is easy to see the different liquids), and then watch them go. I built one with 6 packest, and added the aquatuner. The petro and crude swap spots each time through. This swapping happens because of the 1 sec to turn on issue, as well as the junction giving preference to the flow coming from the aquatuner at the right. The salt water and water always go up (never cool off). This is because of the alternating pipe flow issue at your junction. No liquid remains in the tuner on each pass (I learned something), though this could be because the liquid never got cold enough, not sure. With only 5 segments of liquid, the first two swap spots as well, and the 4th always goes up (never cooling off). The junction I started with is your main problem. Stuff eventually got stuck, as soon as the thermosensor started activating off and on. (I dropped the temp of the warming bath where the radiant pipes are). Eventually the salt water made it out, but the brine (being a single packet) never gets to go through the tuner. After a bit, the crude and petro (having swapped a bunch of times with the salt) pulled ahead and became a group of 2, with the other three liquids bunching up. I'm guessing all kinds of weird things will happen if I let this run several cycles, till eventually all 5 liquids are separated by 1 blank spot. Here's where at I'm at after a while. Note that neither the brine nor salt water will ever trigger the tuner to go on, as you have to have two consecutive blobs to trigger it. Eventually, the leading 3 blobs separated, and now the two in the lead have no chance EVER to combine with the last 3. Seems janky. The junction is the problem.
  22. Looks like there are two times that the liquid heads up, instead of through the aquatuner. The first bead that heads up is because it takes 1 sec for the aquatuner to turn on. Also, there is already something in the tuner, as your sensor turned the tuner off. So the leading bead will not get cooled. The second bead that heads up is because you have two pipes connecting without a bridge on the output side. As such, the aquatuner output has to pause to allow a bead to come down, hence it gets backed up for a second. Good news, the leading bead changes each time. Bad news, the second to last bead never swaps location with any other bead, so it will never get cooled.